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Challenging Traditional Beliefs: Heather Parady on Unconventional Leadership and Spiritual Growth

Have you ever felt uncertain about where you belong? Or struggled to reconcile personal growth with faith? Join host Tim Winders and visionary fractional COO, Heather Parady, as they delve into redefining success, navigating the tension between personal growth and spirituality, and the unexpected paths that unconventional leadership journeys can take. Dive into this honest and thought-provoking conversation, where they challenge traditional norms, share personal stories, and explore the fluidity of success. If you've ever questioned your place in the world, this episode is a must-listen!

"Success isn't about a destination, but about faithfully navigating the seasons of life." - Heather Parady

Access all show and episode resources HERE

About Our Guest:

Heather Parady is the visionary fractional COO and host of the Unconventional Leaders podcast. With a mission to empower unconventional leaders, she guides "outside-of-the-box folks" in bringing their projects to fruition, both tactically through her business and philosophically through her content. Heather's expertise spans personal development, leadership, and navigating the intersection of faith and entrepreneurship, reflecting her own journey from ministry to successful entrepreneurship.

Reasons to Listen:

1. Gain insight into redefining success by exploring the concept of being faithful to seasonal callings and embracing the unconventional path to leadership.

2. Learn from a visionary leader about the unexpected transitions from faith to entrepreneurship and the impact of personal growth on identity and purpose.

3. Explore the intersection of spirituality, personal growth, and leadership while navigating through the deconstruction of traditional beliefs and the pursuit of continual self-improvement.

Episode Resources & Action Steps:

Resources Mentioned:

Unconventional Leader Podcast - A podcast hosted by Heather Parady, focusing on empowering unconventional leaders. Listeners can find it on various podcast platforms.

Action Steps:

1. Embrace a Growth Mindset - Implement Carol Dweck’s concept of growth mindset by actively seeking to develop and grow, rather than being fixed in your beliefs or abilities. This can involve regularly engaging with inspiring content and seeking out new learning opportunities.

2. Seek Faithfully - Take time to reevaluate your current season and explore what it means to be faithful to your own seasonal calling, in alignment with the discussion around redefining success and trusting in long-term calls that are outside of our control.

3. Embrace Media for Good - Explore using media and storytelling as a means to connect with and positively impact others, especially through platforms like Instagram, podcasts, and YouTube, as discussed by Heather Parady. This could involve sharing your journey, insights, and experiences in a way that uplifts and empowers others.

Resources for Leaders from Tim Winders & SGC:

🔹 Unlock Your Potential Today!

  • 🎙 Coaching with Tim: Elevate your leadership and align your work with your faith. Learn More
  • 📚 "Coach: A Story of Success Redefined": A transformative read that will challenge your views on success. Grab Your Copy
  • 📝 Faith Driven Leader Quiz: Discover how well you're aligning faith and work with our quick quiz. Take the Quiz

Key Lessons:

1. Embracing Seasonal Callings: Heather Parady shares the importance of being faithful to the seasonal call, trusting in the long-term call being outside of our control, and the impact this has on redefining success.

2. Redefining Authenticity: The conversation delves into the nuanced understanding of authenticity, emphasizing the importance of staying true to one’s values and not using authenticity as an excuse for lazy or inappropriate behavior.

3. Impact of Faith and Leadership: Both Heather Parady and Tim Winders discuss the influence of faith and spirituality on their leadership journeys, emphasizing the need for a direct relationship with a higher power and the impact of upbringing and questioning ingrained beliefs.

4. Balancing Personal Growth and Values: The episode explores the struggles of balancing personal growth, judgment, and the deconstruction of religious beliefs, including the accompanying emotions of anger and grief.

5. Business Partnerships and Mindset: Heather's wisdom on the caution needed when entering business partnerships, likening it to entering a marriage, and Tim's emphasis on continual growth, aligning with Carol Dweck's concept of a growth mindset, offer valuable insights for entrepreneurs and leaders.

Episode Highlights:

00:00 Self-discovery through openness and humility.

05:25 Seeking diverse voices, unconventional approach, shifting mindset.

09:16 Learning business involves more than just planning.

10:17 Find success by being faithful to seasons.

13:26 Struggling with entrepreneurial path, finding alignment with God.

17:33 Questioning judgment, embracing love while maintaining values.

22:37 Navigating generational differences with self-awareness and compassion.

23:55 Seeking growth mindset leads to a better self.

28:06 Religion's influence; people's career paths.

33:27 Caution in business and partnerships, learn and grow.

36:54 Thank you for listening, I appreciate it.

40:22 Realizing my role as a creative entrepreneur.

42:35 Do images impact mood? Son's viral post.

44:56 Striving for authenticity in today's world is strenuous.

49:18 Seeking insight to share on generational differences.

54:06 Parenting anxiety, unconventional leadership, and scripting work.

56:26 Striving to use tools for good, not evil.

59:32 Appreciation for conversation, promoting podcast and host.

Thank you for listening to Seek Go Create!

Our podcast is dedicated to empowering Christian leaders, entrepreneurs, and individuals looking to redefine success in their personal and professional lives. Through in-depth interviews, personal anecdotes, and expert advice, we offer valuable insights and actionable strategies for achieving your goals and living a life of purpose and fulfillment.

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Mentioned in this episode:

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Transcript
Heather Parady:

I used to ask what is my calling?

Heather Parady:

And now I've been asking what is my calling in this season?

Heather Parady:

And so for success for me right now is being faithful to the seasonal

Heather Parady:

call and trusting that the big long-term call is outside of my

Heather Parady:

control and I'm working towards it.

Tim Winders:

Can redefining success?

Tim Winders:

Start with embracing unconventional leadership.

Tim Winders:

Welcome to Seat Go Create, where we explore this question and others with

Tim Winders:

Heather parody, a visionary fractional COO and show host whose mission

Tim Winders:

is to empower those that she calls unconventional leaders, individuals

Tim Winders:

ready to challenge norms and make a significant impact in this world.

Tim Winders:

Sounds like people that listen in here at Seat go create with a background as

Tim Winders:

unique as her approach to leadership.

Tim Winders:

She has traversed a path from being homeschooled in the Bible Belt to

Tim Winders:

spearheading transformative conversations with leaders across the globe.

Tim Winders:

You can bet I'll be asking about that.

Tim Winders:

Words that jump to mind when I think of Heather.

Tim Winders:

Authenticity, passion, impact they describe her.

Tim Winders:

Heather, welcome to.

Heather Parady:

So I've listened to a lot of your episodes.

Heather Parady:

I'm like, man, he's good at intros and you do not fail, man.

Heather Parady:

that is so on point.

Heather Parady:

Thank you.

Heather Parady:

Wow.

Heather Parady:

I'm glad to be here.

Tim Winders:

Thank you Heather.

Tim Winders:

I am, I'm excited about this for a lot of reasons.

Tim Winders:

I'm gonna share that in just a second, but let me give probably my

Tim Winders:

hardest que nah, this isn't gonna be my hardest question for you.

Tim Winders:

I'll go ahead and tell you that, but it's gonna be pretty tough.

Tim Winders:

If somebody ask you what you do, what do you usually tell people?

Heather Parady:

That used to be the hardest question for me to answer until

Heather Parady:

this past year where I gave myself permission to actually say out loud

Heather Parady:

what I know I actually do, which is I

Tim Winders:

Cool.

Tim Winders:

Tell me about it.

Heather Parady:

Let's go.

Heather Parady:

I help outside of the box folks, the big heart carry their

Heather Parady:

projects across the finish line.

Heather Parady:

That's it.

Heather Parady:

So I do that tactically through my business.

Heather Parady:

So fractional, COO, right?

Heather Parady:

We do a lot of the operations side, processes, systems, all the non-sexy

Heather Parady:

stuff and make sure people are doing what they're supposed to be doing so we can

Heather Parady:

carry projects across the finish line.

Heather Parady:

That's my business.

Heather Parady:

And then on the creative side, content side, that's more philosophical.

Heather Parady:

So what is it that's keeping you back from actually finishing what you start?

Tim Winders:

So how do you bring those two together?

Heather Parady:

It starts with the latter.

Heather Parady:

everything that we think is the thing is not the thing.

Heather Parady:

it's always an internal mental game.

Heather Parady:

I'm starting to become convinced literally everything, almost

Heather Parady:

everything you know, is really a spiritual, mental, emotional issue.

Heather Parady:

Or opportunity.

Heather Parady:

it starts there.

Heather Parady:

And then tactically, I think it's getting around the right people and willing to

Heather Parady:

admit when you don't know something, when pulling in other people's opinions.

Heather Parady:

I'm so stubborn.

Heather Parady:

I'm so stubborn, and every time I'm hitting a roadblock, I'm realizing

Heather Parady:

that I'm not allowing other voices and other wisdom in my head, and I'm

Heather Parady:

thinking I can do it all on my own.

Heather Parady:

And I've really been working on that this past year of learning from

Heather Parady:

other people and bringing them in.

Tim Winders:

and where does, there's a few terms that you use that I like.

Tim Winders:

I don't know if they push my buttons.

Tim Winders:

I don't know if they describe me or I don't know if it's something I aspire to.

Tim Winders:

But terms like unconventional leaders, you just said outside the box and so

Tim Winders:

let's get started talking a little bit about that because we were talking, we

Tim Winders:

were having cool conversation earlier about, some families and stuff like that.

Tim Winders:

and tell me, just tell me more unconventional leaders outside the

Tim Winders:

box, whichever one you wanna dive into.

Tim Winders:

Tell me more about that.

Heather Parady:

It started off where I was thinking only about anesthetics,

Heather Parady:

meaning when I looked at the landscape of personal development and leadership,

Heather Parady:

which is a bug that I got bit hard with a few years ago when I was in graduate

Heather Parady:

school, and I was just searching for what was next and didn't feel

Heather Parady:

comfortable with what I was doing.

Heather Parady:

Started listening to all the podcasts, doing all the things,

Heather Parady:

we do, and they were great.

Heather Parady:

it absolutely changed my life, but it was all a bunch of

Heather Parady:

rich, middle-aged white dudes.

Heather Parady:

Which is cool.

Heather Parady:

Like I have no issue with them.

Tim Winders:

You are not against, you're not against middle-aged white dudes.

Heather Parady:

no, no, Tim, no, you're we're good.

Heather Parady:

We're We're good.

Tim Winders:

I'm, might have been me now.

Tim Winders:

I'm not middle aged though.

Tim Winders:

It's.

Heather Parady:

But it's true.

Heather Parady:

I mean, there, there wasn't a lot of women in this space, or at least

Heather Parady:

ones that weren't, didn't just have female podcasts, which are

Heather Parady:

again, that's great, that's cool.

Heather Parady:

But it was just like this certain brand and I was in my early thirties, I had

Heather Parady:

a baby, you know, I'm a little quirky.

Heather Parady:

I'm just like the traditional, like Southern Christian Bible

Heather Parady:

belt mom who wears converses and listens to punk rock music.

Heather Parady:

it's still cool.

Heather Parady:

And I'm like, where's my place in this?

Heather Parady:

do I have a voice here?

Heather Parady:

So I started the show.

Heather Parady:

It was terrible.

Heather Parady:

It was like a microphone from Walmart and literally in my closet.

Heather Parady:

And I called it Unconventional Leaders because I wanted to find folks who

Heather Parady:

looked different than what I was seeing.

Heather Parady:

so I say all that to say, it started off as an anesthetic for me.

Heather Parady:

I wanted to see different representation in this conversation.

Heather Parady:

But as the years have gone by, my attitude towards it has shifted so much where it's

Heather Parady:

less about the anesthetic and more about a positioning in the world of approaching

Heather Parady:

things in an unconventional way.

Heather Parady:

So questioning, curiosity, and not from like a rebellious,

Heather Parady:

like screw the system, whatever.

Heather Parady:

I don't wanna ever come from that place because, if we're not pointing

Heather Parady:

to answers and solutions, we're just aiding to the problem, right?

Heather Parady:

But being willing to question stuff and follow your heart, and your

Heather Parady:

spirit and your soul, and what God's leading you towards, even

Heather Parady:

if it doesn't make sense on paper.

Tim Winders:

I think that's the first thing that I saw that I liked.

Tim Winders:

I'm gonna, I'm gonna flip the script on you just a little bit here.

Tim Winders:

I think I bumped into some of the stuff you were doing 4, 4, 5 years ago and

Tim Winders:

I went, Ooh, unconventional leaders.

Tim Winders:

I like that.

Tim Winders:

And I think had a Facebook, or at least a page or something like that.

Tim Winders:

And so I jumped in and you know what's interesting is I looked around and

Tim Winders:

I went, I'm not sure I belong here.

Heather Parady:

Really?

Heather Parady:

How come?

Tim Winders:

I think old white dude,

Heather Parady:

Interesting.

Heather Parady:

Wow.

Tim Winders:

I really, I kinda looked around.

Tim Winders:

I said, man, this is, this is an edgy place, which I love.

Tim Winders:

I'm drawn to it.

Tim Winders:

And maybe sometimes my kids, which my kids are your age, by the way,

Tim Winders:

you know that they're in your break.

Tim Winders:

I'm a grandfather and stuff like that.

Tim Winders:

And so I'm thinking maybe I'm not cool enough to be here.

Tim Winders:

Maybe this is where the cool

Heather Parady:

so sad.

Heather Parady:

That kind of breaks my heart a little bit.

Heather Parady:

I don't wanna recreate what I'm trying to fight against

Tim Winders:

Now I don't, and I actually don't mean that in a,

Tim Winders:

I didn't mean it to come across in a negative way, but I meant it to be.

Tim Winders:

It's like, ooh, this is a little bit of a different group.

Tim Winders:

first of all, do you notice what Spellcheck does to

Tim Winders:

the word unconventional?

Heather Parady:

no, I haven't.

Heather Parady:

What does it do?

Tim Winders:

Check.

Tim Winders:

I'm it, I'm.

Heather Parady:

Interesting.

Heather Parady:

That would be an awesome video of like spellcheck going back.

Heather Parady:

That'd be a good brand, man.

Tim Winders:

I think about it.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

Just gave you some content idea there.

Tim Winders:

so yeah, that was, it was fascinating to me.

Tim Winders:

But this is the thing I wanna start with first and then I'm, I'll

Tim Winders:

just dive into some other things.

Tim Winders:

The thing I've observed over the last handful of years and time might

Tim Winders:

be a little bit, out outside my scope here, I can't recall, but you,

Tim Winders:

you had unconventional leaders and then, and then I saw some things.

Tim Winders:

I know we've had a guest, Glen, I think you've done some work with Glen Lu.

Tim Winders:

Yeah, he, that's, I, that's, I think it's been a few years ago.

Tim Winders:

And, and then all of a sudden I see NFTs

Tim Winders:

pop in here, which I'm, which I'm, I don't do a lot with NFTs, but

Tim Winders:

I'm big in, invested in crypto and things like that, and I'm going,

Tim Winders:

well, that's kind of interesting.

Tim Winders:

And then I saw something else.

Tim Winders:

So there's been a lot of what I would call transitions.

Heather Parady:

Oh yeah.

Tim Winders:

Or pivots, there's a lot of words we could throw out here.

Tim Winders:

And and one of our big themes here is redefining success.

Tim Winders:

So I'm gonna throw all of that in the pot and hand it over to you and say, how

Tim Winders:

are you defining success today, Heather, what's, where's all this coming from?

Tim Winders:

And where do you think it might be going?

Heather Parady:

it's so fun because when I, alluded to this.

Heather Parady:

Early stages of getting into personal development, learning business and trying

Heather Parady:

to build something from the ground up.

Heather Parady:

you read all these books that give excellent advice, talking about

Heather Parady:

like a vision and a map and a plan and five years and all that.

Heather Parady:

And I did all of that stuff and I think it has its place.

Heather Parady:

Uh, definitely.

Heather Parady:

However, one thing I didn't read a lot about that I've been learning the hard way

Heather Parady:

is seasonal calling and shifts and that, I think it's John Maxwell talk about like

Heather Parady:

failing forward and how the more action you take, the more clarity you receive.

Heather Parady:

But that only comes through a lot of iterations and a lot of failure.

Heather Parady:

And so normally we're like, oh my God, I did this and it didn't work.

Heather Parady:

I'm a failure.

Heather Parady:

Instead of realizing, if you look throughout history, if you read people's

Heather Parady:

biographies, that is the natural system and process in which things evolve.

Heather Parady:

And so when you read, you know, share all that over the past few

Heather Parady:

years, and man, I'm sure you know.

Heather Parady:

That's not that half of it.

Heather Parady:

There's so much more embedded in that, those few years I think.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

That's the process.

Heather Parady:

that's figuring it out.

Heather Parady:

and I'm saying all this to say, if you are working on something and you feel a

Heather Parady:

shift, and I think there's a difference between being unfaithful to something

Heather Parady:

and calling it quits too soon, and you know, in your gut what you're doing.

Heather Parady:

But if you feel like embarrassed almost to shift directions a little bit, I

Heather Parady:

would encourage you to just leap into it.

Heather Parady:

'cause one thing I've been asking myself lately, I used to ask what is my calling?

Heather Parady:

And now I've been asking what is my calling in this season?

Heather Parady:

And so for success for me right now is being faithful to the seasonal

Heather Parady:

call and trusting that the big long-term call is outside of my

Heather Parady:

control and I'm working towards it.

Tim Winders:

Yeah, I may, we may dive into your Bible belt upbringing

Tim Winders:

here, but that word calling is

Tim Winders:

that Yeah, we'll do it, we'll do it, we'll do it with caution.

Tim Winders:

but that word calling, I think, messes with us.

Tim Winders:

I think and, I think some of that, if it's not Bible belt, it's.

Tim Winders:

Mindset about it.

Tim Winders:

we have this thought because we look at some people and they're

Tim Winders:

called, you know, at birth and little Johnny, he's gonna be a preacher.

Tim Winders:

Like so and so was, and all this kind of stuff.

Tim Winders:

And I've actually changed the words for me.

Tim Winders:

This is just for me, I'm not spouting this to everyone else, but

Tim Winders:

I changed the word to assignment.

Tim Winders:

I'm looking for my assignment in God's Kingdom today.

Tim Winders:

And the reason why is because I'm, now, we were talking about this, right?

Tim Winders:

I'm 60 years old and I feel like I'm just getting started,

Tim Winders:

but.

Tim Winders:

I've also been through the Ringer . So what, which story do you want to hear?

Tim Winders:

And so I like that seasonal.

Tim Winders:

I think we're here, there's seasons, there's times that we go through

Tim Winders:

and I think that's what I love and I think that's why we try to

Tim Winders:

tap into that here with, you know, how are you defining success now?

Tim Winders:

And it's sometimes nebulous.

Tim Winders:

It's tough, it's vague and all of that.

Tim Winders:

So.

Tim Winders:

Alright, so let's dive just a little bit,

Heather Parady:

Sure.

Tim Winders:

maybe more than a little bit.

Heather Parady:

I'm an open

Tim Winders:

I think sometimes our, faith in our foundation is one of the

Tim Winders:

things that screws us up in that area.

Tim Winders:

What are your thoughts?

Heather Parady:

Yes.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

Um, you know, growing up, my intention, my calling, if you would, I always

Heather Parady:

said, even since I was a little girl, that I wanted to be in ministry.

Heather Parady:

Like I would, I played church more than I played house.

Heather Parady:

I would set up the teddy bears and I would preach to them, and

Heather Parady:

it was like on my mind, 2, 4, 7.

Heather Parady:

that's the first thing that I pursued when I turned 18.

Heather Parady:

I went all in the, what I'm doing now was never a thought, and honestly

Heather Parady:

it was very painful going into this entrepreneurial path because

Heather Parady:

yeah, it's cool, but for me it was.

Heather Parady:

Plan B when Plan A was more ministerial or what I considered

Heather Parady:

to be ministry at the time.

Heather Parady:

And so leaving that, leaving that context, and I'm happy to

Heather Parady:

answer any question with all that.

Heather Parady:

I just don't wanna derails too much.

Heather Parady:

Um, there was a huge grieving process for me where I felt like I didn't have a

Heather Parady:

calling anymore, that I was disappointing God or I wasn't living to my full

Heather Parady:

potential because it was outside of this construct that I had built in my mind.

Heather Parady:

And honestly, it was taught to me, and it hasn't been, but

Heather Parady:

just a couple years, honestly.

Heather Parady:

I mean, even, you've known me longer than it's, than it's been I've

Heather Parady:

been working so hard on finding my contribution, calling assignment,

Heather Parady:

whatever you wanna call it, through this work, and taking it as seriously

Heather Parady:

as I did when I was within the church.

Heather Parady:

And we say that, and it sounds cute, like, oh, you know, outside the four

Heather Parady:

walls, but when you really wanted that?

Heather Parady:

Um, I felt like a failure a lot, especially in God's eyes.

Heather Parady:

Am am I doing the right thing, et cetera.

Heather Parady:

But I will say outside now, and this is just my experience, I'm not telling people

Heather Parady:

they don't need to go into ministry or leave the church or anything like that.

Heather Parady:

I have felt, honestly, so much more aligned with God and so much more solid

Heather Parady:

in my relationship with the Lord than I've ever felt in my life because there's

Heather Parady:

no middle man in between me and him.

Heather Parady:

There's no church, there's no organization, there's no

Heather Parady:

person, there's no position.

Heather Parady:

It's literally me and God now, and nobody can take that away from me.

Tim Winders:

I like that.

Tim Winders:

as we travel around, we were talking about, you were asking before we started

Tim Winders:

recording, how often do you travel?

Tim Winders:

And we travel, go stay places and move along.

Tim Winders:

And one of the big questions that people ask is about where do you go to church?

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

And the short answer is we usually don't.

Heather Parady:

Mm-Hmm?

Tim Winders:

Go to a church that most people define it as a church

Tim Winders:

and people will ask, are you this or that, or denomination or whatever.

Tim Winders:

And my answer is, it's somewhat snarky, but it fits me is roughly what

Tim Winders:

you just said in a much nicer way.

Tim Winders:

As I'm directly connected, I don't really go through anybody or anything like that.

Tim Winders:

I just sit down and I converse, as best I can

Heather Parady:

Yep.

Tim Winders:

not figured out or anything like that.

Tim Winders:

And you know what, a lot of people don't like that response

Heather Parady:

No Yeah, man.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

It's

Tim Winders:

what are we trained to do?

Tim Winders:

What are what's drilled in us?

Tim Winders:

If we are someone of faith, what are you supposed to do?

Heather Parady:

Be controlled by something else and not God by a

Heather Parady:

manmade organization or entity.

Heather Parady:

And if we can't control you, that scares us.

Heather Parady:

So of course it's met with anger and frustration.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

And so it, I think that's part of the journey that many of us go on

Tim Winders:

is hopefully coming to that realization.

Tim Winders:

It's, I think it's challenging, but you, you kind of had, I mean, almost

Tim Winders:

like a double, triple whammy of it.

Tim Winders:

We homeschooled our kids

Tim Winders:

too.

Tim Winders:

And so when I'm reading my, yeah, it's like awesome.

Tim Winders:

what are some of the things that you're still maybe trying to, I don't know,

Tim Winders:

purge, clean up and all from the way you were raised versus, and I, 'cause

Tim Winders:

I wanna look in the positive too.

Tim Winders:

What are some things that are so cool and such strengths

Tim Winders:

because of that, that you're.

Heather Parady:

Oh man.

Heather Parady:

I think the first thing that came to mind of what I'm questioning and trying

Heather Parady:

to purge is my instinctual response to judge something as right or wrong.

Heather Parady:

I instantly, I will make, I am.

Heather Parady:

is this book cover good or yes or no?

Heather Parady:

Is this?

Heather Parady:

And it's just this quick quick instinctual.

Heather Parady:

Assessment of categories, this is this, this is this.

Heather Parady:

Now there's a lot right that we like, well, Heather, obviously this is this and

Heather Parady:

obviously this is this, and that's not what I'm really talking about so much.

Heather Parady:

It's just like when getting to the point where we're even questioning

Heather Parady:

the, hmm, how do I say this?

Heather Parady:

The context in which we even look at things, you know, so we're not even just

Heather Parady:

questioning this and this anymore, we're questioning the lens in which we look.

Heather Parady:

And I know that can get dangerous because there's also to, I believe in

Heather Parady:

God and I believe that there is a, the universal laws that he's put in place

Heather Parady:

that need to be honored and there is right and wrong, and there is good

Heather Parady:

and evil and et cetera, et cetera.

Heather Parady:

So it's been interesting for me trying to navigate This questioning phase

Heather Parady:

and trying to release judgment and really operate from a sense of love

Heather Parady:

while still holding onto, uh, morals and values and some kind of system.

Heather Parady:

Because you know, when you get into kind of what the cool kids call new

Heather Parady:

age, whatever, you learn about different energies and how there's like a feminine

Heather Parady:

energy and there's a masculine energy.

Heather Parady:

And essentially all that means is there's structure and order, which is good.

Heather Parady:

And then there is flow and freedom, which is good.

Heather Parady:

And sometimes we demonize one or the other when really God created both.

Heather Parady:

It's if not to navigate, that's been really hard.

Heather Parady:

as far as what's good, I love the message of hope that is in the message of Jesus,

Heather Parady:

is that there is redemption, that there is life, that things can be restored.

Heather Parady:

That gets me hype all day long.

Heather Parady:

I believe that with every part of my being, and that's something I hope.

Heather Parady:

That I never let go of.

Tim Winders:

There's a word that's really thrown around a good bit.

Tim Winders:

The word is deconstruction.

Tim Winders:

That I hear it.

Tim Winders:

I try to understand it.

Tim Winders:

My wife and I, just in our prayer time, we actually wonder if we've done quite

Tim Winders:

a bit of it ourselves and I don't know that I think it's that bad of a word.

Tim Winders:

I think I've heard you use it a few times on some interviews I've listened to.

Tim Winders:

You do.

Tim Winders:

And, but I actually think it has a lot of different meanings.

Tim Winders:

if someone's going through what they call deconstruction.

Tim Winders:

What would you wanna share with 'em?

Tim Winders:

What do you wanna tell them?

Tim Winders:

What, what's some encouragement or guidance might even be a better word

Tim Winders:

because it's a, it's a weird word.

Tim Winders:

I hate how people are changing up words in our role today, but,

Heather Parady:

You know, I've noticed as a mom, I've been noticing all these

Heather Parady:

subtle ways that I'm conditioning my kids without realizing it, and I have to stop

Heather Parady:

myself a lot of times where I'll just blow off an answer of kind of that's the way

Heather Parady:

it is, or You need to do this and that.

Heather Parady:

And I'm imposing a lot of, and that man, I don't know, there's an element

Heather Parady:

too where I'm like, okay, you're their mom and you need to guide them.

Heather Parady:

But I'm not guiding them to think as much as I want to do that, like for

Heather Parady:

them to come to their own conclusions.

Heather Parady:

And every time I do that, I think about How that is what

Heather Parady:

happened with me in religion.

Heather Parady:

And I used to be really angry going through the deconstruction process.

Heather Parady:

and now that I'm doing the same things to learn behavior that people

Heather Parady:

don't realize that they're doing.

Heather Parady:

But the repercussions of that is we build of quote, quote, faith on something

Heather Parady:

that was never really our own right.

Heather Parady:

And so deconstruction, it's normal to be angry going through it.

Heather Parady:

Um, on the other side of it, there's gonna be a lot less anger.

Heather Parady:

There's a quote, I'm gonna mess it up, but Jen Cillo, Serato, whoever

Heather Parady:

wrote the, I don't even remember her book's called It's from Louis Howell,

Heather Parady:

one of Louis Howell's interview.

Heather Parady:

She was talking about when folks.

Heather Parady:

get mad at you when you're changing and evolving, that they're actually

Heather Parady:

grieving somebody that they love.

Heather Parady:

So they loved that old you.

Heather Parady:

And then when you're shedding it, they're grieving that person.

Heather Parady:

And that's where a lot of the anger comes from.

Heather Parady:

But all that passes, um, and it's sucks.

Heather Parady:

But man, I'm so glad I went through it.

Heather Parady:

'cause like I said, I think I have more, I know I have way more questions about God

Heather Parady:

and I'm not as sure about a lot of stuff, but at least I know the little bit that

Heather Parady:

we do have together is so freaking real.

Tim Winders:

I think one thing that I noticed because.

Tim Winders:

My wife and I, we did things different like from the get go.

Tim Winders:

We've been married 35 years and so I think what we also did is we made some

Tim Winders:

people around us uncomfortable because they felt as if it was an indictment on

Heather Parady:

Hmm.

Tim Winders:

the way we were raised or, or something.

Tim Winders:

And you know, we all are dealing with whatever we're dealing with.

Tim Winders:

I don't think it was intended that way.

Tim Winders:

And we may have said some things that may have been insensitive and all, and

Tim Winders:

so I do think there's a lot playing out.

Tim Winders:

But I love what you said about your children because we've had conversations

Tim Winders:

with our grown children and.

Tim Winders:

One of them at times said, will say things like, well, this is the way I am because

Tim Winders:

and, and it's sort of joking, but I don't think it's totally, you know, I'm screwed

Tim Winders:

up here because of something you did.

Tim Winders:

And

Tim Winders:

my wife will take that and it'll bother her.

Tim Winders:

But I, my mindset is like, don't put that on me.

Tim Winders:

Say I, we did the best we could with what we had.

Tim Winders:

And you know what, it was pretty darn good.

Tim Winders:

You're on your own now.

Tim Winders:

You work it out with God but that's just my leadership

Heather Parady:

a different between a dad and a mom.

Tim Winders:

It's, she's nurturing and loving on 'em and I'm treating

Tim Winders:

'em like, no y'all, it's all y'all.

Tim Winders:

so that's a whole nother issue but I.

Tim Winders:

the thing that is fascinating to me, and I wanna dig a little bit on this,

Tim Winders:

is at what point were you, I'm gonna use a word that's not a bad word, but I'm

Tim Winders:

gonna use the word addicted, but addicted a Heather 2.0 to a better Heather, to

Tim Winders:

a, something better than you are today.

Tim Winders:

Because one of my favorite books is Mindset by Carol Dweck, where she

Tim Winders:

talks about there's really two types of people we shouldn't group people,

Tim Winders:

we have to be very careful grouping.

Tim Winders:

But she says there really are two people.

Tim Winders:

There's fixed mindset and there's growth mindset, and.

Tim Winders:

As far back as I can remember, I was always, and sometimes too

Tim Winders:

a detriment thinking future.

Tim Winders:

And I've had to dial it down and think more current.

Tim Winders:

can you think back, at what point were you like always looking to

Tim Winders:

the next thing or what can I do better or what can I learn or,

Heather Parady:

man.

Tim Winders:

that is an addiction?

Tim Winders:

That is an addiction by the way, you know that, don't you?

Heather Parady:

it is, and I really resonate with what you said.

Heather Parady:

there is such a light and a dark side to it.

Heather Parady:

I'm, I, I always, Brian gets I'll say he gets tickled by me, not frustrated.

Heather Parady:

'cause I'm just like, this is the way I am.

Heather Parady:

I've all, I don't remember.

Heather Parady:

I'm like you.

Heather Parady:

I don't remember a time that I wasn't Obsessed with, I don't wanna say obsessed,

Heather Parady:

but interested in growth and movement.

Heather Parady:

I think there is a part of my personality that's in it.

Heather Parady:

I will say that I was heavy, heavy, heavy and steered all of

Heather Parady:

that into the church at one point.

Heather Parady:

I mean, everything into that.

Heather Parady:

And then reading personal development, it was a sharp turn where I had to

Heather Parady:

figure out a place for autonomy with faith because With what I grew up

Heather Parady:

in, it was a huge denial of self and almost a martyrdom type vibe.

Heather Parady:

and so shifting into personal development, there was a little bit of tension

Heather Parady:

there because I'm like, okay, how great are you actually supposed to be and

Heather Parady:

how much really is depending on you?

Heather Parady:

And so that's been interesting to try to navigate.

Heather Parady:

I would probably pinpoint your question, although it has been in me since the

Heather Parady:

beginning, starting a business and getting into personal development back

Heather Parady:

in 2000 and seven-ish, I wanna say.

Heather Parady:

No, that's a lie.

Heather Parady:

2012.

Heather Parady:

Okay.

Heather Parady:

Doing the math wrong.

Heather Parady:

that's what really started shifting things for me.

Heather Parady:

But it was really uncomfortable, like I said.

Tim Winders:

Because of that, the kind of, the way I'll call it the

Tim Winders:

sacrificial, but it's, but it's also a false, sacrificial mindset that we have.

Tim Winders:

My wife and I would joke about it at times.

Tim Winders:

We, we still remember going to dinner with a couple when we

Tim Winders:

were newly married, so it's.

Tim Winders:

Where I don't even know truly if I was saved at the point.

Tim Winders:

I, I probably said I was, but probably wasn't.

Tim Winders:

I got saved in a business function shortly after we got married.

Tim Winders:

So I'm different.

Tim Winders:

I didn't do the church thing and all that kind of stuff.

Tim Winders:

So business is where the mission field is for me and always has been.

Tim Winders:

I don't, church world is just church world.

Tim Winders:

I go there and I go, I don't even, I don't even know what's going on here.

Tim Winders:

this is like weird.

Tim Winders:

but we met with this couple and they, I remember this statement.

Tim Winders:

They said, we are worms just passing through this earth.

Tim Winders:

And I remember thinking to myself, I can guarantee you I am not a

Tim Winders:

worm passing through this earth.

Tim Winders:

Now, I may have thought higher of myself than I should, but, and I think that

Tim Winders:

is baked into a lot of, I, we went to Bible school for a couple years

Tim Winders:

and it was, I call it a dickens tale.

Tim Winders:

It was the best of times.

Heather Parady:

can you say where you went?

Heather Parady:

I'm curious

Heather Parady:

it out.

Tim Winders:

up in the,

Tim Winders:

It was up in the mountains of Colorado and all, and it was, a lot of good

Tim Winders:

people, a lot of baked in religion and like you've talked about the hierarchy.

Tim Winders:

Is this the most virtuous thing you could do is going to full-time ministry

Tim Winders:

are actually full-times mission,

Heather Parady:

Mm-Hmm.

Tim Winders:

probably overseas is number one.

Tim Winders:

And then full-time ministry pastor or teacher, preacher

Tim Winders:

and all that kind of stuff.

Tim Winders:

And, and that I, I kept looking at those people and I'm going, I don't think so.

Tim Winders:

And so anyway, I think that is part of what a lot of people that were raised

Tim Winders:

heavy in it have to either come to terms with, I was gonna say overcome,

Tim Winders:

but come to terms with, so what was the business that you started in 2012?

Heather Parady:

I was a photographer.

Heather Parady:

I did freelance photography.

Heather Parady:

Uh, and it just, I was in grad school.

Heather Parady:

My husband was, starting his military journey and I had a kid

Heather Parady:

and it was just the best job to have in the position that I was in.

Heather Parady:

'cause I literally just take my camera out on a Tuesday afternoon

Heather Parady:

if I could, and shoot families.

Heather Parady:

I did weddings, I did all kinds of stuff.

Heather Parady:

And it actually ended up growing because I was learning the business side.

Heather Parady:

I was a good photographer, but I was really good at social

Heather Parady:

media and figuring out all that stuff.

Heather Parady:

And I was like, oh, if you can do that with photos, what

Heather Parady:

else can you do that with?

Heather Parady:

And that's what really looped me into all this was just a little side gig

Tim Winders:

do you call yourself a photographer or was it just a means

Tim Winders:

to an end or a means to the next step?

Heather Parady:

I did at the time.

Heather Parady:

I did it for, I would say about five years.

Heather Parady:

I had, some pretty good success towards the end of it.

Heather Parady:

And here, you know, back to seasonal calling, you asked me that question and

Heather Parady:

here's my camera that I just finished using before I got on the call with you.

Heather Parady:

And now I'm doing videos with the same equipment.

Heather Parady:

I never would've known how to set all this stuff up and aperture and, all

Heather Parady:

the equipment that I would need and lighting had it not been those years.

Heather Parady:

And so there's so many things that you're learning right now in

Heather Parady:

this season that you have no idea what you're gonna use later on.

Tim Winders:

The reason I ask is our son called himself, he wanted

Tim Winders:

to do movies, went out to LA and calls called himself a photographer.

Tim Winders:

He's a hundred K plus over on Instagram now rocking with a bunch of things he's

Tim Winders:

got going on, but it's kind of similar.

Tim Winders:

We had a conversation not too long ago where he says, you know, I

Tim Winders:

don't, I dunno about photography.

Tim Winders:

I think.

Heather Parady:

Hmm.

Tim Winders:

Things like that.

Tim Winders:

So he's kind of discussing some transitions, but still super talented

Tim Winders:

as far as visual and things like that.

Tim Winders:

which I think that you definitely are too.

Tim Winders:

So, so the progression photography, it opened up the doors with,

Tim Winders:

obviously it gave you visions of things that you probably hadn't seen.

Tim Winders:

and then this unconventional leaders started.

Tim Winders:

I gotta ask this before we get too far down the road.

Tim Winders:

At what point did the NFT thing pop in?

Tim Winders:

what was going on there other than it was the hottest thing around

Tim Winders:

for what, about 10 minutes maybe.

Heather Parady:

It came from a natural place.

Heather Parady:

The most pure, natural, I mean it makes me sick how, you know, you can just

Heather Parady:

try and beat your head against the wall with some things and other things you

Heather Parady:

don't try and it's just like So I was at a conference and met a friend there

Heather Parady:

and we both were laughing 'cause we had both had just bought an NFT from Gary

Heather Parady:

Vaynerchuk and I don't recommend this.

Heather Parady:

I'm glad I personally did it.

Heather Parady:

But you know, we trusted Gary back to the branding piece and I still do.

Heather Parady:

We've been following him for years where he said, Hey, I'm

Heather Parady:

coming out with the NFT project.

Heather Parady:

You need in on this.

Heather Parady:

I bought it without knowing what it was.

Heather Parady:

Literally my friend did the same thing.

Heather Parady:

So we said, what we should just hop on a mic.

Heather Parady:

We were both seasoned podcasters.

Heather Parady:

We knew what we were doing.

Heather Parady:

And document us figuring out what we just bought.

Heather Parady:

No other thought than that.

Heather Parady:

We get on a microphone.

Heather Parady:

He's eating Cheetos.

Heather Parady:

I have Google pulled up and we're just having a conversation

Heather Parady:

on a microphone about what is an NFT, what's the blockchain?

Heather Parady:

What's Web3?

Heather Parady:

I didn't know anything about crypto.

Heather Parady:

Nothing.

Heather Parady:

we're talk.

Heather Parady:

We're newbie.

Heather Parady:

Newbie.

Heather Parady:

Well, we just so happened to do that in August of 2021, starting an

Heather Parady:

NFT show in August in 2021, and us faithfully doing it into January, 2021.

Heather Parady:

We had a quarter million downloads January alone, and we were like, oh.

Heather Parady:

Oops, Oops, oops.

Heather Parady:

We didn't mean to.

Heather Parady:

Now what?

Heather Parady:

And so we did it for, I wanna say it was eight months, reached

Heather Parady:

over a million downloads.

Heather Parady:

we turned into a literal business with what we were able to do with it, because

Heather Parady:

we sold some pretty premium sponsorships and closed some pretty interesting stuff.

Heather Parady:

Um, it just so happened he and I both made a decision that we had different

Heather Parady:

goals and that we needed to stop the show before everything plummeted.

Heather Parady:

so it was just kinda like perfect timing.

Heather Parady:

I think there's still stuff we could have done with the

Heather Parady:

brand, but, man, it was my life.

Heather Parady:

I closed down the group.

Heather Parady:

I closed down my show.

Heather Parady:

I went all in because when those moments happen, you gotta jump.

Heather Parady:

And I did

Tim Winders:

What'd you learn from it?

Heather Parady:

never start a business too soon.

Heather Parady:

even if things are working, don't get into a legal entity.

Heather Parady:

Don't I, it's weird because I'm glad I took risks creatively.

Heather Parady:

I had never entered into a business partnership with anybody before.

Heather Parady:

And the way that we did it, I'm not, I understand the circumstances were, out

Heather Parady:

there, but I won't ever do that again.

Heather Parady:

It's entering into a marriage.

Heather Parady:

When you put your name on paper with anyone else, you're

Heather Parady:

entering into a marriage.

Heather Parady:

I will always enter that with reverence moving forward.

Heather Parady:

I also learned that you have to be very careful with your words when you

Heather Parady:

are on a microphone and making sure that you are constantly, it is weird.

Heather Parady:

It's a weird balance between not being fearful.

Heather Parady:

But also too, using wisdom, especially when it comes to finances and money.

Heather Parady:

Now, we always said we're not giving it financial advice.

Heather Parady:

We were very open with, Hey, all this stuff could plummet.

Heather Parady:

We did all that with integrity.

Heather Parady:

I still feel some weight of that though, because even though we never said, Hey,

Heather Parady:

do this, do this, do this, do this.

Heather Parady:

It was such a tricky market and a lot of people lost money, and even though

Heather Parady:

I can stand before God one day and say, I'd hope I didn't cause any of

Heather Parady:

that, it's still waiting on me, man.

Tim Winders:

It is tough.

Tim Winders:

Part of our story was real estate and we had investors and all heading

Tim Winders:

into oh eight and that probably.

Tim Winders:

Hurt my soul really bothered me.

Tim Winders:

Identity-wise and all, as much as almost anything was that I had gone

Tim Winders:

and raised money and gotten money from people and I knew that it

Tim Winders:

wasn't going to be taken care of.

Tim Winders:

So that's, I think that tells you a lot about a person that

Tim Winders:

tells me a great deal about you.

Tim Winders:

That that is one of the takeaways from it.

Tim Winders:

and, and I will say as an executive coach, one of the things that I

Tim Winders:

do very often is clean up messes.

Tim Winders:

When people get into partnerships like that, it's tough.

Tim Winders:

You brought it, I mean, you said it.

Tim Winders:

This is the takeaway.

Tim Winders:

I want people listen.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

It's a podcast.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

We're just getting on the mic, we're talking and all that kind stuff.

Tim Winders:

But it's a marriage.

Tim Winders:

It's a marriage with a lot of tentacles that can, some issues and things.

Heather Parady:

we're still walking through things.

Heather Parady:

we've been closed for now.

Heather Parady:

rich is a great guy, so I'm not saying anything

Heather Parady:

about, you the great dude.

Heather Parady:

It's just a pain in the blessed booty.

Heather Parady:

You know what I mean?

Heather Parady:

And it's not, you really have to ask yourself, is this worth getting married?

Heather Parady:

Because that's what happened.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

And so anyway, that's interesting.

Tim Winders:

All right, so you begin transitioning and then all of a sudden, a few weeks ago, I

Tim Winders:

see the new and Improved Unconventional Leader podcast, which I've binged through.

Tim Winders:

I had a, had about an eight hour drive last week.

Tim Winders:

I've listened to about four or five episodes.

Tim Winders:

Listened to, the guy that worked at Pixar, which is super cool.

Tim Winders:

Rob Bell, which I mean, talk about a great get because controversial,

Tim Winders:

but I love that type of controversy myself, with Rob and stuff, especially

Tim Winders:

if anybody's around church world, they would, he might mess with him.

Tim Winders:

tell me about this iteration and.

Heather Parady:

Thank you for listening.

Heather Parady:

I really appreciate that I have been uh, dancing around how I really feel

Heather Parady:

about things in the online space, since I started really, like I told you, I

Heather Parady:

transitioned from kind of ministry church.

Heather Parady:

very strong.

Heather Parady:

Conviction of the way things were.

Heather Parady:

And then when all that started, here's your word, deconstructing.

Heather Parady:

In the online space, I would allude to different things I felt and so

Heather Parady:

forth, but I was, I've always been hyper afraid of offending people.

Heather Parady:

I don't wanna offend you, there's that mama coming out in me, you know, uh,

Heather Parady:

it was last year, I wanna say it was at the Summit of Greatness Lewis house,

Heather Parady:

and I was sitting in the auditorium and I felt really strong in my spirit

Heather Parady:

that God said, you are entering into your life's work this next season.

Heather Parady:

And I'm not saying it's this show, but I feel a shift in me to start

Heather Parady:

having those conversations I've been afraid to have going deeper.

Heather Parady:

My shows have always been very short.

Heather Parady:

We're doing it a little bit longer.

Heather Parady:

and just a non expectation make a show for me.

Heather Parady:

And, going back to the unconventional part, I've never let that go.

Heather Parady:

And that's been interesting too, is sometimes you lay things down,

Heather Parady:

you can pick 'em back up again.

Heather Parady:

And so that's where we're at with this.

Heather Parady:

I'm, I'm, I'm letting go of the need to monetize this or grow this.

Heather Parady:

I had a coach earlier this year, it was set me free man.

Heather Parady:

but he encouraged me.

Heather Parady:

He said, you can separate your clients from your audience and that's okay.

Heather Parady:

And, uh, you know, in the online space, build a funnel and drive leads this way.

Heather Parady:

For me personally, I haven't yet, found a better way for leads in at least a

Heather Parady:

service-based business than word of mouth.

Heather Parady:

So that's worked fine for me.

Heather Parady:

I don't need to necessarily create content for the folks that

Heather Parady:

I'm Working within my business.

Heather Parady:

I don't want to, I don't wanna talk about operations and process on Instagram.

Heather Parady:

I do wanna talk about pop culture and spirituality and the four

Heather Parady:

agreements and those forth.

Heather Parady:

And it's fine if these folks never buy a thing from me.

Heather Parady:

'cause honestly, they don't have nothing to sell 'em right now.

Heather Parady:

And it feels real freeing right now.

Heather Parady:

So.

Tim Winders:

What does it do for especially, this, we'll even

Tim Winders:

tie this in back to what we were talking about earlier with the way

Tim Winders:

you were brought up and raised.

Tim Winders:

What does it do when all of a sudden you're creating?

Tim Winders:

And, I've got some questions about your creative process here shortly.

Tim Winders:

But what does it do when you're creating and dollar signs?

Tim Winders:

Keep . Ching ching ching in around your head or you, you look at something

Tim Winders:

you're creating and you're thinking to yourself, this has to have ROI.

Tim Winders:

It's gotta have return be because I've been through a similar process as

Tim Winders:

you have with the coaching that I do.

Tim Winders:

What I'm doing with this show, and just like you said, I've come

Tim Winders:

to terms that this right here, this show for me, it's for me.

Tim Winders:

It's so that I can reach out to Heather and say, Hey, can you

Tim Winders:

have a one hour conversation?

Tim Winders:

Now it's good and I think people are gonna listen in and it's gonna be

Tim Winders:

awesome and they're gonna get stuff.

Tim Winders:

It's for me.

Tim Winders:

So talk about money and how it can mess, especially people maybe that

Tim Winders:

were raised a little bit the way we were raised in church world or

Tim Winders:

you were raised in church world.

Tim Winders:

does that add anything to it or does it matter?

Heather Parady:

I think what's coming up for me when you're talking is this

Heather Parady:

strong realization since newbie, since the NFT show, and that was where, and

Heather Parady:

Rich has talked about this publicly too, we had a split in the road where he's

Heather Parady:

an entrepreneur and I am a creative, now I am entrepreneurial, right?

Heather Parady:

I have a business so I can go and create and seek and I, that's the

Heather Parady:

reason I have a business is it gives me a life of freedom to explore.

Heather Parady:

Now, other folks create, because they're entrepreneurs and

Heather Parady:

they're using that as a tool.

Heather Parady:

For their entrepreneurship.

Heather Parady:

And when I figured that out, and it was through the brimstone and the

Heather Parady:

hard stuff with Rich, I was like, oh.

Heather Parady:

So now when I create, I don't, the only ROI, and I'll talk about

Heather Parady:

this in a second, is the reach that I struggle with, the money.

Heather Parady:

I've let go of that.

Heather Parady:

I've made money through content.

Heather Parady:

This, we made a lot, quite a bit of money from the show through

Heather Parady:

our sponsorships and stuff.

Heather Parady:

Um, I didn't feel better about that.

Heather Parady:

If anything else, it added so much pressure to the creative work.

Heather Parady:

It didn't feel good to dollar signs don't really come up for me with this.

Heather Parady:

now what I struggle with is keeping my ego out with reach and likes

Heather Parady:

and comments and all of that.

Heather Parady:

I'm constantly having to check myself on that to, you know, I say I.

Heather Parady:

that I wanna make an impact through my work and et cetera, but I get

Heather Parady:

frustrated if something, doesn't pop the way this other thing worked.

Heather Parady:

Or I'll be like, okay, what do we need to do to, fix this hook?

Heather Parady:

and all that's good.

Heather Parady:

The tactics are good if they're a tool again, as a part as opposed to the God.

Heather Parady:

And that's what's been interesting for me over the past little bit.

Heather Parady:

So it's not money for me, it's the ego of, views and likes and comments, which

Heather Parady:

I would love to sit here and say, oh Tim, I don't struggle with that, but I do.

Heather Parady:

And, sometimes I need to put all this stuff away and step

Heather Parady:

away and keep my phone off.

Heather Parady:

I've been doing that a lot lately.

Heather Parady:

Just putting the phone down 'cause it doesn't matter.

Heather Parady:

I dunno if that answers your question,

Tim Winders:

does some of that reach, does some of that impact your mood?

Tim Winders:

Do you notice your mood going up and down based on, oh, this one?

Tim Winders:

Look, I was talking to my son the other day.

Tim Winders:

He, I.

Tim Winders:

Literally threw up a reel.

Tim Winders:

And when I say threw it up, he took an image and put a, not a

Tim Winders:

cartoon, a graphic fire going.

Tim Winders:

So it was a still image.

Tim Winders:

And, you know, I don't know what viral means today, today's world, but you

Tim Winders:

know, he's, he's, added like 5,000 followers from that reel on Instagram.

Tim Winders:

and I asked, I kinda asked the same question.

Tim Winders:

I said, are you in a better mood than you were last week when the one that

Tim Winders:

you put up that you thought was awesome, didn't, and you know what he said, I'll

Tim Winders:

say this, and then you could respond.

Tim Winders:

He said, it actually bothers me.

Tim Winders:

He says, 'cause I'm not sure exactly how to duplicate.

Heather Parady:

Oh, I could kick it with him.

Heather Parady:

Like I, yeah, I get that a lot.

Heather Parady:

Um, I don't.

Heather Parady:

So my mood, I don't think it affects my mood as much.

Heather Parady:

What I've been aware of is my temptation to alter the content based

Heather Parady:

on what I know works versus what I feel like I'm being called to say.

Heather Parady:

Let me give you an example.

Heather Parady:

I know what works right now in my reels is very tactical information

Heather Parady:

coming from a celebrity's mouth.

Heather Parady:

If I say that, um, who's somebody famous right now?

Heather Parady:

my mind's just gone blank.

Heather Parady:

I can't remember.

Heather Parady:

One famous person, Jim Carrey.

Heather Parady:

Jim Carrey says that if you do these three things, you'll get

Heather Parady:

a thousand dollars in a month.

Heather Parady:

1, 2, 3, that will pop.

Heather Parady:

Now, that's hard to find that information, but what I.

Heather Parady:

want to say on this is I always wanna tie things back to like spirituality

Heather Parady:

or personal development, and that's the non-sexy part of the content

Heather Parady:

that people don't really wanna hear.

Heather Parady:

And so there's a huge temptation for me to be like, Ugh, what works?

Heather Parady:

Versus what am I supposed to say right now?

Heather Parady:

Um, that's my biggest struggle.

Tim Winders:

And I did, I think I looked at your Instagram feed last night and you,

Tim Winders:

there's definitely that style where Trevor Noah and others, you're so that, so you

Tim Winders:

must be hitting on, on something there.

Tim Winders:

There's a word, and I don't know if it's a good word that I introduced

Tim Winders:

you with, or a bad word, because, 'cause I heard something that you,

Tim Winders:

that might have contradicted, but there's the word authenticity.

Tim Winders:

That's a weird word.

Tim Winders:

And I think in our culture today, and th this is, I'm about to be cynical,

Tim Winders:

I'm just letting people know there's about to be a cynical statement

Tim Winders:

that's gonna lead to a question.

Tim Winders:

My cynical statement is, it amazes me how hard people are working.

Tim Winders:

At being authentic In our world we're in today, they are working extremely

Tim Winders:

hard and, but I actually, I saw in description of you the word authentic,

Tim Winders:

but then I also, there was something I was listening to where you, I think it

Tim Winders:

was a short or reel that you did that was something about authentic isn't

Tim Winders:

what our, isn't what we're shooting for.

Tim Winders:

Sometimes we need to make a change.

Tim Winders:

We need to adjust, we need to be somebody else, not ourselves.

Tim Winders:

So talk about authenticity.

Heather Parady:

man, that, that hit a button.

Heather Parady:

When I posted that, I got so many dms.

Heather Parady:

Some people loved it.

Heather Parady:

Some people were mad at me.

Heather Parady:

What was.

Heather Parady:

I was trying to say through that is everyone says be authentic,

Heather Parady:

which is good to a degree.

Heather Parady:

We wanna be honest, we wanna be ourselves, we want to be transparent because

Heather Parady:

we don't want, everybody can agree.

Heather Parady:

Everybody's nodding their heads.

Heather Parady:

Of course.

Heather Parady:

Where it gets interesting is when we use that as an excuse

Heather Parady:

to roll over other people.

Heather Parady:

Um, do what we know is not right.

Heather Parady:

Be lazy.

Heather Parady:

Make excuses, because I'm being quote, authentic.

Heather Parady:

So what the intention of the video was, a call to a higher self and who you

Heather Parady:

really are deep down who, not that worm crawling through the ground, but you know.

Heather Parady:

The great Tim and the great heather that's inside of us.

Heather Parady:

And that is the most authentic version of you.

Heather Parady:

Now, that doesn't mean that I'm not gonna sit here on your podcast and

Heather Parady:

say, I struggle with ego Sometimes I struggle with insecurity.

Heather Parady:

I struggle, being, making sure that I'm being in alignment with my work and

Heather Parady:

doing the right things that's authentic.

Heather Parady:

I hope it is, but be coming in and, telling my kids that I just

Heather Parady:

don't feel like making them dinner tonight because your mom's tired.

Heather Parady:

You know what I mean?

Heather Parady:

come on, And I think, especially, not to get like this generation blah, blah, blah.

Heather Parady:

'cause that's a bunch of bss, all generations have their thing.

Heather Parady:

It's popular now.

Heather Parady:

Um, and it's unique to this time because we haven't had social media

Heather Parady:

before where it's elevating this.

Heather Parady:

Sense of self where it is all just about you and your feelings.

Heather Parady:

And again, that's good, but now we're overcompensating where I think the message

Heather Parady:

needs to be counterbalanced with humanity and empathy and awareness that we're

Heather Parady:

all a whole and what I do affects you.

Tim Winders:

think one of the, my measures of success with social media is, we were

Tim Winders:

talking about this before we clicked on, is that with the post I did recently, I

Tim Winders:

was able to connect with your dad, which was so kind of cool, and we had a little

Tim Winders:

dialogue back and forth and hopefully encouraged each other and stuff like that.

Tim Winders:

That's, I think that's a good value there.

Tim Winders:

Uh, related to leadership, content creation, anything

Tim Winders:

like that in your mind they are definitive and they are absolutes?

Tim Winders:

Or are we getting to a place where most things are fluid?

Tim Winders:

I don't know if that's the right word.

Tim Winders:

And then, the, based on how you respond to this, I've got

Tim Winders:

a follow up question to that.

Tim Winders:

So anything that you're, like,

Tim Winders:

as you've gone through your journey, 'cause you've got, this is a

Tim Winders:

success journey we're going through.

Tim Winders:

anything that you're going, like this is solid.

Tim Winders:

And if the answer's no, that's okay.

Heather Parady:

What?

Heather Parady:

You asked the best questions.

Heather Parady:

This is so deep.

Heather Parady:

I have to think about this for a minute.

Tim Winders:

While you're thinking, let me follow up with it.

Tim Winders:

Here's the reason, here's the reason why

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

the reason why I asked that.

Tim Winders:

Is because the more I go through this journey, the less I recognize.

Tim Winders:

I know.

Tim Winders:

And,

Tim Winders:

and I went through that personal development phase that you did where

Tim Winders:

you have someone like me, I could guarantee you they looked like me.

Tim Winders:

That stood up.

Tim Winders:

'cause I used to do this.

Tim Winders:

And I would say, there are three keys to success and here are

Tim Winders:

those three keys to success.

Tim Winders:

It's do this, do this, do this, and whatever you do, never do this.

Tim Winders:

And I'm getting to where I can't think of any of the, now I, there's things

Tim Winders:

that I can recommend and say this might, but anyway, that, that's the.

Tim Winders:

The depth of the question because, and it, and the reason I'm

Tim Winders:

asking it, it is generational.

Tim Winders:

I've got someone here that's not my generation and I do love to kind of see

Tim Winders:

where you are with that, so it's too deep.

Tim Winders:

We could, I

Heather Parady:

No, I love

Tim Winders:

favorite color.

Heather Parady:

It's great.

Heather Parady:

It's great.

Heather Parady:

I think what came up for me, the only thing that I'm sure of right now is our

Heather Parady:

makeup as humans and what we want and desire, I don't think is questionable.

Heather Parady:

I don't think we can question that.

Heather Parady:

We wanna be loved, we desire belonging.

Heather Parady:

There's a deep need for contribution and purpose.

Heather Parady:

And for me, that's the only solid thing.

Heather Parady:

Now how we go about achieving those and doing it, I think that's where it gets.

Heather Parady:

Foggy and interesting and different people's perception of, you know,

Heather Parady:

how they feel belonging and all that.

Heather Parady:

But the truth is we all need that.

Heather Parady:

And I think that's what ties us together and connects us, and we

Heather Parady:

have to remember, besides that, man, I don't know, that's, I'm gonna be

Heather Parady:

thinking on that for like a week.

Tim Winders:

The, the thing that I like about what you're doing with

Tim Winders:

unconventional leaders is that I think this is really the root of the question

Tim Winders:

is that I think you're probably tapping into the individuality of leadership.

Heather Parady:

Hmm.

Tim Winders:

I think we want to formulate, I'm an engineer.

Tim Winders:

I'd love to come up with the three or the seven or the whatever, and I could do it,

Tim Winders:

but I could tell you I'm getting less and less confident in those threes and sevens.

Tim Winders:

I'm getting less and less confident in the always or nevers, and I'm 60.

Tim Winders:

I'm a couple years, I'm a lot of years older than you.

Tim Winders:

I'm old to be your dad.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

I think that's the beauty of unconventional leaders.

Tim Winders:

I think we've seen leaders for way too long, and they're, many of 'em are my

Tim Winders:

generation that they have absolutes and those absolutes, they are saying it

Tim Winders:

with loud, authoritative voices, and I think people are getting tired of that.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

And so I'm seeing you and maybe we're trying to hear, I don't know,

Tim Winders:

I'm seeing some people trying to uh, unpack, I hate that word, but unpack or,

Tim Winders:

or bust it up or something like that.

Tim Winders:

And, and I love what I'm hearing there.

Tim Winders:

tell me some things.

Tim Winders:

Gimme a, I know you aren't thinking too far ahead.

Tim Winders:

With what you're doing there, it's kind of unfolding.

Tim Winders:

I, I can sort of tell if I'm wrong and you've got a five-year plan, you could let

Tim Winders:

me know, but seems like it's unfolding.

Tim Winders:

What are some things in the very not too distant horizon if somebody's listening

Tim Winders:

in, maybe in early 2024 that, that they might get to a look for if they jump over

Tim Winders:

and listen in at Unconventional Leaders.

Heather Parady:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

Media.

Heather Parady:

media.

Heather Parady:

Media, that's the future right now.

Heather Parady:

wanted to, for several years get more involved and intentional with

Heather Parady:

not only what I create, but helping other folks on that side of things.

Heather Parady:

I think it's a really power, it is such a powerful tool that we can

Heather Parady:

use to reach folks and to give hope.

Heather Parady:

I mean, like it or not, I could argue both sides, but it's here to stay.

Heather Parady:

And digital identity is a really interesting conversation about people

Heather Parady:

finding themselves in this other world.

Heather Parady:

And whether that's right or wrong, it's the truth.

Heather Parady:

And we've gotta figure out how to bring light and hope into those places.

Heather Parady:

So right now it's through Instagram feeds or podcast feeds.

Heather Parady:

when my kids get older it gives me anxiety even thinking about it.

Heather Parady:

But, it's through these games and these avatars and so forth.

Heather Parady:

And again, I'm not saying it's right or wrong, it's just the way that it is.

Heather Parady:

So I want to figure out more ways to bring this message, un unconventional leadership

Heather Parady:

of Hope God love Light into these places.

Heather Parady:

Right now, this is just through storytelling and reels.

Heather Parady:

I recently started doing some scripting work for different people, which has

Heather Parady:

been really fun trying to help them with their, short form and stuff.

Heather Parady:

So more of that man.

Heather Parady:

the word bridge has been on my heart a lot lately, and I've always felt that way.

Heather Parady:

growing up I was one of those folks 'cause of my personality that I could

Heather Parady:

roll in different groups pretty well.

Heather Parady:

And then even two at my age as a millennial, 'cause I'm not young anymore.

Heather Parady:

So I'm this weird bridge age where I can get folks older than

Heather Parady:

me and then I also get Gen Z.

Heather Parady:

And so through the work, my hope is to be able to be a bridge between

Heather Parady:

different worlds and more connection.

Heather Parady:

That's why the reels I do Trevor Noah, and then talk about the four

Heather Parady:

agreements, because it's a bridge.

Heather Parady:

Folks aren't looking for this, they're looking for this.

Heather Parady:

If we could bridge these two together, they get to this, right?

Heather Parady:

I'm sorry, audio folks.

Heather Parady:

I'm doing an analogies you can't see.

Heather Parady:

Um, that's really,

Tim Winders:

watching in, yeah.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Heather Parady:

that's messy.

Heather Parady:

Tim.

Heather Parady:

I hope that made sense.

Heather Parady:

But media is on my heart.

Heather Parady:

Storytelling, and then hopefully using that as a bridge to reach folks.

Tim Winders:

I think that is good and I see that, and part of the evidence

Tim Winders:

of that, Heather, is that we're having this conversation here, is that you

Tim Winders:

and I are conversing in, different generations, probably different a a

Tim Winders:

lot of different, but yet I said, Hmm, I wonder if, I wonder if Heather would

Tim Winders:

come on the show with us and chit chat and so I think that's evidence

Tim Winders:

that you're moving in that direction.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

Bridge connector.

Tim Winders:

You know what, whatever words, I think bridge is a great visual, but I.

Heather Parady:

Thank you

Tim Winders:

I, the word peacemaker is this word that

Tim Winders:

keeps popping up in my mind.

Tim Winders:

It's a little bit more of a, of a biblical word, but peacemaker is weird.

Tim Winders:

There's a lot of ugly in the world.

Tim Winders:

And I think it was Google that used to have a don't be evil is their, one of

Tim Winders:

their underlying mottoes or whatever.

Tim Winders:

I'm not gonna be one to judge, but they may not be adhering to that.

Tim Winders:

Totally.

Tim Winders:

Now.

Tim Winders:

And I think with all these tools, like you're saying, I just, I

Tim Winders:

don't want us to use it for evil.

Tim Winders:

I want us to use all this for good.

Tim Winders:

And it seems like that's what you're trying to do.

Tim Winders:

Is that right?

Heather Parady:

I sure hope so, man.

Heather Parady:

I sure hope so.

Heather Parady:

I'm so grateful I'm entering into this work in my mid

Heather Parady:

thirties, late thirties now.

Heather Parady:

it's interesting.

Heather Parady:

I can't imagine not having any kind of foundation being handed all this stuff,

Heather Parady:

but also too, you know, I mean, they're not gonna know anything different.

Heather Parady:

it's just a different world we're coming into and instead of being fearful

Heather Parady:

and afraid and pointing fingers and fighting it, I feel like Us older folks.

Heather Parady:

'cause I'm gonna say I'm older too, Tim.

Heather Parady:

I am.

Heather Parady:

Like, I'm 37, that's okay.

Heather Parady:

I know you're shaking your head but for the folks I roll with, I am like,

Heather Parady:

they're so young and, uh, I don't know.

Heather Parady:

People are looking for guides and people who go before them and light the way, and

Heather Parady:

I hope, hope, God, that I can do that.

Tim Winders:

Yeah, there's a real deficit of hope out there and I think

Tim Winders:

some of us are trying to deliver that.

Tim Winders:

Heather, where can people find you?

Tim Winders:

Give us, give us all your coordinates.

Tim Winders:

I think we've mentioned the podcast, but podcast Instagram

Tim Winders:

seems like pretty high areas.

Tim Winders:

Tell us that.

Tim Winders:

And then one more question before we finish.

Heather Parady:

Sure.

Heather Parady:

At Heather parody pretty much everywhere except for LinkedIn and Snapchat

Heather Parady:

because I can't bridge those two worlds.

Heather Parady:

That's just too much for me.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

Are, do you do much on YouTube?

Heather Parady:

We're starting to, I'm putting a little bit more attention

Heather Parady:

into putting the podcast on YouTube.

Heather Parady:

I'm editing everything, I do all the edits.

Heather Parady:

so it's slow and it's clunky, but 'cause it takes a long time.

Heather Parady:

But yeah, we have a YouTube channel.

Tim Winders:

Okay, good.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

Make sure everyone go check that out and right when you finish here,

Tim Winders:

go over to unconventional leaders.

Tim Winders:

It's a, it's really a good fit for some of the conversations.

Tim Winders:

A lot of the conversations that we have here, Heather, we are

Tim Winders:

seek, go create those three words.

Tim Winders:

I think you mentioned 'em a few times that we were talking.

Tim Winders:

We'll let you choose one over the other two.

Tim Winders:

My final question, one, seek, go or create and why?

Heather Parady:

My instinct is to say go or create, but I'm gonna pick, seek.

Heather Parady:

Okay.

Heather Parady:

It's probably my least favorite word out of all three of those, but

Heather Parady:

it's the one that I've been really drawn to lately because I'm like,

Heather Parady:

yo, if you wanna go and you wanna create, you gotta first seek, right?

Heather Parady:

Curiosity, openness, student mentality, childlike, Lord Jesus.

Tim Winders:

That's good.

Tim Winders:

That was, there's a reason the Lord gave 'em to me in that order because

Tim Winders:

I used to go, go, go and then create.

Tim Winders:

And he said, I need you to slow down a little bit before you

Heather Parady:

me.

Tim Winders:

go.

Tim Winders:

So Heather, thank you for this conversation,

Tim Winders:

man.

Tim Winders:

I knew I would love it and I did.

Tim Winders:

go check out Unconventional Leader, go Listen, go subscribe.

Tim Winders:

There's some great episodes that I've listened to just in the last week.

Tim Winders:

Go check those out and follow Heather and all the places and cheer her on

Tim Winders:

wherever you can go, cheer her on.

Tim Winders:

I appreciate you listening in here.

Tim Winders:

We are episodes.

Tim Winders:

Until next time,

About the Podcast

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Seek Go Create
Redefining Success in Leadership, Business & Ministry

About your host

Profile picture for Tim Winders

Tim Winders

Tim Winders is a faith driven executive coach and author with over 40 years of experience in leadership, business, and ministry. Through his personal journey of redefining success, he has gained valuable insights on how to align beliefs with work and lead with purpose. He is committed to helping others do the same, running a coaching business that helps leaders, leadership teams, business owners, and entrepreneurs to align their beliefs with their work and redefine success.

In addition to his coaching business, Tim is also the host of the SeekGoCreate podcast and author of the book Coach: A Story of Success Redefined, which provides guidance for those looking to redefine success and align their beliefs with their work. With his extensive background, unique perspective and strengths in strategic thinking, relationship building, and problem-solving, Tim is well-suited to help clients navigate through difficult times and achieve their goals.