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Unapologetically Authentic: Jean Tien's Journey to Redefine Success

Are you on the traditional path to success but feeling unsatisfied? Do you find yourself striving for external validation, only to realize that true fulfillment eludes you? In this episode of Seek Go Create, Jean Tien shares her transformative journey from corporate burnout to redefining success on her own terms. Join Tim Winders as he delves into Jean's insightful approach to challenging societal norms, seeking authenticity, and finding true fulfillment in the workplace and beyond. If you're ready to shift your mindset and create your own definition of success, this episode is a must-listen.

"Internal fulfillment trumps external success any day." - Jean Tien

Access all show and episode resources HERE

About Our Guest:

Jean Tien is a corporate professional, coach, and creator of the SUCCESS method. Her journey from navigating the challenges of the corporate world to redefining success on her own terms has led her to guide others in finding fulfillment and authenticity in their professional lives. Through her podcast and coaching, Jean empowers individuals to prioritize self-credence and redefine their metrics of success in alignment with their personal values.

Reasons to Listen:

1. Gain insights on redefining success in your career by prioritizing self-validation over external expectations.

2. Discover the transformative "SUCCESS" method, designed to empower individuals to define and create their own success story.

3. Explore the challenges and benefits of diversifying your approach to success in the corporate world through personal experiences and practical advice.

Episode Resources & Action Steps:

Resources:

1. Jean Tien's Website: Visit Jean Tien's website for coaching and resources related to redefining success and authenticity in professional life.

2. Being Unapologetically Authentic with Jean Tien podcast.

Action Steps:

1. Define Your Success: Take time to reflect and define your own metrics of success, not solely based on societal expectations. Consider what truly fulfills you and align your goals accordingly.

2. Seek Third-Party Perspective: Seek out a reliable coach or mentor to gain a fresh perspective on your career endeavors and personal growth. Embrace the value of seeking help and advice from trusted sources.

3. Stay True to Your Values: Identify and stay committed to your core values amidst societal pressures and external influences. Embrace the courage to prioritize personal joy and authenticity through your journey to success.

These resources and action steps provide practical avenues for listeners to navigate their professional journeys with authenticity and redefine success on their own terms.

Resources for Leaders from Tim Winders & SGC:

🔹 Unlock Your Potential Today!

  • 🎙 Coaching with Tim: Elevate your leadership and align your work with your faith. Learn More
  • 📚 "Coach: A Story of Success Redefined": A transformative read that will challenge your views on success. Grab Your Copy
  • 📝 Faith Driven Leader Quiz: Discover how well you're aligning faith and work with our quick quiz. Take the Quiz

Key Lessons:

1. Redefine success on your own terms: Jean Tien's journey highlights the importance of defining success based on personal values and fulfillment rather than societal expectations or external markers.

2. Shift your mindset and actions: Jean's transformation came from prioritizing self-credence and changing her approach to work, emphasizing the need to stop seeking validation from others and start giving oneself credit.

3. Seek the truth as the first step to success: Jean Tien's choice of 'seek' as the most important word underscores the significance of seeking truth and authenticity in defining and creating success.

4. Embrace discomfort and define your path: Both Jean and Tim advocate for the courage to break free from societal norms and pursue joy and fulfillment, emphasizing the need to embrace discomfort and define one's own path.

5. Recognize and celebrate achieved successes: The SUCCESS method encourages individuals to recognize their achieved successes, set new goals, and stay true to their values as they define their own metrics of success.

Episode Highlights:

00:00 Struggles are unique, but seeking belonging is universal.

06:50 Executive coach emphasizes importance of hope.

10:00 Unable to please, so I stopped trying.

11:47 Shifted mindset led to changed actions and confidence.

16:40 General message: self-reflection and starting afresh.

19:15 Understanding reactions to Bob and their triggers.

21:17 Questioning past experiences and beliefs, and adapting.

24:22 Seek outside perspective, but trust own judgment.

28:42 Individual experiences shape perceptions and reactions, creating differences.

33:16 Opportunity for growth and self-reflection in career.

35:43 Money can go away, rethinking success.

39:22 Define your success to guide your journey.

41:13 Enjoying Vegas, but prefer it in thought.

46:38 Courage needed to grow beyond comfort zone.

47:42 Embrace unconventional choices for personal joy and fulfillment.

53:14 Identify, create, and pursue your goals fearlessly.

55:24 Podcast discusses anti-hustle culture, seeks feedback.

Thank you for listening to Seek Go Create!

Our podcast is dedicated to empowering Christian leaders, entrepreneurs, and individuals looking to redefine success in their personal and professional lives. Through in-depth interviews, personal anecdotes, and expert advice, we offer valuable insights and actionable strategies for achieving your goals and living a life of purpose and fulfillment.

If you enjoyed this episode and found it helpful, we encourage you to subscribe to or follow Seek Go Create on your favorite podcast platform, including Google Podcasts, Apple Podcasts, and Spotify. By subscribing, you'll never miss an episode and can stay up-to-date on the latest insights and strategies for success.

Additionally, please share this episode or what you’ve learned today with your friends, family, and colleagues on your favorite social media platform. By sharing our podcast, you can help us reach more people who are looking to align their faith with their work and lead with purpose.

If you love our podcast and find it valuable, please consider leaving us a 5-star rating and review on your preferred podcast platform. Your review can help us reach more people and inspire them to redefine success in their own lives.

For more updates and episodes, visit our website or follow us on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, Twitter, TikTok and YouTube. We appreciate your support and look forward to helping you achieve your goals and create a life of purpose and fulfillment.

Be all that you were created to be!


Mentioned in this episode:

Unlock Your Leadership Potential with Tim Winders Executive Coaching

Feeling stuck is frustrating, but the path to a breakthrough may be just a discovery call away. Tim Winders, your trusted podcast host, offers transformative coaching sessions that integrate strategic thinking, relationship-building skills, and faith-based principles. Whether you're aiming for revenue growth or more intangible leadership qualities, Tim's coaching approach has a proven history of success. Schedule a free discovery call today and experience the transformation for yourself.

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Transcript
Jean Tien:

And so we keep evolving and so I think it's so

Jean Tien:

important to remind everyone that,

Jean Tien:

Wherever they are.

Jean Tien:

It's always important to keep reevaluating your definition of success.

Jean Tien:

Does this really hold true for me today?

Tim Winders:

What If the key to True

Tim Winders:

success is giving ourselves

Tim Winders:

permission to break free from conventional molds and embrace our unique identity?

Tim Winders:

Welcome to Seek Go Create, where today we're joined by Gene tn, creator of

Tim Winders:

the Success Method, and a beacon for those seeking to redefine success on

Tim Winders:

their own terms from the structured path of an Ivy League education and corporate

Tim Winders:

career to a journey of self-discovery.

Tim Winders:

Empowerment Jean's story is a testament to the true

Tim Winders:

transformative power of authenticity.

Tim Winders:

She's hit her.

Tim Winders:

Share how breaking free from traditional expectations can lead to

Tim Winders:

a more fulfilling and impactful life.

Tim Winders:

Jean, welcome to Seek Go Create.

Jean Tien:

Hi, Tim.

Jean Tien:

Thank you so much for having me.

Jean Tien:

I'm so excited to be here and to have this conversation.

Tim Winders:

I'm glad for you too.

Tim Winders:

you're, what you talk about is such a great match for us here at Seek,

Tim Winders:

go create, redefining success.

Tim Winders:

And so let me dive in.

Tim Winders:

My first question, when people ask you what you do, what do you tell them?

Tim Winders:

I.

Jean Tien:

I am a corporate nine to fiver on the path to redefining what it

Jean Tien:

means to be a successful, professional.

Jean Tien:

And so what I mean by that, if I may, is that currently I

Jean Tien:

still have my nine to five job.

Jean Tien:

it's what keeps me going.

Jean Tien:

And at the same time, I'm using all of the experiences that I've gained

Jean Tien:

in corporate to look for the gaps, the opportunities to be able to support

Jean Tien:

others as they're looking for their way in terms of redefining success as well.

Jean Tien:

And by creating the programs that I've created by working with the

Jean Tien:

individuals I've created, it's really to shift the whole paradigm

Jean Tien:

of what it means to have that job.

Tim Winders:

So what are some of the struggles that we can have, and this

Tim Winders:

is a, it's sort of a jokey question, but, hey, someone's got a good job.

Tim Winders:

What more, what more would they want?

Tim Winders:

You know,

Tim Winders:

. Jean Tien: Um, I, you know, I think everybody has their own struggles.

Tim Winders:

And it's funny, I was just coming out of coffee with a friend of

Tim Winders:

mine and we were just having this conversation where she thinks that

Tim Winders:

nobody else is having similar problems.

Tim Winders:

And I told her she's right.

Tim Winders:

Nobody else is having similar problems because we all have

Tim Winders:

our unique set of problems.

Tim Winders:

But I think overall the same struggle happens for all of us, which is we're

Tim Winders:

looking for our place on this planet where we fit in, where we can really

Tim Winders:

not just fit in, but where we belong and how we get that sense of belonging.

Tim Winders:

And I think, when you are in that corporate nine to five, I think many

Tim Winders:

of us have worked really hard to get to where we are today, only to realize that

Tim Winders:

It's not where we wanted to be in the first place.

Tim Winders:

It's not what we thought it would be.

Tim Winders:

And then we've worked so hard, we've invested so much time

Tim Winders:

and energy and resources.

Tim Winders:

Now the question is, okay, I feel stuck.

Tim Winders:

And it's that sense of stuckness that keeps people, I wanna say in

Tim Winders:

the same place, because they're either afraid of taking the step

Tim Winders:

forward, they're afraid of pivoting.

Tim Winders:

our favorite word from Covid is pivoting, they're afraid of making the

Tim Winders:

wrong decision or somehow ruining all of the hard work that they've done.

Tim Winders:

And I could say that none of that is a reality.

Tim Winders:

All of that is fear-based.

Tim Winders:

And it's most likely, it's most likely what we're all dealing with

Tim Winders:

in some shape or form, manifesting itself in some way or another.

Tim Winders:

I am kind of with you that, that word pivot.

Tim Winders:

I think we're starting to overuse it now.

Tim Winders:

Of course we do that.

Tim Winders:

We all, I was doing an interview the other day and I used the

Tim Winders:

word unpack and I hated myself.

Tim Winders:

I'm going, darn.

Tim Winders:

I said I, I'm, a few years ago, it's like everything, we're

Tim Winders:

gonna unpack, unpack, we're gonna unpack, and now I, I think pivot.

Tim Winders:

But I, I do think it's a good word for the topic.

Tim Winders:

I can't think, I was at a bible study with a group of people, business

Tim Winders:

owners, entrepreneurs the other day, and we were using the word transition,

Jean Tien:

Mm.

Tim Winders:

is pivot We, it's the same thing, but, gene, the I, I

Tim Winders:

remember It's been 30 plus years.

Tim Winders:

I'm dating myself a little bit.

Tim Winders:

I remember a term that I heard a lot that was something to the effect of, I may

Tim Winders:

butcher this, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna mention it and you could let us know how

Tim Winders:

it ties in where people would say they've been climbing the corporate ladder only

Tim Winders:

to find out that the ladder is leaned up against the wrong structure or whatever.

Tim Winders:

I, is that part of this?

Tim Winders:

Is that statement still hold true today?

Jean Tien:

I think it still holds true, and I think it holds true for many of us.

Jean Tien:

I think most of us climb the corporate ladder because we were told

Jean Tien:

that's what we're supposed to do.

Jean Tien:

We were told that's what being a good citizen is, right?

Jean Tien:

Like the higher you climb, the better that you are, and we do what we're told.

Jean Tien:

And then when we get to towards the top of the ladder, I think

Jean Tien:

many of us start to look up at that point because we can, right?

Jean Tien:

Because we're trying to enjoy the successes that we've achieved.

Jean Tien:

And then we realize that oh, wait, where?

Jean Tien:

and I think so many of us ask this question, it's okay, now where am I?

Jean Tien:

And that's the question that then people aren't really sure how to answer.

Jean Tien:

And so that's where I come in.

Tim Winders:

Are, are a lot of people, this is gonna sound cynical, but the

Tim Winders:

audience is gonna be okay with it.

Tim Winders:

'cause they know that every once in a while, Tim goes full on cynical.

Jean Tien:

It's okay.

Tim Winders:

we in a culture where people are just disgruntled and unhappy and

Tim Winders:

there's, in some ways not a lot that we can do to make some people happy?

Jean Tien:

I think that's such a good question because what it

Jean Tien:

brings to mind is, yes but no.

Jean Tien:

I think that they're potentially disgruntled and unhappy because they're

Jean Tien:

not willing . To settle anymore, or they're just not necessarily,

Jean Tien:

comfortable with where they are.

Jean Tien:

But then, the question that comes to mind is, how did they get here?

Jean Tien:

And then so to say that we're in a situation that they're just disgruntled

Jean Tien:

and unhappy suggests that there's no path out or that there's no solution out.

Jean Tien:

And I definitely think that there is a path out.

Jean Tien:

and I think so many of us suffer unnecessarily.

Tim Winders:

Hmm.

Tim Winders:

One of the things that's interesting, I love what you said there, is as I interact

Tim Winders:

with a lot of people, as an executive coach and I get to talk to people with

Tim Winders:

what I do here and in ministry and things like that, I recognize that in the

Tim Winders:

world there's a lot of what I call hope

Tim Winders:

hopelessness.

Jean Tien:

Mm.

Tim Winders:

of hope and hope's a weird word because it sounds a little fru,

Tim Winders:

but yet, I think we all need to have a certain degree of hope, hope, hope that

Tim Winders:

we can improve, do better hope that we're not gonna show up at work and somebody's

Tim Winders:

gonna fuss at us and yell at us.

Tim Winders:

And so one of the most interesting things when I do, when I do research on people,

Tim Winders:

I shared this right before we click record, the reason I was so attracted

Tim Winders:

to what you do, and sometimes I don't remind myself of this until a couple days

Tim Winders:

before the actual conversation is I think we booked this way back when I'm like

Tim Winders:

going, now I remember why I'm talking to Jean

Jean Tien:

Okay.

Tim Winders:

because of the success method, and we'll talk about

Tim Winders:

that in just a moment and things

Tim Winders:

like that.

Tim Winders:

but.

Tim Winders:

What I was really reminded of, Jean, I went to your website and I listened

Tim Winders:

to, it looked like a TED talk, but I guess you were speaking in front of

Tim Winders:

a group, like a five minute thing.

Tim Winders:

And it was basically you talking about walking in the

Tim Winders:

door, your first day of work.

Tim Winders:

Now, those that are listening, they can't see it, but behind you,

Tim Winders:

there are some degrees on the wall

Jean Tien:

Yes.

Tim Winders:

and you've, I mentioned it in the intro.

Tim Winders:

You've been through Ivy League, you appear to have done all the right things.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

What caused the issue when you walked in the door and like

Tim Winders:

right out of the gate, it seemed like things went the wrong direction For you,

Jean Tien:

Oh yeah.

Tim Winders:

your first go share, share whatever that you'd like.

Tim Winders:

'cause I think it's really helpful for people to know how you redefined

Tim Winders:

success early on in your career.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

Absolutely.

Jean Tien:

So I, like you said, I literally did everything by the book.

Jean Tien:

I studied really hard.

Jean Tien:

I got the good grades.

Jean Tien:

I got into the Ivy League University, graduated, and I got

Jean Tien:

a job in finance because that's what all my friends were doing.

Jean Tien:

That's what we were supposed to do to make the money.

Jean Tien:

and then the day that I walked into the door of my first job, which, I really,

Jean Tien:

I was told once when I was complaining.

Jean Tien:

or venting, it's a nicer word to use.

Jean Tien:

When I was venting to a coworker, , you know how I'm not happy at work.

Jean Tien:

And I remember very specifically, he's there are so many people who

Jean Tien:

would kill to have your job right now.

Jean Tien:

And it's not like I was a top investment banker or anything.

Jean Tien:

I just had a position in a really good place of employment with a top brand name.

Jean Tien:

But I remember going into that job and I really wanted to do my best.

Jean Tien:

And so I put so much pressure on myself to do it.

Jean Tien:

And what I realized was like I had no idea what I was doing.

Jean Tien:

I had no idea like what I was even supposed to do.

Jean Tien:

And I just remember getting yelled at by my boss,. Often and like

Jean Tien:

the snarkiness and the comments.

Jean Tien:

And no matter what I did, it just never felt like it was enough.

Jean Tien:

And then I couldn't ask the right questions.

Jean Tien:

I couldn't even do the right things.

Jean Tien:

And whenever I try to do anything extra, I wasn't even getting any of

Jean Tien:

those, brownie points or anything.

Jean Tien:

I would just still be left to the side.

Jean Tien:

And so it was like time after time and it was just like, you know what?

Jean Tien:

I'm so sick of.

Jean Tien:

Doing what I'm supposed to do and not getting anywhere and getting beat

Jean Tien:

up like over and over again because I'm trying to make everybody happy.

Jean Tien:

But it was at my expense.

Jean Tien:

And then so there was just that moment of forget this, I am not doing this anymore.

Jean Tien:

I can't it because I'm doing it according to what everybody tells

Jean Tien:

me I should do, and it's still not getting me anywhere where I need to go.

Jean Tien:

So let me just try to do this my way.

Jean Tien:

let me do what I think is the right way.

Jean Tien:

And of course we have to do it within the parameters of

Jean Tien:

the environment that we're in.

Jean Tien:

So let me try my way, let me try not to worry about what others are saying.

Jean Tien:

Let me just go forward and have no regrets, because if this time

Jean Tien:

it doesn't work, then at least I could say . I have no regrets.

Jean Tien:

And it was interesting enough when I started to do that, my career just

Jean Tien:

shifted entirely, like entirely.

Jean Tien:

And then, so then people started coming to me and I started becoming the

Jean Tien:

subject matter expert, which honestly built my career and my confidence.

Jean Tien:

And it's still what I do today in terms of how I operate at work.

Tim Winders:

So, gosh, there's like three questions floating through my head.

Tim Winders:

Let me start with this one.

Tim Winders:

I'm guessing you didn't change your actions as much as your mindset shifted.

Tim Winders:

Would that be a correct assumption and talk more about

Tim Winders:

it if that, whichever direction.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

So I think it would be hard to say that I, so I think they're very much

Jean Tien:

linked in my personal experience.

Jean Tien:

I think they're linked, right?

Jean Tien:

So if I couldn't change my mindset, then I think my actions would've repeated itself.

Jean Tien:

I think in terms of what I didn't change was what I knew.

Jean Tien:

I knew what I knew, but what I changed in terms of mindset was to stop

Jean Tien:

giving everybody else credence and to start giving myself credence, right?

Jean Tien:

To start crediting myself with what I knew and stepping into that.

Jean Tien:

And from that perspective, that mindset shift actually

Jean Tien:

shifted the actions that I took.

Jean Tien:

quite frankly, I stopped kissing everybody's butt.

Jean Tien:

And I stopped trying to please everybody because I knew, I recognized, if they

Jean Tien:

don't understand what I'm saying, I can't really do much other than to try to

Jean Tien:

help them to understand what I'm saying.

Jean Tien:

But I'm no longer going to say, oh my gosh, you're so right.

Jean Tien:

And then, and put myself behind it.

Jean Tien:

but I would have to give myself a chance, right?

Jean Tien:

Not mute myself, not do all the things that put me second

Jean Tien:

and everybody else first.

Jean Tien:

Especially when I knew within me that they didn't really know what

Jean Tien:

they were talking about, right?

Jean Tien:

Like that they were wrong, quite frankly, if I wanna be honest.

Tim Winders:

And this was a process too.

Tim Winders:

I think in the video that I watched, I think you went through

Tim Winders:

three, four, or five positions

Jean Tien:

Oh, yes.

Tim Winders:

so it wasn't like, two weeks in you figured this out and it's like,

Tim Winders:

oh, jean's good now, she's on her way.

Tim Winders:

It was a process,

Tim Winders:

correct.

Jean Tien:

Oh my gosh.

Jean Tien:

It was a very long and extended process.

Jean Tien:

It took multiple jobs like shifting because I think so many of us go

Jean Tien:

from one job to another, hoping that our problems would go away, right?

Jean Tien:

oh, I hate my manager.

Jean Tien:

He's such a jerk.

Jean Tien:

Okay, let me go find another job.

Jean Tien:

But guess what?

Jean Tien:

Your next job, your managers or somebody else is gonna be such a jerk too.

Jean Tien:

And so you're gonna have the same problem.

Jean Tien:

And then so when I started to recognize that, I'm like, oh wait, you can't

Jean Tien:

really run away from your problems . As much as we like to think that like

Jean Tien:

it's the other person's fault, what I've honestly realized over time

Jean Tien:

is that . It's really us and how we see things and our perspectives and

Jean Tien:

when we get mad at something, it's not necessarily the other person.

Jean Tien:

Yeah, the other person can be a jerk.

Jean Tien:

They can be a backs stabber, they can be many things, but how

Jean Tien:

we react to it, it's all on us.

Jean Tien:

Right?

Jean Tien:

Whether or not we can tolerate it, how we respond to it, it's all within us.

Jean Tien:

And so we can either get, stuck with it or if we shift the way that we

Jean Tien:

see things, we can start to turn it around and turn the situation around.

Jean Tien:

And quite frankly, once we start to do that, that's when others come to us,

Jean Tien:

that's when others start to trust us because they know that they can, have

Jean Tien:

this rapport with us and still get to a place of common good is what I'll call it.

Tim Winders:

Jean did you feel this is, this is actually the beginning

Tim Winders:

of a question that I'm, I've got a couple questions to follow up.

Tim Winders:

Did you feel, and I'm looking at the diplomas behind you here, did you feel

Tim Winders:

somewhat entitled a certain path or a certain level of respect or honor?

Tim Winders:

I don't even know what kind of words we

Jean Tien:

Oh yeah.

Tim Winders:

because

Tim Winders:

of the hard work you had done that you would step in and all would be great.

Tim Winders:

so was entitlement part of it?

Jean Tien:

I think there's a level of entitlement that comes with it

Jean Tien:

and it's an entitlement that I.

Jean Tien:

I don't, I don't wanna overlook it, but I will say, I think we're fed it, right?

Jean Tien:

oh, we're fed this story.

Jean Tien:

That if you go to a good university and you do all the work you're supposed

Jean Tien:

to and you behave the way you're supposed to, then when you enter the

Jean Tien:

workplace, you'll get X, Y, and Z.

Jean Tien:

And when you don't get X, Y, and Z, you're just like, wait, what?

Jean Tien:

I was supposed to get X, Y, and Z People were supposed to respect me, right?

Jean Tien:

Because I came from here and I have this, and I meet the qualifications that they

Jean Tien:

asked for so they would respect me, right?

Jean Tien:

And at the end of the day, that that has nothing to do with it.

Jean Tien:

You earn people's respect through the work that you do, through

Jean Tien:

your interactions that you have.

Jean Tien:

And it's never really about, and this is something that you know as a mom too.

Jean Tien:

'cause my teenager, not my teenager, my son is turning to be a teenager next year.

Jean Tien:

This is something that we struggle with.

Jean Tien:

I think even more now than we did in the past, in the sense that.

Jean Tien:

Your degree, your piece of paper, your resume never guarantees you success.

Jean Tien:

It never guarantees you to work with professionals.

Jean Tien:

Only.

Jean Tien:

We work in an environment where there's so much diversity in the backgrounds

Jean Tien:

of everyone that's around us, that if we don't know how to handle

Jean Tien:

ourselves we'll never know how to work with the others around us as well.

Tim Winders:

and I love the general message is all about looking at

Tim Winders:

ourselves because what I, what I heard you say was basically you had all your

Tim Winders:

degrees and all that kind of stuff, and that got you to the starting line

Tim Winders:

that got you to the place to start.

Tim Winders:

And I was reminded of a

Tim Winders:

weird story.

Tim Winders:

I'm gonna share this and then, and then I think it opens up

Tim Winders:

the door for us to discuss.

Tim Winders:

More.

Tim Winders:

Years ago I was having my hair cut with a friend and she was standing

Tim Winders:

there with scissors in her hand, cutting my hair, looking in the

Tim Winders:

mirror, and she commented, my wife and I just celebrated an anniversary.

Tim Winders:

And her comment was, I really do wish.

Tim Winders:

I had a marriage like you and my wife Gloria, and she was at the time, and I'm

Tim Winders:

not judging this, this is an observation.

Tim Winders:

She was on her third husband and, and she was complaining about each one of them.

Tim Winders:

Okay?

Tim Winders:

And, and I should not have said this with someone who's standing

Tim Winders:

there with scissors in her hand.

Tim Winders:

And she was looking in the mirror, and usually when she cut hair,

Tim Winders:

she looked in the mirror herself.

Tim Winders:

She didn't look at me, which gives you a little

Tim Winders:

clue as to her.

Tim Winders:

And I made the statement, I said, maybe not them, maybe it's you.

Jean Tien:

Hmm.

Tim Winders:

Which is a pretty harsh statement.

Tim Winders:

And again, she's standing there with scissors in her hand.

Tim Winders:

And my hair's about half cut.

Tim Winders:

but I think the reality of it is, I'm hearing you say, I.

Tim Winders:

Maybe it's not.

Tim Winders:

I think the manager that you first used, you called him Bob in the video I watched.

Tim Winders:

Maybe it's not the five bobs that you worked for that were all jerks.

Tim Winders:

Maybe it's Gene.

Tim Winders:

So how do we start, if you're saying it's us, how do we start looking at

Tim Winders:

how we adjust instead of blaming I, I don't blaming whatever, being a

Tim Winders:

victim, we could use a lot of words, but

Tim Winders:

how how do we start that process to realize,

Tim Winders:

first of all, if they're listening in here, that's probably one of

Tim Winders:

the starts, but how do they start?

Jean Tien:

Yes.

Jean Tien:

yeah, I call them Bob.

Jean Tien:

and the reason I call them Bob is because what it represents is Bo block of beliefs.

Jean Tien:

And so it's all about our beliefs and our beliefs filter.

Jean Tien:

. our reality, right?

Jean Tien:

Our beliefs are the way that we perceive what we're going through.

Jean Tien:

And and by no means am I saying that Bob was faultless and that Bob is perfect.

Jean Tien:

I think if you had a certain problem with Bob, then 10 other people probably

Jean Tien:

have the same problem with Bob.

Jean Tien:

Now the problem now not the problem, but the reality of the

Jean Tien:

matter is that all 10 people won't have the same reaction to Bob.

Jean Tien:

So why is it that you have this reaction to Bob?

Jean Tien:

Why did, was it that I had this reaction to Bob, where I let Bob, impact my

Jean Tien:

emotions every day, where I went home crying, where I literally gave myself

Jean Tien:

insomnia because of all the stress and anxiety that I put on myself.

Jean Tien:

thinking that it was Bob who put this on me, right?

Jean Tien:

and so I think that's a great question in terms of how do we start identifying

Jean Tien:

why this is bothering us so much, or why Bob is bothering us so much.

Jean Tien:

I think it's really asking ourselves the questions that

Jean Tien:

we're too afraid to ask ourselves.

Jean Tien:

And if Bob did something really mean then, for lack of a better word, we'll

Jean Tien:

say mean because it's very broad umbrella.

Jean Tien:

Then why are we so mad?

Jean Tien:

Like, why are we so mad that Bob did this right?

Jean Tien:

And, okay, so Bob shouldn't have done it.

Jean Tien:

Agreed.

Jean Tien:

But then why did it this generate this level or trigger this

Jean Tien:

level of reaction within us?

Jean Tien:

What is it bringing up?

Jean Tien:

And a lot of the times it's something to do with our own fears, our own past

Jean Tien:

experience, what we think it means.

Jean Tien:

A lot of times it's a disrespect type of thing, I think amongst all of us.

Jean Tien:

if I was respected, Bob wouldn't do this.

Jean Tien:

And maybe not.

Jean Tien:

I don't know.

Jean Tien:

Bob is Bob, right?

Jean Tien:

we don't know.

Jean Tien:

But when we feel disrespected, when we're afraid that this means we're gonna

Jean Tien:

get fired or whatever the situation is, it generates this reaction.

Jean Tien:

And then so when we start to look at where this trigger comes from.

Jean Tien:

What had triggered this type of reaction, what our main fears are, or

Jean Tien:

what the beliefs are on this thing.

Jean Tien:

Then we can really start to dissect it and then we can start to determine,

Jean Tien:

okay, does one plus one always equal two?

Jean Tien:

Right.

Jean Tien:

So in the past, let's say, I'll use my childhood.

Jean Tien:

If I did something wrong, I always got in trouble and the punishment

Jean Tien:

usually wasn't very, enjoyable.

Jean Tien:

, I'll put it like that, right?

Jean Tien:

And then, okay, if I make a mistake and Bob gets really mad, does that

Jean Tien:

mean that the punishment won't be, that enjoyable, will be the same level of

Jean Tien:

pain or hurt or frustration or sadness?

Jean Tien:

And it's usually no, because we're not at the same place anymore.

Jean Tien:

But in recognizing this and in seeing this, we can then start to

Jean Tien:

take it apart and say, it's, is it really true for us to today?

Jean Tien:

Or, is it something different now?

Jean Tien:

And then what if it's something different?

Jean Tien:

How can we overcome the beliefs that we have, the experiences that we

Jean Tien:

have to start to respond differently to the same type of triggers that

Jean Tien:

we have, which is always going to be in a form of Bob somewhere.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

And the other thing that I think many of us forget is that Bob could be

Tim Winders:

going through the same process himself.

Jean Tien:

Oh yes,

Tim Winders:

He may not wanna be where he's at.

Tim Winders:

He may think that he deserves some different role and

Tim Winders:

then, we bring in this whole.

Tim Winders:

I hate to bring up the word.

Tim Winders:

not really diversity, it could be that if both of us work for Bob and

Tim Winders:

I'm a guy, and Bob's a guy, and we go

Tim Winders:

out to lunch once a week.

Tim Winders:

You're sitting there going, I don't go out to lunch once a week, Bob.

Tim Winders:

They must be buddies.

Tim Winders:

we may not be buddies.

Tim Winders:

We may just whatever, go out to lunch.

Tim Winders:

I don't know.

Tim Winders:

but, so there's a lot of things that factor in

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

and what I'm hearing, Jean and I think this is what I've picked

Tim Winders:

up on and maybe I think this is a good place to go with the conversation,

Tim Winders:

is that really we have to kind of own this We, we it's not like we can

Tim Winders:

offload this or get even AI to help us with it, which is interesting.

Tim Winders:

Buzzword or anything like that.

Tim Winders:

Now we, we really, I.

Tim Winders:

Have to come to terms with owning this and taking charge, control, whatever word.

Tim Winders:

There's

Tim Winders:

probably a lot of words we could use.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

And, and is that correct?

Tim Winders:

And, and, and what does that look like?

Tim Winders:

What did it look like for you as you came along?

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

So for me it was really, yes, absolutely.

Jean Tien:

We have to own it.

Jean Tien:

Otherwise Bob owns us and so it's either we're going to take control

Jean Tien:

of the situation or as much control as we can of this situation.

Jean Tien:

Or somebody else is gonna control our emotions, our beliefs, our reactions.

Jean Tien:

And in terms of how it looked like, for me, it was just to a point where like

Jean Tien:

I was so uncomfortable, I sought help.

Jean Tien:

So for your clients, they seek you out for help.

Jean Tien:

And I sought out a coach for help and it was really, it was really beneficial

Jean Tien:

because my coach was able to share with me and to shed light on the areas that

Jean Tien:

I never knew didn't need to happen.

Jean Tien:

So for example, I always thought oh, if you mess up then you have to be scared

Jean Tien:

'cause you're gonna get in trouble.

Jean Tien:

And then so like my coach showed me like, no, you don't have to be scared.

Jean Tien:

We're all human and you can make a mistake.

Jean Tien:

And, this is how you go forward and move it and forward and move forward with it.

Jean Tien:

But that's not what I was taught.

Jean Tien:

I was taught I had to be perfect.

Jean Tien:

I was taught that, anything outside of perfection meant that

Jean Tien:

we were going to fail and that I would, I should fix it right away.

Jean Tien:

And so having that third party perspective is super, super helpful.

Jean Tien:

Now, we can't always afford a third party to help us, but if there's

Jean Tien:

somebody that we can trust to be able to be honest with us, it's definitely

Jean Tien:

worth having that conversation.

Jean Tien:

But also recognize the fact, and I think this is where so many

Jean Tien:

people go wrong too, is that

Jean Tien:

And I was actually just telling my friend this too, is that we can, we should

Jean Tien:

only listen to the advice that resonates with us because as much as you and I

Jean Tien:

are coaches and forever, however many years we've done this, we still have

Jean Tien:

our own filters in place that may not necessarily be relevant or accessible

Jean Tien:

to the person that we're talking to.

Jean Tien:

And so getting an outside perspective is helpful, but at the end of the

Jean Tien:

day, it's really taking in the information that really resonates.

Jean Tien:

And does it always work and clear out the problem?

Jean Tien:

Maybe, maybe not, but I think it's, I think something we have

Jean Tien:

to get comfortable with too.

Jean Tien:

It's not a one and done process.

Jean Tien:

It's an evolution.

Jean Tien:

It's a journey.

Jean Tien:

It's trial and error.

Jean Tien:

And so maybe we thought, sorry, my dog is on this side.

Jean Tien:

I don't know if you hear her, but.

Jean Tien:

Maybe we thought that this would work today, but, if it

Jean Tien:

didn't, maybe it wasn't meant to.

Jean Tien:

Maybe we have to look at it something else.

Jean Tien:

Maybe there was something missing that we weren't comfortable accepting

Jean Tien:

or looking at in the first place.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

We'll, welcome the dog in on the show here.

Tim Winders:

What's the dog's name?

Tim Winders:

Just so we can give proper credit.

Jean Tien:

Sure.

Jean Tien:

Her name is Oreo and she's a puppy.

Jean Tien:

We just got her and if you can hear, I apologize.

Jean Tien:

I gave her treats.

Jean Tien:

I thought she was gonna calm down.

Jean Tien:

clear.

Jean Tien:

She's like going wild.

Tim Winders:

We will just welcome, everybody kind of knows that I broadcast

Tim Winders:

my section from an RV and we could have blowers and noises and stuff like that.

Tim Winders:

So we'll welcome Oreo in.

Tim Winders:

Maybe we'll ask a few questions of Oreo shortly, or maybe we

Jean Tien:

Okay.

Jean Tien:

Thanks Tim.

Tim Winders:

Jean, something that's that.

Tim Winders:

Gosh, this comes up a lot and I, and I, and I wish it didn't, but I

Tim Winders:

think it's appropriate when we talk about these things, we also have

Tim Winders:

to bring in things like culture.

Tim Winders:

Gender um, you know, structures, , you know, what part of the world we're in.

Tim Winders:

All these different things have to be factored in.

Tim Winders:

and the reason that I wanna do that is because I think you

Tim Winders:

work primarily with females.

Tim Winders:

Is that correct?

Jean Tien:

Yes, for the most part, I work for females.

Jean Tien:

yes.

Tim Winders:

Okay.

Tim Winders:

So then this is a question that I seem to ask a lot when I have someone like you on,

Tim Winders:

is it what are, and here's the reason why.

Tim Winders:

Let me preface this.

Tim Winders:

Many times when we're talking about similar topics with say, a male,

Tim Winders:

we're not having the discussion about you need to take charge, you need

Tim Winders:

to be in control of the situation.

Tim Winders:

And I must admit, I am sitting here listening, going, yeah,

Tim Winders:

yeah, yeah, I get that.

Tim Winders:

But I also think back to my nine years, right?

Tim Winders:

When I came outta Georgia Tech and went into corporate, I, I was probably a bob.

Tim Winders:

I probably walked in thinking that I owned the place.

Tim Winders:

I'm not saying that's good either, but I don't think I thought

Tim Winders:

about some of those things.

Tim Winders:

So let's talk a little bit.

Tim Winders:

As much as I hate to go here, let's talk a little bit about either

Tim Winders:

cultural and or just the differences.

Tim Winders:

And I don't like to group people, but we're about to do it.

Tim Winders:

So what are some of the unique challenges related to those differences?

Jean Tien:

So, let me know if this answers your question, Tim.

Jean Tien:

I think, and happy to just be honest and, full disclosure, I'm

Jean Tien:

not easily offended, so feel free to say whatever it's totally okay.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

that's what benefits everybody else, right?

Jean Tien:

To have an open and honest conversation.

Jean Tien:

I think there are differences because that's what, that's what

Jean Tien:

makes us unique are the differences are our lived experiences.

Jean Tien:

And you and I don't have the same lived experience.

Jean Tien:

I am an Asian female and I'm 46 years old.

Jean Tien:

There are other Asian females who are 46 years old, similar, maybe

Jean Tien:

same diploma or whatever it is.

Jean Tien:

They, this person and I won't have the same experiences, right?

Jean Tien:

Because we . Never grew up with the same people or whatever.

Jean Tien:

Even my brother and myself don't have the same experiences because he had

Jean Tien:

a different life than I did, even though we lived under the same roof.

Jean Tien:

And so these are the differences that create and contribute to the experiences

Jean Tien:

that we have, the experiences that feed into our beliefs and our reactions

Jean Tien:

and our triggers and everything else.

Jean Tien:

And so the way that we see things will be different.

Jean Tien:

I think, I wanna say, I think most of us walk into a new job, especially

Jean Tien:

graduating from an MBA program or from, a university thinking something is going to

Jean Tien:

happen and that we deserve to be there.

Jean Tien:

And absolutely we all deserve to be there.

Jean Tien:

I, I think . when our expectations and the reality don't match.

Jean Tien:

I think that's where it's oh wait, that's like a big sign

Jean Tien:

of okay, wait, what happened?

Jean Tien:

And I think some of us are able to adapt and be more resilient to it, and others

Jean Tien:

are not necessarily going to be, and for me, I fell into that second part.

Jean Tien:

I fell into that latter category of not being resilient because I didn't

Jean Tien:

know how to handle differences.

Jean Tien:

I didn't know how to have conflict, conflict, free

Jean Tien:

conflict, if that makes sense.

Jean Tien:

Right.

Jean Tien:

Because I wasn't taught that.

Jean Tien:

Whereas if you were to walk in, you probably knew how to do it

Jean Tien:

and because you were taught that.

Jean Tien:

So everybody will be different.

Jean Tien:

And I think that's what creates um, that's what creates the interesting

Jean Tien:

situations that we have, whether it's at work or at home, outside, et cetera.

Tim Winders:

I, and I think the thing that's.

Tim Winders:

Tough.

Tim Winders:

it's it's tough for me, but I want to be better, and I think it's tough

Tim Winders:

for everybody at various levels is that we know the value of diversity.

Tim Winders:

It's just pulling it off to get everybody underneath one

Tim Winders:

roof is really, really hard.

Jean Tien:

Oh, yes it is.

Jean Tien:

It's great.

Jean Tien:

Theoretically, I think when you execute it in reality, people don't realize

Jean Tien:

how hard it is to actually make it work the way that we think it should work.

Jean Tien:

And then, so that's where we fail because it's in the nuances that creates,

Jean Tien:

quite frankly, the experiences that we have, whether it's good or it's bad.

Jean Tien:

And so if we can handle the nuances.

Jean Tien:

when it comes to that diversity aspect, it, it really does

Jean Tien:

benefit the overall organization.

Tim Winders:

So somewhere along the way you, you continued in the

Tim Winders:

corporate path, but then you started.

Tim Winders:

On the side, side, gig, side hustle,

Tim Winders:

another company,

Tim Winders:

whatever.

Tim Winders:

Tell me about the formation of that and then we'll probably start moving into

Tim Winders:

some of the things we could learn from all the things you've been teaching

Tim Winders:

and sharing in that environment.

Jean Tien:

yeah, absolutely.

Jean Tien:

and so for me, it's interesting because when I started to see

Jean Tien:

how . Much easier things can be.

Jean Tien:

When we started to shift the perspective, I realized like there's so many of

Jean Tien:

us that are suffering unnecessarily.

Jean Tien:

They're suffering in silence, but it's also so unnecessary, right?

Jean Tien:

And like all of this we do mostly to ourselves, I wanna say 80 to

Jean Tien:

90% of it we do to ourselves.

Jean Tien:

And when I started to realize that, and I felt like I was the biggest

Jean Tien:

quote unquote self, designated victim out there, and if I could see that

Jean Tien:

change, and if I could make this leap, then so many of us could do it too.

Jean Tien:

And we would have better working environments for

Jean Tien:

everybody, like everybody.

Jean Tien:

And so that's when.

Jean Tien:

I recognized, I was like, I can change that.

Jean Tien:

I can actually have influence in that and by sharing my experiences, by working

Jean Tien:

with others to help them see maybe where they're holding themselves back the

Jean Tien:

same way that I was doing to myself.

Jean Tien:

And so that's how I started, working with my clients and, sharing the

Jean Tien:

messages that I have out there as well.

Tim Winders:

So when did gimme a timeframe?

Tim Winders:

when was that, and where was

Tim Winders:

that in your career I.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

So I wanna say it was about five years ago and it was, I wanna say it

Jean Tien:

was before CO but when Covid came, it really gave me an opportunity to devote

Jean Tien:

more time to it because I didn't have to commute two hours a day and I can

Jean Tien:

really be a little bit more flexible.

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Jean Tien:

in terms of the time that I'm committing and how I spend it.

Jean Tien:

And I think in terms of where I was in my career, it's so interesting

Jean Tien:

because I was doing well in my career.

Jean Tien:

and yet I wasn't doing well in my career.

Jean Tien:

And that's when I started to see okay, if I make the mindset shift and stop trying

Jean Tien:

to please everyone, I can do better.

Jean Tien:

But then I'm, if I'm going up in the ladder, aren't I supposed to be happy?

Jean Tien:

Aren't I supposed to like, wanna go to work?

Jean Tien:

Aren't I supposed to feel, joy for more than 24 hours after I get promoted?

Jean Tien:

Because isn't that what we're all like supposed to be working for?

Jean Tien:

Right?

Jean Tien:

And yet, like I couldn't make myself feel joyful for the promotion

Jean Tien:

to like middle management or whatever, for more than 24 hours.

Jean Tien:

No matter how I'm like, oh, you should be grateful.

Jean Tien:

not everybody gets this.

Jean Tien:

You get more money and so why are you so unhappy?

Jean Tien:

You're broken.

Jean Tien:

Like, those were all the thoughts that basically came to my head and I was

Jean Tien:

like, wait, something is just not right.

Jean Tien:

And so that's when.

Jean Tien:

You know, I started talking to others, that's when I hired my

Jean Tien:

coach, and they're just like, it's not you, but it's you , essentially.

Jean Tien:

It's this is all you.

Jean Tien:

and that's when I realized that we can have all of the successes, and I put that

Jean Tien:

in quotes right, on the outside, but if we're not getting any of it on the inside,

Jean Tien:

it doesn't matter how much money we have.

Jean Tien:

It doesn't matter how high in the corporate ladder you have, you are, it

Jean Tien:

doesn't matter like what car you drive or what house you have, or, and quite

Jean Tien:

frankly, I hate to say this because I know I'll probably get some slack

Jean Tien:

for it from parents, but it doesn't matter how many kids you have, right?

Jean Tien:

Even though you love your kids, it doesn't matter how many kids you have,

Jean Tien:

if you can't be present with them, if you can't find the joy of having all of

Jean Tien:

the things that you have in your life.

Jean Tien:

And that's why, that's where I was in my career when I started.

Tim Winders:

One of the thing, and you just did a great job of almost

Tim Winders:

defining our redefining success mantra

Tim Winders:

that we have here.

Tim Winders:

you went through all of it, and I guess as a follow-up, I wanted to ask why

Tim Winders:

is money not a good gauge of success?

Jean Tien:

Oh wow.

Jean Tien:

Where do I start with that?

Jean Tien:

Money is just money.

Jean Tien:

And I know that sounds terrible, and I know some people will say, well,

Jean Tien:

that's probably because you have some of it, and you could say that.

Jean Tien:

And yes, there's absolutely some truth to that where, you know, I am not, on,

Jean Tien:

on homeless, on, the side of the street.

Jean Tien:

And I, and I do have some because I work, et cetera, but

Jean Tien:

money can go away at any time.

Jean Tien:

at any, at any day.

Jean Tien:

And I can have my job today, or I can't have my job today.

Jean Tien:

And I think the biggest example of that was the financial crisis in 2008 where

Jean Tien:

people who had worked for 50, 60 years on the verge of retirement lost everything

Jean Tien:

and they had to start all over again.

Jean Tien:

So does that mean that they were unsuccessful because of that situation?

Jean Tien:

Or do we need to reevaluate what we're basing our success on?

Jean Tien:

And I think what happens with money is that we start to define ourselves

Jean Tien:

based off of how much is in our bank account, . And if that's what it is,

Jean Tien:

then you don't need to have a family.

Jean Tien:

You don't need to have anything, right?

Jean Tien:

Like you don't need to have any experiences.

Jean Tien:

You just go to work, collect your paycheck, and the bigger it grows, then

Jean Tien:

does that mean that you have more value?

Jean Tien:

And if that's the case, then okay, that's great.

Jean Tien:

Because some people, they're fine with that.

Jean Tien:

But then others will ask, then what value have I contributed to the overall society?

Jean Tien:

What value have I contributed to my community, to the world today?

Jean Tien:

How have I made people's lives better?

Jean Tien:

And those are the people that I tend to work with because they want more in life.

Jean Tien:

And it's not saying that they won't have more money by pursuing more.

Jean Tien:

It's just saying that money in and of itself is just a piece of

Jean Tien:

paper for them that helps them.

Jean Tien:

It's like a means to the end that they're seeking

Tim Winders:

Yeah, and I, the thing that I found, because

Tim Winders:

that story of 2008 is our story,

Jean Tien:

Okay.

Tim Winders:

multiple companies, big house, all that kinda stuff, and I

Tim Winders:

found myself attaching my identity.

Tim Winders:

I.

Tim Winders:

To that success.

Tim Winders:

And so when all of a sudden that shifted change went away, blew up,

Tim Winders:

whatever terms you wanna use, I started questioning, okay, maybe I

Tim Winders:

wasn't as smart as good or whatever.

Tim Winders:

And so that's, and that becomes tough.

Tim Winders:

I I I love that you're pointing people more towards an inner, I think

Tim Winders:

a lot of people will tie faith in.

Tim Winders:

We don't shy away from that here.

Tim Winders:

For me, it was quite a faith journey.

Tim Winders:

But somewhere along the way you developed this method that's, I

Tim Winders:

call it success, but there's a period after each one of the words.

Tim Winders:

And so I don't know

Tim Winders:

if it's S period, U period.

Tim Winders:

the success method.

Tim Winders:

Tell

Tim Winders:

us about that.

Tim Winders:

And then maybe in the time we have, maybe we can unpack.

Tim Winders:

Did you see, I, you, I

Jean Tien:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

word in.

Tim Winders:

I made it work.

Tim Winders:

While, we can unpack that a little bit for, for some folks so that they could

Tim Winders:

take some tangible things away from here.

Tim Winders:

So success method,

Tim Winders:

tell us about it.

Jean Tien:

absolutely.

Jean Tien:

So it is an acronym, as we love all good acronyms, it is an acronym, and

Jean Tien:

so I don't, I, there's seven steps to it because, one step for each letter,

Jean Tien:

I won't go through all of it, but I think some of the more important

Jean Tien:

ones is the first one for s Right.

Jean Tien:

And that's really important because this is where I see most people fail.

Jean Tien:

And it's the one that is so critical that most of my clients spend the most

Jean Tien:

time here, which is, it stands for sussing out your definition of success.

Jean Tien:

And most, actually all of my clients, when I've asked them like, okay, what

Jean Tien:

do you, you know, define your success?

Jean Tien:

they've never sat down to define their success.

Jean Tien:

They define it in a way that they think they're supposed to,

Jean Tien:

oh, I, I wanna make whatever.

Jean Tien:

I wanna have this, I wanna have that.

Jean Tien:

Okay.

Jean Tien:

But what's your definition of success and why is that important to you?

Jean Tien:

And so when we can, and the reason it's so important is because

Jean Tien:

this is the analogy that I use.

Jean Tien:

If you get into your car and you know you need to go somewhere, but you don't

Jean Tien:

have a def A, a destination to enter, then how do you know where to go?

Jean Tien:

Right.

Jean Tien:

You don't, you're gonna be driving around aimlessly hoping to one day be

Jean Tien:

placed in the right situation, and you just spend so much energy and gas and

Jean Tien:

money trying to figure it all out, and you get hopeless and lost along the way.

Jean Tien:

And so it's always important to have that destination.

Jean Tien:

So it keeps us on the path of where we wanna go, and then it becomes so

Jean Tien:

much easier to filter out all the things that are unimportant to us.

Jean Tien:

So that's the first step, and that's the s.

Tim Winders:

Good.

Tim Winders:

All right.

Tim Winders:

So I want to, I do agree because it's one of the reasons this show exists that is

Tim Winders:

probably the most challenging for people.

Tim Winders:

Probably always has been.

Tim Winders:

Probably always will be.

Tim Winders:

But and, and I'll, I'm gonna spout a few reasons why I think it might be,

Tim Winders:

and you could just respond and come back and maybe we could get Oreo to jump in.

Tim Winders:

I hear Oreo a little bit there.

Tim Winders:

Oreo can jump in and give some thoughts as a puppy that's probably chomping

Tim Winders:

down on some kind of toy or some treats.

Tim Winders:

That's

Jean Tien:

can hear it.

Tim Winders:

it.

Tim Winders:

That's his, is it a, he puppy.

Jean Tien:

yeah,

Jean Tien:

her

Jean Tien:

successes, I got it.

Jean Tien:

And mom's not taking it away from me.

Jean Tien:

. Exactly.

Tim Winders:

I've got the treat and the toy and we're in good shape.

Tim Winders:

So the thing that I noticed, let me kinda share this.

Tim Winders:

We were, I was, we have a grown son, we have two grown children,

Tim Winders:

but we're our grown son and my wife and I, we were in Las Vegas recently

Tim Winders:

and we're sitting in Las Vegas and I just kinda shared this over lunch.

Tim Winders:

I said, you know, I think I like the thought of Las Vegas more than I like

Tim Winders:

the actual being here in Las Vegas.

Tim Winders:

And it got us on a great deep conversation of thinking we should

Tim Winders:

enjoy something, thinking that culture likes this or that or whatever.

Tim Winders:

now we've got all these, what we'll call social media where

Tim Winders:

we can compare to people.

Tim Winders:

I think very few people take the time to do what you're saying,

Tim Winders:

which is define what their.

Tim Winders:

Success is.

Tim Winders:

So I'll just pause and let you respond or say some things about maybe

Tim Winders:

other challenges or those challenges that you see with people doing it.

Jean Tien:

Yeah, I absolutely agree.

Jean Tien:

We think . We would enjoy something more than what is actually true for us,

Jean Tien:

because that's what we're told, right?

Jean Tien:

Oh, whatever stays in va, whatever happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas.

Jean Tien:

Which is gives that implicit message like it's gonna be fun

Jean Tien:

and it's gonna be exciting.

Jean Tien:

And like whatever happens, it's gonna be memorable and you're

Jean Tien:

gonna wanna talk about it.

Jean Tien:

that's brilliant marketing, right?

Jean Tien:

Why wouldn't I wanna go to a place like that?

Jean Tien:

And then when you get there, you're like, oh, it's kind of dirty.

Jean Tien:

And it's not that like exciting and it's not really my thing anymore.

Jean Tien:

But then I think this is where people start to look the other way because

Jean Tien:

then they're like, wait, but is it me?

Jean Tien:

Because they told me that, Ooh, whatever stays in va, whatever

Jean Tien:

happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas.

Jean Tien:

So am I the weird one that's not enjoying myself.

Jean Tien:

And it's no, there's a million other people that don't enjoy

Jean Tien:

Vegas and you're not the odd one.

Jean Tien:

You just happen to know.

Jean Tien:

you know what you like, but knowing what you like and accepting that you

Jean Tien:

like something different from the majority or what you're told, you're

Jean Tien:

supposed to, that's the hard part.

Jean Tien:

And I think that's where success goes wrong.

Jean Tien:

Right?

Jean Tien:

Because, you know, and I see this all the time, it's oh, I want a big house.

Jean Tien:

Wait, but why do I want a big house?

Jean Tien:

what does it mean to me?

Jean Tien:

Oh, I wanna drive the German cars and the luxury cars.

Jean Tien:

They're fun.

Jean Tien:

Okay, but then what about the maintenance and this and that?

Jean Tien:

And what about all those things?

Jean Tien:

we forget that sometimes we don't have the same likes or, preferences that

Jean Tien:

most of our . Other peers have, and we don't want to climb this corporate

Jean Tien:

ladder and that's okay, right?

Jean Tien:

And so because we wanna do something different, and I think the younger

Jean Tien:

generation, I will say, as much as like they get the crap, the younger generation

Jean Tien:

is much more accepting of the fact that they don't wanna follow the footsteps.

Jean Tien:

Whereas I think, my generation and above were just wait, but aren't we supposed to?

Jean Tien:

Isn't that what makes us like acceptable?

Jean Tien:

And isn't that what makes us fit in?

Jean Tien:

And if we go back to the original part of this conversation, it was like, we are

Jean Tien:

all looking for our place in this world.

Jean Tien:

And then, and it's really hard and it's really lonely, and I'm sure you

Jean Tien:

feel this too, because you're a coach.

Jean Tien:

And so when we see things that other people don't see, and you're trying

Jean Tien:

to find that community, it's really hard and it's really lonely sometimes,

Jean Tien:

and people just don't want to, they, they don't wanna deal with it.

Jean Tien:

and so it, it discourages them from looking for other definitions of

Jean Tien:

success and for allowing for their truth to be recognized and honored

Jean Tien:

and accepted by themselves because it, it could be a little uncomfortable.

Tim Winders:

I think for the most part we are all created for

Tim Winders:

something unique to do something unique and specific in this world.

Tim Winders:

But it seems like many people will copy and be

Tim Winders:

copycats and do

Tim Winders:

other things because it's tough to be different.

Tim Winders:

again, part of

Tim Winders:

the catalyst for what we're doing here is, you're talking, you're

Tim Winders:

Preaching to the choir here.

Tim Winders:

My wife and I live in an RV and travel.

Tim Winders:

We are, you mentioned being homeless earlier.

Tim Winders:

I'm sitting here going, we're homeless.

Tim Winders:

We don't have a home.

Tim Winders:

No,

Tim Winders:

we do, we have a motor coach and

Tim Winders:

we're down here in Arizona.

Tim Winders:

The weather's nice.

Tim Winders:

You're in New York.

Tim Winders:

It's cold.

Tim Winders:

I'm in a pretty good spot right now.

Tim Winders:

but part of that is, you have other people that ask often, what are y'all doing?

Tim Winders:

When are y'all gonna settle down?

Tim Winders:

What, when are you a place to go?

Tim Winders:

They, and sometimes I think people think it's, they think it

Tim Winders:

might be judging their choices.

Tim Winders:

I don't think it is.

Tim Winders:

I think when people walk their own path and then other times it's

Tim Winders:

just, they just don't understand.

Jean Tien:

yeah.

Tim Winders:

and I think there takes a certain degree of

Tim Winders:

courage to begin this process.

Tim Winders:

Talk a little

Tim Winders:

bit about that.

Tim Winders:

'cause I think that's what I picked up from you from the

Tim Winders:

video I watched is that I.

Tim Winders:

It took you a little while to all of a sudden have that, the Wizard of Oz.

Tim Winders:

You were given courage all of a sudden.

Tim Winders:

it takes courage to go through this, to ask for help, to go get a coach

Tim Winders:

or to sit down and say, I'm gonna work on this definition of success.

Tim Winders:

I.

Jean Tien:

Yeah, it definitely takes courage.

Jean Tien:

It's so uncomfortable at times and especially during the times where

Jean Tien:

you're at the precipice of growth because growth means you're getting

Jean Tien:

uncomfortable, because you're not, you're growing out of your comfort zone.

Jean Tien:

That's what growth is.

Jean Tien:

so it absolutely takes courage.

Jean Tien:

And what's more about it too, and this is, this is one thing that

Jean Tien:

I am going through right now.

Jean Tien:

So we're having a very, good conversation now in terms of

Jean Tien:

timeliness, is that I think we all want to control the circumstances.

Jean Tien:

We all want to have safety, and we think that by controlling

Jean Tien:

our circumstances, we are safe.

Jean Tien:

Whereas I think so many things around us have shown us that

Jean Tien:

there is no ability to control.

Jean Tien:

Any of us have no ability to control our circumstances.

Jean Tien:

The only thing we can control is how we respond to a situation.

Jean Tien:

And, but the thing is that it's scary when you go out there and

Jean Tien:

you follow an unconventional path.

Jean Tien:

And it doesn't even have to be that unconventional.

Jean Tien:

You don't have to, quit everything and then move whatever.

Jean Tien:

it doesn't have to be that unconventional.

Jean Tien:

But even something as simple as saying.

Jean Tien:

Okay, I'm going to accept the fact that I don't wanna work a nine to five.

Jean Tien:

I wanna pursue, a hobby or I don't care about the promotion.

Jean Tien:

I wanna spend the extra time instead of working.

Jean Tien:

I wanna be able to spend the time, knitting because that's what I love to do.

Jean Tien:

And trusting that it's going to be okay at the end, right?

Jean Tien:

Something so small as that, or seemingly small as that can take

Jean Tien:

a lot of courage because you know you're doing something that other

Jean Tien:

people think you're crazy for doing.

Jean Tien:

oh, why wouldn't you want a promotion?

Jean Tien:

Why don't you want more money?

Jean Tien:

Why don't you want da, da, da, da, right?

Jean Tien:

And it's no, because I put my personal joy ahead of all these things.

Jean Tien:

But few people value that sense of personal joy because we all work towards

Jean Tien:

that pot at the end of the rainbow.

Jean Tien:

And it's so funny because when have you ever seen a pot of gold

Jean Tien:

at the end of the rainbow, right?

Jean Tien:

So what you can only see now is what you have in front of you.

Jean Tien:

And, but we're taught to ignore that because we want, we wanna prolong,

Jean Tien:

our ability to enjoy the riches that we have because that's what makes

Jean Tien:

us a good person or so we're told.

Tim Winders:

So we're told.

Tim Winders:

So if someone is sitting here going, you know what I got, I've got to work on this.

Tim Winders:

Defining what success looks like for me.

Tim Winders:

and I know, listen, both of you and I would say get a coach.

Tim Winders:

Maybe that doesn't make sense for everyone, but what are a couple just like

Tim Winders:

quick tips and then I do want us to do maybe a quick run through the rest of the

Tim Winders:

system without going into a lot of detail.

Tim Winders:

But

Tim Winders:

I think, I think I agree with you.

Tim Winders:

This is like the most important.

Tim Winders:

So couple quick things for somebody who's listening, going, I need

Tim Winders:

to define my success better.

Tim Winders:

What are some

Tim Winders:

things that they can do tangible that can

Tim Winders:

get that process started or more clarity there?

Jean Tien:

Yeah, I think we start with the easiest part, right?

Jean Tien:

So I think what we start with is what does, like what is your

Jean Tien:

current metrics of success?

Jean Tien:

And I think so many of us will say the money, the whatever, whatever.

Jean Tien:

And it's fine.

Jean Tien:

There's absolutely no judgment in any of that, but write it all down.

Jean Tien:

So let's say you write your top five metrics of success.

Jean Tien:

So when I first started, it would be where I am in my career, how much

Jean Tien:

money I have, whether or not I'm married, whether or not I have kids.

Jean Tien:

Those are quite frankly all cultural things, right?

Jean Tien:

And let's just keep it at that four.

Jean Tien:

Now if I go, and then now the second step is to go back to each one of

Jean Tien:

these metrics and say, what is it about this metric that makes me successful?

Jean Tien:

And then it's to really be that.

Jean Tien:

Personal, investigator, right?

Jean Tien:

And really dig deep into it.

Jean Tien:

Okay, money makes me successful because if I have money, then I can,

Jean Tien:

buy all these different things and, okay, so I can have an island and

Jean Tien:

I can have all of these things, but does that truly make me successful?

Jean Tien:

because everybody has, I take that back.

Jean Tien:

Most of your audience, most of, the people we know have money in the bank.

Jean Tien:

So does that make us successful?

Jean Tien:

And I think if we look back 10 years ago, oh, I wanted this amount in the

Jean Tien:

bank and I'm pretty sure most of us probably met or exceeded that amount.

Jean Tien:

So are we successful?

Jean Tien:

Is that where we stop now?

Jean Tien:

And then, so it's just to keep looking at the circumstances and say, okay, you

Jean Tien:

know what, maybe it's not the money, maybe it's what money represents, right?

Jean Tien:

Oh, I want the ability to make, to have freedom.

Jean Tien:

I want the ability to make my own decisions.

Jean Tien:

That's great.

Jean Tien:

That's what success is.

Jean Tien:

It's not the money, it's what that represents.

Jean Tien:

And a big house, is it really the house size?

Jean Tien:

Because I can think of a million reasons why a big house isn't successful.

Jean Tien:

Like I would have to clean it, right?

Jean Tien:

And then so it's is it just a place to live?

Jean Tien:

Is it to be comfortable?

Jean Tien:

Is it place to entertain your friends?

Jean Tien:

And then okay, so what is it that you're really looking

Jean Tien:

for with that as well, right?

Jean Tien:

Or is it just what society tells you that you have to do?

Jean Tien:

And so if you go through each one of these metrics, I think you'll become clearer

Jean Tien:

on what your definition of success is.

Jean Tien:

And one thing I wanna caveat here too is that definitions of success evolves.

Jean Tien:

It's never static.

Jean Tien:

And so, and I think we learn that, right?

Jean Tien:

If you look back at your kids or as our, at ourselves when we were younger,

Jean Tien:

it's to get an A in this test or get a, you know, whatever it is, right?

Jean Tien:

And so we keep evolving and so I think it's so important to remind everyone that,

Jean Tien:

Wherever they are.

Jean Tien:

It's always important to keep reevaluating your definition of success.

Jean Tien:

Does this really hold true for me today?

Jean Tien:

and there's no judgment on it if you look back and say oh,

Jean Tien:

I can't believe I used that.

Jean Tien:

yeah.

Jean Tien:

But that's what was important to you at that point.

Jean Tien:

So what is important to you today and how do we, go forward and achieve it?

Tim Winders:

Yeah, that's part of the journey we're on.

Tim Winders:

We've got just a few minutes here.

Tim Winders:

Tell us what you'd like to about the U-C-C-E-S-S.

Tim Winders:

Either,

Tim Winders:

either the, which one, what they are, if you wanna hit a high point or two, and

Tim Winders:

then we'll let people know how they could connect with you and get some

Tim Winders:

more info and all if they need to.

Jean Tien:

Absolutely.

Jean Tien:

So I think as you're going through this process, the U is to

Jean Tien:

underline, the successes that you've already achieved, and then the C

Jean Tien:

is to create new success goals.

Jean Tien:

And I think as you're going through this process, what you'll realize is that your

Jean Tien:

goals are bigger than anything you've ever been allowed to dream of before or

Jean Tien:

to even imagine that you can achieve.

Jean Tien:

And so it's super important to go through this process to understand

Jean Tien:

where the fears that are coming from.

Jean Tien:

To really investigate them as well.

Jean Tien:

It's a lot of self investigation, right?

Jean Tien:

Like a personal detective to look through and then really to, it's about the

Jean Tien:

energy that you stay in and I think that it's most important to find what's most

Jean Tien:

important to us because when we do that, it's like natural fuel is what I call it.

Jean Tien:

Because you're never gonna wanna give up because there is a value to it that

Jean Tien:

you see that keeps you moving forward.

Jean Tien:

And, yeah, that's, that.

Jean Tien:

I think those are the main points of the success method.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

That's very good.

Tim Winders:

tell us, Jean, you've got a lot of stuff.

Tim Winders:

You've got podcast, you've got you speak, you coach, you've got this system.

Tim Winders:

Tell us what you want to about where people c connect with

Tim Winders:

you, where they could go.

Tim Winders:

And and then I've got one more question before we wrap up and finish

Jean Tien:

Yeah, absolutely.

Jean Tien:

So they can find me on my website.

Jean Tien:

It's gene tn.com and I'm also active on Instagram and it's at Gene ftn.

Jean Tien:

So I think those are the two main places that I would, direct people

Jean Tien:

to if they wanna learn more.

Tim Winders:

Perfect.

Tim Winders:

and tell us all that you have available that you really do,

Tim Winders:

that you like to pour into people with this process and this method.

Jean Tien:

Yeah, so they, there's a book called Your Success Blueprint

Jean Tien:

where I walked through basically the entire success process.

Jean Tien:

And then, there's also, if you want just a quick listen, not to

Jean Tien:

take time away from Tim's amazing podcast, but I also have one too.

Jean Tien:

And it's called Being Unapologetically Authentic, where we really just also

Jean Tien:

start to take the, the scariness away from looking at success in a different

Jean Tien:

way, similar to your goal here, Tim.

Jean Tien:

And yeah, I think those are two really good places to start.

Tim Winders:

There was a good, and here's what a lot of people may love,

Tim Winders:

because we're 60 minutes usually long.

Tim Winders:

I went and listened to a couple of Seven minute podcast episodes of yours

Tim Winders:

yesterday, and one was something that we talk a lot about here, which is

Tim Winders:

Kind of the anti hustles and grind culture and, and that's a great fit.

Tim Winders:

I do think, go subscribe and join up

Tim Winders:

over there and listen in.

Tim Winders:

Listen in over there, gene, we are seek, go create those three words.

Tim Winders:

I'm gonna let you choose one of those words.

Tim Winders:

If you need to consult with Oreo and y'all come up with a team answer, that's fine.

Tim Winders:

But, seek, go or create, which one of those words resonates

Tim Winders:

more than the other and why?

Jean Tien:

Yeah, I think Oreo would agree.

Jean Tien:

Seeking is most important and it should be of no surprise after

Jean Tien:

what we just talked about as well.

Jean Tien:

I think seeking our truth is really truly the first step that we can all

Jean Tien:

take to create the success that we all have been working so hard for.

Tim Winders:

Excellent.

Tim Winders:

Jean, this has really almost been a masterclass of what we started this

Tim Winders:

podcast for, of redefining success.

Tim Winders:

I think that what you discussed and what you're doing is so aligned

Tim Winders:

with what we're doing here at Seat GoCreate, and I appreciate that.

Tim Winders:

So I highly recommend everyone and thank you for the conversation.

Tim Winders:

I highly recommend any, anyone, if you've listened in, jump

Tim Winders:

over to being unapologetic with, is that being unapologetic

Jean Tien:

uh, it's being unapologetically authentic.

Jean Tien:

Yes.

Tim Winders:

authentic.

Tim Winders:

Yes.

Tim Winders:

With Jean Tn.

Tim Winders:

Go check that out and subscribe there.

Tim Winders:

and look at the success method.

Tim Winders:

Go to her website and follow her.

Tim Winders:

I think that'd be a great match for what we're doing here.

Tim Winders:

We are Seek, go Create.

Tim Winders:

We have new episodes every Monday.

Tim Winders:

Until next time, continue being all that you are created to be.

About the Podcast

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Seek Go Create
Redefining Success in Leadership, Business & Ministry

About your host

Profile picture for Tim Winders

Tim Winders

Tim Winders is a faith driven executive coach and author with over 40 years of experience in leadership, business, and ministry. Through his personal journey of redefining success, he has gained valuable insights on how to align beliefs with work and lead with purpose. He is committed to helping others do the same, running a coaching business that helps leaders, leadership teams, business owners, and entrepreneurs to align their beliefs with their work and redefine success.

In addition to his coaching business, Tim is also the host of the SeekGoCreate podcast and author of the book Coach: A Story of Success Redefined, which provides guidance for those looking to redefine success and align their beliefs with their work. With his extensive background, unique perspective and strengths in strategic thinking, relationship building, and problem-solving, Tim is well-suited to help clients navigate through difficult times and achieve their goals.