Fishing on the Other Side: The Importance of Marketplace Ministry with Joshua Brown

Joshua Brown: 00:00:00

I was the guy that thought I lost my identity as a

Joshua Brown: 00:00:04

result of not having the position I.

Joshua Brown: 00:00:06

Inside the pulpit or inside of a denomination.

Joshua Brown: 00:00:11

And

Joshua Brown: 00:00:12

Now I'm able to share my testimony with anybody that I

Joshua Brown: 00:00:15

meet inside the business world.

Joshua Brown: 00:00:17

And I am quick to share what God has done for me because God's been so good to me.

Tim Winders: 00:00:38

Welcome

Tim Winders: 00:00:38

everyone to Seek Go Create.

Tim Winders: 00:00:41

This is the raspy voiced Tim Winders

Tim Winders: 00:00:45

coming to you.

Tim Winders: 00:00:46

I'm an executive coach, but right

Tim Winders: 00:00:48

now I sound like an

Tim Winders: 00:00:49

a late night FM disc

Tim Winders: 00:00:50

jockey.

Tim Winders: 00:00:51

I am just coming out of about 24 hours where I had no voice.

Tim Winders: 00:00:56

So bear with us here.

Tim Winders: 00:00:58

We've got a great conversation.

Tim Winders: 00:00:59

This

Tim Winders: 00:01:00

is where we redefine success in leadership, business and in

Tim Winders: 00:01:03

ministry.

Tim Winders: 00:01:04

Great conversations, and we've got one Today I am gonna be speaking

Tim Winders: 00:01:08

with and having a conversation with Joshua Brown.

Tim Winders: 00:01:12

He's the founder of Pressure Washing Pastor, a business

Tim Winders: 00:01:15

that seeks to inspire and challenge people to start pressure washing

Tim Winders: 00:01:19

companies in their cities.

Tim Winders: 00:01:22

And he does that because he believes pressure washing can provide job

Tim Winders: 00:01:24

opportunities, create disciples, and benefit the community.

Tim Winders: 00:01:29

I agree with that.

Tim Winders: 00:01:30

Joshua, welcome to Seek Go

Tim Winders: 00:01:32

Create.

Joshua Brown: 00:01:33

Hey, thank you, Tim.

Joshua Brown: 00:01:34

Appreciate you having me on your show.

Joshua Brown: 00:01:36

I'm a huge fan.

Joshua Brown: 00:01:37

You've been following you for about a year now, and I'm honored

Tim Winders: 00:01:39

to be here.

Tim Winders: 00:01:40

Thanks.

Tim Winders: 00:01:41

How's my voice coming in?

Tim Winders: 00:01:42

Is it doing okay for you?

Joshua Brown: 00:01:43

It's sexy.

Joshua Brown: 00:01:44

Sounds like you belong on a Star Wars film.

Tim Winders: 00:01:46

I'm pretty sure.

Tim Winders: 00:01:49

All right, Joshua.

Tim Winders: 00:01:50

Hey, let's get going.

Tim Winders: 00:01:51

First question right outta the gate gave you a little bit of warning.

Tim Winders: 00:01:55

We just bump

Tim Winders: 00:01:55

into each other and I say, Joshua, what do you do?

Tim Winders: 00:01:58

What

Tim Winders: 00:01:58

would be something you would typically tell people?

Tim Winders: 00:02:01

I

Joshua Brown: 00:02:01

think I would say I'm a former vocational pastor

Joshua Brown: 00:02:04

turned

Joshua Brown: 00:02:05

minister in the marketplace and inviting others to do the same.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:11

How's

Joshua Brown: 00:02:11

that work?

Tim Winders: 00:02:12

That sounds good.

Tim Winders: 00:02:13

A lot of words

Tim Winders: 00:02:14

there, but I'm, yeah,

Joshua Brown: 00:02:16

I tried to simplify it.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:17

It's not

Joshua Brown: 00:02:17

easy.

Tim Winders: 00:02:19

Background in ministry, doing work

Tim Winders: 00:02:22

in the marketplace, and and you're combining both of

Tim Winders: 00:02:25

of those Correct.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:27

Yes,

Joshua Brown: 00:02:27

sir.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:28

My identity didn't change when I left the four walls of the church.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:32

I was the same person outside that I was inside.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:36

It took me a while to figure that out once I left vocational

Joshua Brown: 00:02:39

ministry.

Joshua Brown: 00:02:40

So

Tim Winders: 00:02:41

one of the things that I

Tim Winders: 00:02:42

like to do here and that is maybe

Tim Winders: 00:02:44

get

Tim Winders: 00:02:44

get people's attention right

Tim Winders: 00:02:46

at the start, and

Tim Winders: 00:02:48

I know we've got

Tim Winders: 00:02:49

business people, we've got people in ministry, we've got people

Tim Winders: 00:02:51

that are faith

Tim Winders: 00:02:52

people.

Tim Winders: 00:02:53

But

Tim Winders: 00:02:54

you shared some numbers

Tim Winders: 00:02:57

from your business with me when we

Tim Winders: 00:02:59

had a brief conversation a

Tim Winders: 00:03:00

while

Tim Winders: 00:03:00

back.

Tim Winders: 00:03:02

Yeah.

Tim Winders: 00:03:02

And to me that, that sort of grabbed me

Tim Winders: 00:03:04

because a lot of people will talk about doing

Tim Winders: 00:03:06

business and they can be kinda

Tim Winders: 00:03:07

limping along and,

Tim Winders: 00:03:09

Generating a

Tim Winders: 00:03:09

little bit, but it's hobbyish.

Tim Winders: 00:03:13

Can you give, just

Tim Winders: 00:03:14

quickly as we start

Tim Winders: 00:03:16

the,

Tim Winders: 00:03:17

I think you said

Tim Winders: 00:03:17

revenue numbers is

Tim Winders: 00:03:18

is what you did, just

Tim Winders: 00:03:19

the

Tim Winders: 00:03:19

progression of your pressure washing business over the last few

Joshua Brown: 00:03:23

years?

Joshua Brown: 00:03:23

For sure.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:24

Yeah, I started the business after high school, church camp.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:28

I was still full-time as a student pastor, campus pastor and connections

Joshua Brown: 00:03:32

pastor at a church, about 550.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:35

And when I got back from church camp, I played around with pressure Washington.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:40

And then in 2017 I was like, you know what?

Joshua Brown: 00:03:42

know what?

Joshua Brown: 00:03:42

I

Joshua Brown: 00:03:42

think

Joshua Brown: 00:03:43

I can do this.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:44

I stayed in ministry for the next three years, but my first full year 2017, I

Joshua Brown: 00:03:48

did 225,000 inside of pressure washing.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:52

The next year was around four 50 $450,000.

Joshua Brown: 00:03:56

The next year was around 700 and plus thousand, and then the next almost

Joshua Brown: 00:04:00

a million dollars, about 900 or so.

Joshua Brown: 00:04:03

And so within four years, we almost hit a million dollars in pressure

Joshua Brown: 00:04:06

washing, and that was with me working full-time inside of a church.

Tim Winders: 00:04:15

Oh, so see the reason I

Tim Winders: 00:04:18

bring that up, And I'm sure you've run across this, and we could be candid as

Tim Winders: 00:04:23

a lot of people would think something like a pressure washing business.

Tim Winders: 00:04:28

We use the word

Tim Winders: 00:04:29

business,

Tim Winders: 00:04:30

Yeah.

Tim Winders: 00:04:30

But sometimes it may be considered part-time.

Tim Winders: 00:04:34

They

Tim Winders: 00:04:34

do it on the side, which

Tim Winders: 00:04:36

you were doing it

Tim Winders: 00:04:36

on the side, but sounds like you had two full-time gigs is what you

Tim Winders: 00:04:39

really had.

Tim Winders: 00:04:41

But I'm sure you've run into people that have said I like the

Tim Winders: 00:04:44

thought of pressure washing, but

Tim Winders: 00:04:45

how much

Tim Winders: 00:04:46

can you really make?

Tim Winders: 00:04:47

Have you heard that?

Joshua Brown: 00:04:49

Yeah I've heard that as well.

Joshua Brown: 00:04:50

And then I hear, since we're super candid I've had folks l see where I'm at now,

Joshua Brown: 00:04:57

pastors, and they say, the reason of your success is because you have so much money,

Joshua Brown: 00:05:03

marketing connections, blah, blah, blah.

Joshua Brown: 00:05:06

And I'm like, I was on a student pastor payroll for 20 years in ministry.

Joshua Brown: 00:05:13

I had at

Joshua Brown: 00:05:15

at

Joshua Brown: 00:05:15

four kids.

Joshua Brown: 00:05:16

My wife was a stay-at-home mom,

Joshua Brown: 00:05:18

And so I didn't

Joshua Brown: 00:05:19

have time, I didn't have money, but I did have framework

Joshua Brown: 00:05:22

And

Joshua Brown: 00:05:22

I feel like if we address the framework we're working with, we

Joshua Brown: 00:05:26

might be able to work with less time, less money and get things done.

Tim Winders: 00:05:30

Yeah.

Tim Winders: 00:05:31

I'm not gonna ask you this, you might could

Tim Winders: 00:05:32

share briefly, but

Tim Winders: 00:05:34

it would be

Tim Winders: 00:05:35

interesting to contrast the

Tim Winders: 00:05:39

financial, the

Tim Winders: 00:05:41

salary, the reward of

Tim Winders: 00:05:43

the pressure washing business

Tim Winders: 00:05:45

versus student pastoring.

Tim Winders: 00:05:47

I'm sure that

Tim Winders: 00:05:49

in 2017 the pressure washing business far surpassed

Tim Winders: 00:05:53

what you were making as a student pastor.

Tim Winders: 00:05:55

Would that be

Tim Winders: 00:05:55

a correct statement?

Tim Winders: 00:05:57

If I

Joshua Brown: 00:05:57

chose to utilize the profits for pay, that would be

Joshua Brown: 00:06:02

very correct, but I had a mindset.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:05

Of Monopoly and I

Joshua Brown: 00:06:07

wanted to

Joshua Brown: 00:06:07

buy every piece of property, every street that

Joshua Brown: 00:06:11

could.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:11

So I reinvested back in the business.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:13

And so because I had another side hustle or a business working at a

Joshua Brown: 00:06:16

a church, I.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:17

the side hustle, I just reinvested back in the business.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:21

But I could have made a very good living at that time if I wanted to

Joshua Brown: 00:06:26

switch over, doing 225, if you, there's just, it only takes about two to

Joshua Brown: 00:06:31

three people to do 225, 200 $50,000.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:35

It's only one truck now.

Joshua Brown: 00:06:37

Every truck we have does two 50.

Tim Winders: 00:06:39

Sure.

Tim Winders: 00:06:40

I'm gonna ask one more general question, and

Tim Winders: 00:06:42

then we're gonna circle back

Tim Winders: 00:06:43

and

Tim Winders: 00:06:44

get some testimony and

Tim Winders: 00:06:45

then I think we're gonna wrap up

Tim Winders: 00:06:47

with talking about your current

Tim Winders: 00:06:49

business model and how that's working and what you're doing to I call it

Tim Winders: 00:06:54

marketplace ministry, how you're getting out in the community doing

Tim Winders: 00:06:57

business, but also doing ministry.

Tim Winders: 00:06:59

But in general, big question.

Tim Winders: 00:07:03

And it's not a trick

Tim Winders: 00:07:04

You can

Tim Winders: 00:07:04

answer it however you want to, but

Tim Winders: 00:07:08

there are many people

Tim Winders: 00:07:10

that have this thought that you can only do ministry

Tim Winders: 00:07:14

within the four walls

Tim Winders: 00:07:15

of a church.

Tim Winders: 00:07:16

Very confined, very restricted.

Tim Winders: 00:07:19

And then maybe

Tim Winders: 00:07:20

there's some

Tim Winders: 00:07:20

people that also say you

Tim Winders: 00:07:21

you could also be a missionary and go overseas and, somewhere

Tim Winders: 00:07:25

in Africa or something like that.

Tim Winders: 00:07:28

As

Tim Winders: 00:07:28

have experienced this over the last

Tim Winders: 00:07:30

handful of years, Do you believe that you are any less of a minister?

Tim Winders: 00:07:37

because you are out?

Tim Winders: 00:07:40

I'm trying

Tim Winders: 00:07:40

not to guide the answer here.

Tim Winders: 00:07:42

Meeting with the public, interacting with people.

Tim Winders: 00:07:45

I guess just

Tim Winders: 00:07:45

contrast the two perceptions about ministry

Tim Winders: 00:07:50

pressure washing.

Tim Winders: 00:07:51

You're out,

Tim Winders: 00:07:52

in the

Tim Winders: 00:07:52

marketplace, student ministry you're working

Tim Winders: 00:07:55

with students obviously

Tim Winders: 00:07:56

in a, within a church setting most of the time.

Tim Winders: 00:07:59

Talk about the observations of ministry for both

Tim Winders: 00:08:03

of those.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:04

So I was one of those people, Tim, when we say you were, oh

Joshua Brown: 00:08:08

no, I was actually one of those people and it wasn't something I spoke out

Joshua Brown: 00:08:13

loud, but it was a fundamental belief based on the way I operated ministry.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:18

I was one of those student pastors that gave the kids

Joshua Brown: 00:08:20

hard

Joshua Brown: 00:08:20

time on Wednesday night if they didn't show up on Wednesday night.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:24

I'd give 'em a call

Joshua Brown: 00:08:25

and I'd say, Hey, where are you at?

Joshua Brown: 00:08:26

And I'd talk to their parents.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:27

The grandparents say, Hey, we'd love I know sports are important.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:30

So is, renewing their minds.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:32

So is being a part of a community, I did not understand that if my real job

Joshua Brown: 00:08:37

was to equip them and send them to be inside the marketplace inside of sports.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:43

And the sad truth is that whenever we are institutionalized, we think like

Joshua Brown: 00:08:48

like

Joshua Brown: 00:08:48

the institution

Joshua Brown: 00:08:49

that

Joshua Brown: 00:08:49

we're inten in, institutionalized in.

Joshua Brown: 00:08:53

And it's not until we step outside of the institution that where eyes are like,

Joshua Brown: 00:08:57

wait a minute, there is for me, there is more ministry going on in my life today.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:03

Than ever in the past.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:05

I have, the local schools have picked me up and I go coach the coaches

Joshua Brown: 00:09:09

on creating healthy culture while they're teaching what they know.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:13

And so I teach the four different high schools coaches and about

Joshua Brown: 00:09:17

them coaching their athletes.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:19

I say, Hey, you teach what you know, but you reproduce who you are.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:22

How healthy are you right now?

Joshua Brown: 00:09:24

And then how do we dig into your past, your father wounds, things

Joshua Brown: 00:09:27

that you had, unforgiveness, any stressors that would've never happened.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:31

If I'm at church Wednesday night, I was never set free to run.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:35

And I had people that were trying to speak into my life telling me, Hey

Joshua Brown: 00:09:39

Josh, I think you're meant to run wild.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:41

And I'm like, I didn't even understand what that meant.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:44

And so it took me a year and a half, Tim, of somebody in the secular.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:49

World called the B bbb.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:52

It was the largest gathering of seven figure business owners in the country.

Joshua Brown: 00:09:56

They meet in Nashville and a gentleman wanted to invest in my company and

Joshua Brown: 00:10:00

I said, I don't need an investor.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:01

I need a good salesman.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:03

And he is why don't you come and be a part of the bbb?

Joshua Brown: 00:10:05

I was

Joshua Brown: 00:10:06

is

Joshua Brown: 00:10:06

that the Better Business Bureau?

Joshua Brown: 00:10:07

He's no.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:07

It stands for Bourbon, BS and Business.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:10

And I didn't know a lot about bourbon.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:13

Nazarene background, still don't know a lot about bourbon and

Joshua Brown: 00:10:16

I try not to BS a whole lot.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:18

And, but I do wanna learn about business after six months of being there.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:22

You know what, they ended up calling

Joshua Brown: 00:10:23

me.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:24

You

Joshua Brown: 00:10:25

What's that?

Joshua Brown: 00:10:26

Get the guess.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:27

The pressure was pastor.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:28

And when they called it, I'm like, why are y'all pegging me

Joshua Brown: 00:10:31

as a pressure washing pastor?

Joshua Brown: 00:10:32

I'm not in ministry anymore.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:33

I'm not a pastor.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:35

And so Tim, I was the guy that thought I lost my identity as a

Joshua Brown: 00:10:40

result of not having the position I.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:43

Inside the pulpit or inside of a denomination.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:47

And

Joshua Brown: 00:10:48

Now I'm able to share my testimony with anybody that I

Joshua Brown: 00:10:52

meet inside the business world.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:53

And I am quick to share what God has done for me because God's been so good to me.

Joshua Brown: 00:10:57

And so I never changed who I was, but I didn't know that I

Joshua Brown: 00:11:02

was still very much a shepherd.

Joshua Brown: 00:11:04

That's called to,

Joshua Brown: 00:11:05

guide,

Joshua Brown: 00:11:06

to protect, to lead

Joshua Brown: 00:11:07

So anyway, so I was one of those guys,

Tim Winders: 00:11:10

Tim I think,

Tim Winders: 00:11:12

And

Tim Winders: 00:11:12

I've seen it too, I might have shared this with you.

Tim Winders: 00:11:14

I've shared it with the audience before

Tim Winders: 00:11:17

I was saved in a business

Tim Winders: 00:11:19

setting.

Tim Winders: 00:11:20

So my paradigm, and

Tim Winders: 00:11:22

I

Tim Winders: 00:11:22

am not

Tim Winders: 00:11:23

sure, God can do all types of things.

Tim Winders: 00:11:26

He can do anything.

Tim Winders: 00:11:27

We know that.

Tim Winders: 00:11:28

But I'd been in and out of churches all my life up

Tim Winders: 00:11:31

to the age of about 27, 28.

Tim Winders: 00:11:34

And someone would've asked me

Tim Winders: 00:11:36

if I was a Christian, I would've said

Tim Winders: 00:11:37

yes.

Tim Winders: 00:11:39

But I was one of these chinos, Christian

Tim Winders: 00:11:41

in name only, I wasn't actually participating

Tim Winders: 00:11:45

and had

Tim Winders: 00:11:46

really received that transformation of, what Christ does for us when we're able

Tim Winders: 00:11:51

to live out the follower of Christ.

Tim Winders: 00:11:53

But my observation, I've gone

Tim Winders: 00:11:56

Bible school, I've been around ministry.

Tim Winders: 00:11:59

I think that with

Tim Winders: 00:12:02

the religious circles and with

Tim Winders: 00:12:04

Bible schools, I think they're a, they're training and maybe they do it consciously.

Tim Winders: 00:12:09

Maybe it's not

Tim Winders: 00:12:10

consciously.

Tim Winders: 00:12:11

they're

Tim Winders: 00:12:12

people to think that

Tim Winders: 00:12:13

the most worthy thing you could do,

Tim Winders: 00:12:14

do is work in full-time ministry.

Tim Winders: 00:12:19

And I'm not saying that's not worthy,

Tim Winders: 00:12:22

but our conversation

Tim Winders: 00:12:24

here is all about that

Tim Winders: 00:12:25

is not the most worthy thing that one can do.

Tim Winders: 00:12:29

There are plenty of other worthy things in God's kingdom.

Tim Winders: 00:12:32

Correct.

Joshua Brown: 00:12:33

Yeah.

Joshua Brown: 00:12:33

And if you have any listeners that are landing with that

Joshua Brown: 00:12:36

narrative, I would invite them

Joshua Brown: 00:12:38

To chew on

Joshua Brown: 00:12:40

A couple of conversations.

Joshua Brown: 00:12:42

First, what are the chances that you're utilizing a narrative that benefits

Joshua Brown: 00:12:48

your kingdom versus the kingdom of God?

Joshua Brown: 00:12:50

And there were times in ministry where, I was a drug dealer, pothead

Joshua Brown: 00:12:54

high school dropout, changed by the gospel, asked to be discipled.

Joshua Brown: 00:12:58

The next thing I'm in Bible school.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:00

The next thing you know, I'm a student pastor.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:02

Next thing you know, I'm on a rollercoaster ride.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:04

And I felt like I was running.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:05

And I love the church.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:07

We need the church, but I felt like I spent most of my

Joshua Brown: 00:13:10

time running programs, events.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:13

And trying to encourage giving and different financial programs for the

Joshua Brown: 00:13:20

local church and missing the beauty of what we can do to invite people,

Joshua Brown: 00:13:27

Hey, instead of planning a church, why don't you plant a business?

Joshua Brown: 00:13:30

I wish

Joshua Brown: 00:13:31

we would empower those who give their lives to Jesus to think more creatively

Joshua Brown: 00:13:37

than what's been done on in the past.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:39

And there's a piece of scripture that I feel like God spoke to me about

Joshua Brown: 00:13:43

recently, where Jesus is on the shore.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:46

He sees his disciples fishing with some nets and they're not catching anything.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:50

And he says, Hey guys, throw your nets on the other side of the boat.

Joshua Brown: 00:13:53

And they throw their nets

Joshua Brown: 00:13:55

they pull up

Joshua Brown: 00:13:55

and there's so many fish that they, the nets could barely even hold the gathering.

Joshua Brown: 00:14:00

And it's if you look at what's going on in, in our country,

Joshua Brown: 00:14:04

maybe the most beautiful place that we could exit would be

Joshua Brown: 00:14:07

be

Joshua Brown: 00:14:07

the church and head into the marketplace to be the church.

Joshua Brown: 00:14:11

Because I think we're called to be on mission, not just to be,

Joshua Brown: 00:14:14

Hey, come and come to our church

Joshua Brown: 00:14:16

And

Joshua Brown: 00:14:16

and serve inside of our programs and give to what I would call our kingdom.

Tim Winders: 00:14:23

Yeah.

Tim Winders: 00:14:23

That

Tim Winders: 00:14:24

I

Tim Winders: 00:14:24

love, as I

Tim Winders: 00:14:25

read through the gospels and I try.

Tim Winders: 00:14:27

How to use this.

Tim Winders: 00:14:28

I'm not sure if I should make, I'm

Tim Winders: 00:14:29

making more

Tim Winders: 00:14:30

of it than

Tim Winders: 00:14:30

it should.

Tim Winders: 00:14:31

That Jesus

Tim Winders: 00:14:32

chose his disciples

Tim Winders: 00:14:35

and

Tim Winders: 00:14:35

every one

Tim Winders: 00:14:35

of

Tim Winders: 00:14:35

them were marketplace

Tim Winders: 00:14:38

small business

Tim Winders: 00:14:38

owners for the most part.

Tim Winders: 00:14:40

There's a

Tim Winders: 00:14:41

collector and a zealot and a

Tim Winders: 00:14:42

other things in the mix there.

Tim Winders: 00:14:44

But

Tim Winders: 00:14:45

most of them

Tim Winders: 00:14:46

would've been categorized, I believe, more entrepreneurial marketplace type people

Tim Winders: 00:14:51

today.

Tim Winders: 00:14:53

Can I speak to that

Joshua Brown: 00:14:53

for a

Joshua Brown: 00:14:53

second?

Joshua Brown: 00:14:54

Sure.

Joshua Brown: 00:14:55

I went to

Joshua Brown: 00:14:55

Exponential,

Joshua Brown: 00:14:56

put up a booth called Pressure Washington Pastor.

Joshua Brown: 00:14:59

And Exponential is a massive church planning organization.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:03

And I was voted most interesting booth at exponential.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:07

And I had people just staring at it from afar.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:10

And I'm beside, the

Joshua Brown: 00:15:11

Red Letter

Joshua Brown: 00:15:11

Bible, which are phenomenal people.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:13

They write curriculum.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:14

I'm right beside the children's curriculum.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:16

And missionaries started coming up to me and saying, in

Joshua Brown: 00:15:21

our country, this is normal.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:23

It was only inside of our culture where it seems to be

Joshua Brown: 00:15:27

abnormal.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:28

And now that I've been sharing this pressure washing pastor ministry in

Joshua Brown: 00:15:31

the marketplace idea, I'm having other church leaders and pastors come up

Joshua Brown: 00:15:34

to me and say, I've been doing this

Joshua Brown: 00:15:36

over

Joshua Brown: 00:15:37

20 years.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:38

I feel like something's gotta change.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:39

And they're thinking about their kids and their kids are wanting to do,

Joshua Brown: 00:15:42

make a difference and make disciples.

Joshua Brown: 00:15:44

But it's is the church the only place that we can make disciples?

Joshua Brown: 00:15:47

What if it was inside the city?

Tim Winders: 00:15:49

Yeah.

Tim Winders: 00:15:50

I love it.

Tim Winders: 00:15:51

That's what we're really

Tim Winders: 00:15:52

attempting to get that message out here at Seek Go Create.

Tim Winders: 00:15:55

Also that to

Tim Winders: 00:15:56

me is the EIA that we see in the early church where people are,

Tim Winders: 00:16:03

they're working, they're ministering, they're, bringing themselves together.

Tim Winders: 00:16:08

They're supporting each other.

Tim Winders: 00:16:09

They're helping each other.

Tim Winders: 00:16:11

And I think that's the model that we need to look at.

Tim Winders: 00:16:14

I think we've tried to segment things too much.

Tim Winders: 00:16:17

I wanna back up

Tim Winders: 00:16:19

and I want to hear, because every time I've

Tim Winders: 00:16:21

talked to you,

Tim Winders: 00:16:23

you have said, Tim, can I share my testimony?

Tim Winders: 00:16:25

Tim,

Tim Winders: 00:16:25

Tim, can I share my testimony?

Tim Winders: 00:16:27

And I admire

Tim Winders: 00:16:28

someone, I,

Tim Winders: 00:16:29

people

Tim Winders: 00:16:30

ask me mine, but I'm not

Tim Winders: 00:16:34

because.

Tim Winders: 00:16:35

It does impact so many things related to my identity.

Tim Winders: 00:16:38

I'm not as aggressive as you are,

Tim Winders: 00:16:41

but

Tim Winders: 00:16:42

I admire it.

Tim Winders: 00:16:42

So let's back up Joshua,

Tim Winders: 00:16:45

and I appreciate that you're holding onto the words to

Tim Winders: 00:16:48

the full name

Tim Winders: 00:16:49

Joshua, by the way,

Tim Winders: 00:16:50

cuz our son's name is Joshua.

Tim Winders: 00:16:52

He's about to turn 30 years old and he's had to

Tim Winders: 00:16:55

fight his entire life to keep people from calling him Josh.

Tim Winders: 00:16:59

He says,

Tim Winders: 00:16:59

I

Tim Winders: 00:16:59

am Joshua.

Tim Winders: 00:17:00

I am Joshua.

Tim Winders: 00:17:01

And I think you've, sounds like you've done that, but back up, share wherever you

Tim Winders: 00:17:07

want to

Tim Winders: 00:17:08

start from.

Tim Winders: 00:17:09

I've got

Tim Winders: 00:17:09

some questions related to your testimony that I read

Tim Winders: 00:17:11

through also, but let's go back

Tim Winders: 00:17:14

and let's talk about I, I

Tim Winders: 00:17:16

call it affectionately Joshua, the early years and let's see

Tim Winders: 00:17:19

how you've gotten

Tim Winders: 00:17:20

to this point.

Tim Winders: 00:17:20

So what's on your

Tim Winders: 00:17:22

heart?

Tim Winders: 00:17:22

What

Tim Winders: 00:17:22

do you wanna share

Tim Winders: 00:17:22

about that?

Joshua Brown: 00:17:24

Yeah, I'll try to make it as brief

Joshua Brown: 00:17:25

possible, but my, the reason

Joshua Brown: 00:17:27

I wanna share my testimony is because when I look back, I'm

Joshua Brown: 00:17:31

like, nothing happens without.

Joshua Brown: 00:17:33

What God has done for my life.

Joshua Brown: 00:17:35

And so my mom adopted from Kalamazoo, Michigan down to Nashville, Tennessee

Joshua Brown: 00:17:40

behind Hooters and Waffle House off of what's called Wade Circle.

Joshua Brown: 00:17:45

And some people have a good adoption story and some people not so much.

Joshua Brown: 00:17:49

My mom was not so much her dad would go to

Joshua Brown: 00:17:52

jail

Joshua Brown: 00:17:52

for the things that he was doing to her at 13 and her mom was addicted

Joshua Brown: 00:17:57

to pain, medication and alcohol.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:00

By the time she's 15, she ends up getting pregnant by a 21 year old named Frankie.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:05

Frankie said to my mom, I'll pay for his abortion, but I won't be in his life.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:10

My mom at 15 with nothing, no support, no money broke.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:17

Look at her.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:17

So like nothing, she's got nothing.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:19

She ended up saying, I can't kill him.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:23

And so the reason I like to talk about it is cuz I'm like, it's everything.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:29

And

Joshua Brown: 00:18:29

True to Frankie's words.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:31

He chose to not be in our lives when we grew up homeless and

Joshua Brown: 00:18:34

with different boyfriends.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:36

And my mom had married two or three different times.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:39

We lived in the back of soup kitchens church fellowship halls, cars, and

Joshua Brown: 00:18:44

different cities, different projects, and moved from place to place.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:48

By the time I'm 17, I'm in Winston-Salem, North Carolina.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:52

I'm a drug dealer, pothead high school dropout, which makes sense.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:55

It looks like that was my pathway for where we were at.

Joshua Brown: 00:18:59

I had no dad figure except for Tupac, nwa Snoop Dogg.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:03

Those were the guys that I looked up to, which I know you don't know

Joshua Brown: 00:19:06

anything about any of those individuals,

Joshua Brown: 00:19:08

but you're smiling.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:09

so maybe, and.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:11

At 19 I ended up getting in a really bad heart wreck.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:14

I was following a friend named Pookie.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:15

He had a 3000 GT stealth that was pearl White.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:19

And he ran a red, a yellow light, and I ran a red light and we, and

Joshua Brown: 00:19:22

then there was a truck that ran a red light as well, and we met in the

Joshua Brown: 00:19:26

middle.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:26

From that moment,

Joshua Brown: 00:19:27

God started speaking to me, and you know what he said?

Joshua Brown: 00:19:31

He said, he didn't tell me I

Joshua Brown: 00:19:33

I was going

Joshua Brown: 00:19:34

to hell.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:34

He didn't tell me that I'm an worthless piece of junk.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:37

He said, Joshua, I

Joshua Brown: 00:19:37

I love

Joshua Brown: 00:19:37

you.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:39

That broke me.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:40

It moved me to give the pastor my pot and God, my heart.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:43

And that was at 19 years old.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:45

I'm 46 today and I'm,

Joshua Brown: 00:19:47

tr

Joshua Brown: 00:19:47

I went back to school,

Joshua Brown: 00:19:48

school,

Joshua Brown: 00:19:48

got g e d, pastoral ministry degree, Christian Counseling, and

Joshua Brown: 00:19:52

now a ministry in the marketplace.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:54

So that's a quick snapshot.

Joshua Brown: 00:19:55

Married 25 years, this year of six kids, 21 down to one.

Tim Winders: 00:20:02

So

Tim Winders: 00:20:03

there's so many things there, Joshua, and I appreciate

Tim Winders: 00:20:06

you sharing that

Tim Winders: 00:20:08

And

Tim Winders: 00:20:10

One of the things that's interesting,

Tim Winders: 00:20:11

as someone who

Tim Winders: 00:20:14

does these interviews, I always look

Tim Winders: 00:20:16

for

Tim Winders: 00:20:17

clips that grab people's attention that we sometimes put

Tim Winders: 00:20:21

at the beginning of the podcast.

Tim Winders: 00:20:23

I think I might have just gotten that clip, but we talk about

Tim Winders: 00:20:28

redefining success here and

Tim Winders: 00:20:30

often people can just make a decision and over

Tim Winders: 00:20:35

the course of three years,

Tim Winders: 00:20:36

five years, 10 years, whatever, they could

Tim Winders: 00:20:38

redefine what success means to them.

Tim Winders: 00:20:40

It sounds to me

Tim Winders: 00:20:41

like

Tim Winders: 00:20:43

there was

Tim Winders: 00:20:43

what

Tim Winders: 00:20:43

many would

Tim Winders: 00:20:44

say is a catalytic

Tim Winders: 00:20:45

event

Tim Winders: 00:20:46

that occurred to you at

Tim Winders: 00:20:47

19, but the question I've got

Tim Winders: 00:20:52

is were there clues.

Tim Winders: 00:20:57

You were alive was one of them, but were there other clues in your life between the

Tim Winders: 00:21:01

time of your mother saying,

Tim Winders: 00:21:03

I'm not gonna take this life, this living inside of me.

Tim Winders: 00:21:06

To the time

Tim Winders: 00:21:07

being 19 where you could say,

Tim Winders: 00:21:12

God was pursuing

Tim Winders: 00:21:13

me, he had his hand on me as protection, and I know it was

Tim Winders: 00:21:16

24 7.

Tim Winders: 00:21:17

I know that,

Tim Winders: 00:21:18

but I'm asking

Tim Winders: 00:21:19

about

Tim Winders: 00:21:20

awareness.

Tim Winders: 00:21:21

Are there times that you are fully aware of God's

Tim Winders: 00:21:24

hand

Tim Winders: 00:21:24

and presence

Tim Winders: 00:21:25

from

Tim Winders: 00:21:25

from that

Tim Winders: 00:21:26

time of your mother to

Tim Winders: 00:21:28

the time you were 19?

Joshua Brown: 00:21:30

Yeah, a

Joshua Brown: 00:21:30

hundred

Joshua Brown: 00:21:31

percent.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:31

And I would say the first time I was made aware of it is we were

Joshua Brown: 00:21:36

like escaping from Nashville.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:37

There was a guy that my mom had lived with who was violent and evil.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:43

And I was probably about nine years old.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:45

And

Joshua Brown: 00:21:46

when we were in Alabama, I.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:49

I

Joshua Brown: 00:21:50

was invited to, the preacher was talking about giving God your heart giving Jesus.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:54

And I looked at my mom and said, I need Jesus in my life.

Joshua Brown: 00:21:57

Went down and I felt an experience with God.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:00

And so I don't know theologically what you would say as far as when I saved,

Joshua Brown: 00:22:04

always saved, or did I lose my salvation.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:07

But I know when I was nine years old, I felt like God loved me.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:11

And then as I look through the timeline, there's constant reminders.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:15

And inside of my head or heart, I knew the way that I should be living.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:21

I just wasn't living it.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:23

And it wasn't until that moment of the collision where God started saying,

Joshua Brown: 00:22:27

Joshua, you're wasting your life.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:29

And so it was, there's many evidences.

Joshua Brown: 00:22:32

I gave you a brief testimony, but God's hand of grace, I think

Joshua Brown: 00:22:36

is evident when we take time to pause and just look around us.

Tim Winders: 00:22:40

Sure.

Tim Winders: 00:22:41

Y Joshua, I think so many times,

Tim Winders: 00:22:43

I

Tim Winders: 00:22:43

think everybody's on

Tim Winders: 00:22:44

journey, by the way.

Tim Winders: 00:22:47

And God, I felt like God spoke to me one time

Tim Winders: 00:22:49

after

Tim Winders: 00:22:51

some very challenging times

Tim Winders: 00:22:53

that I had been through, and I felt like he said, Tim, there

Tim Winders: 00:22:58

is nothing that is from your

Tim Winders: 00:23:01

past

Tim Winders: 00:23:02

that we will not use to advance God's

Tim Winders: 00:23:04

king, my kingdom in the future.

Tim Winders: 00:23:06

And I

Tim Winders: 00:23:07

was like going,

Tim Winders: 00:23:07

oh, cuz I kept thinking

Tim Winders: 00:23:08

maybe

Tim Winders: 00:23:08

there was some wasted time, or

Tim Winders: 00:23:10

I

Tim Winders: 00:23:11

wasted this away.

Tim Winders: 00:23:12

Or something like that.

Tim Winders: 00:23:15

Obviously your life segmented, pre

Tim Winders: 00:23:17

19 years old, post 19

Tim Winders: 00:23:19

years old, but instead of, I

Tim Winders: 00:23:23

think we could go through a lot of the negatives of your pre 19 year old self,

Tim Winders: 00:23:28

but what are some of

Tim Winders: 00:23:30

the benefits?

Tim Winders: 00:23:32

This is asking

Tim Winders: 00:23:33

to maybe shine a positive light on some rough situations, but

Tim Winders: 00:23:37

what are some benefits that you

Tim Winders: 00:23:39

still reap

Tim Winders: 00:23:41

from your, the pre 19 year

Tim Winders: 00:23:44

old Joshua Brown?

Joshua Brown: 00:23:47

That's a good question, and it might take me a

Joshua Brown: 00:23:48

long time to process outside of there, when anybody asks me, how are you doing?

Joshua Brown: 00:23:55

I always answer with Dave Ramsey's answer, better than I deserve.

Joshua Brown: 00:23:59

And it, one of

Joshua Brown: 00:24:01

the things

Joshua Brown: 00:24:01

I would say is that the awareness of who I was and God's love for

Joshua Brown: 00:24:06

me

Joshua Brown: 00:24:06

in the midst of those.

Joshua Brown: 00:24:09

Times and behaviors that, that he chose to just love me.

Joshua Brown: 00:24:12

To me, that's

Joshua Brown: 00:24:13

the

Joshua Brown: 00:24:14

overarching awareness is that to those who much are forgiven much is

Joshua Brown: 00:24:21

expected or much love, I feel the weight of his love as a result of the

Joshua Brown: 00:24:26

sin that, that I chose to engage in and those that did it did unto me.

Joshua Brown: 00:24:31

And so if anything I'd say it just makes me appreciate and love him

Joshua Brown: 00:24:36

more for loving someone like me.

Tim Winders: 00:24:38

Yeah, I do think that, I like that

Tim Winders: 00:24:40

word awareness.

Tim Winders: 00:24:42

I

Tim Winders: 00:24:43

I think sometimes

Tim Winders: 00:24:46

if people haven't experienced

Tim Winders: 00:24:49

darkness,

Tim Winders: 00:24:50

they don't understand light.

Tim Winders: 00:24:52

If they haven't experienced

Tim Winders: 00:24:55

hatred, they may not understand love

Tim Winders: 00:24:58

And that might be a deeper thing than we're trying to

Tim Winders: 00:25:02

look at here.

Tim Winders: 00:25:03

Are there

Tim Winders: 00:25:04

any this is not a counselor question,

Tim Winders: 00:25:07

but

Tim Winders: 00:25:08

I've recently interacted with some people.

Tim Winders: 00:25:11

My wife is one

Tim Winders: 00:25:12

that

Tim Winders: 00:25:12

has experienced some

Tim Winders: 00:25:14

some things

Tim Winders: 00:25:14

at a younger age.

Tim Winders: 00:25:16

She has been transformed.

Tim Winders: 00:25:18

She

Tim Winders: 00:25:18

is a great

Tim Winders: 00:25:19

woman of God, but there are some times

Tim Winders: 00:25:23

that some of

Tim Winders: 00:25:23

the things

Tim Winders: 00:25:24

from her past will

Tim Winders: 00:25:29

Just kinda rear

Tim Winders: 00:25:29

up.

Tim Winders: 00:25:30

Cause a

Tim Winders: 00:25:31

few issues.

Tim Winders: 00:25:31

Anything

Tim Winders: 00:25:32

growing up that, and I think this is an important part of

Tim Winders: 00:25:35

testimony too, by the way, because I know people deal with stuff,

Tim Winders: 00:25:39

Anything from that pre 19

Tim Winders: 00:25:41

year old Joshua

Tim Winders: 00:25:43

that every

Tim Winders: 00:25:43

once in

Tim Winders: 00:25:44

a while you have to lay it before the altar again

Tim Winders: 00:25:50

and

Tim Winders: 00:25:50

again.

Joshua Brown: 00:25:51

I would say quickly, one, one thing that, that you mentioned is

Joshua Brown: 00:25:57

often as a result of what we experience, we attempt to be the very opposite that

Joshua Brown: 00:26:04

of, and so for me, not having a dad, I went through a Michael Hyatt teaching

Joshua Brown: 00:26:08

years ago, and it had me create a life

Joshua Brown: 00:26:11

plan.

Joshua Brown: 00:26:11

And I wrote down, at the end of my life, I want to be a

Joshua Brown: 00:26:14

godly man, husband, and father.

Joshua Brown: 00:26:15

So that's my purpose statement.

Joshua Brown: 00:26:17

You try to live a godly, as a godly man, husband, and father, and then maybe

Joshua Brown: 00:26:24

let's take man out of it and just go,

Joshua Brown: 00:26:26

husband

Joshua Brown: 00:26:27

and father.

Joshua Brown: 00:26:28

What

Joshua Brown: 00:26:28

I have

Joshua Brown: 00:26:29

recognized is that as a result of father wounds in my past, not having one

Joshua Brown: 00:26:34

being taken advantage

Joshua Brown: 00:26:35

of and then trying to give love both to my wife and my children,

Joshua Brown: 00:26:42

there

Joshua Brown: 00:26:42

there is an unspoken expectation that

Joshua Brown: 00:26:45

I have

Joshua Brown: 00:26:46

that they will love me more.

Joshua Brown: 00:26:48

As a result of me responding outta my father wound.

Tim Winders: 00:26:53

But that's an incorrect assumption.

Tim Winders: 00:26:55

It's,

Joshua Brown: 00:26:55

It's super incorrect because it really shows that I wear a mask

Joshua Brown: 00:27:00

Of behaving in a certain way in order to get something back out of

Joshua Brown: 00:27:05

purely loving the person in front of you without any expectation

Joshua Brown: 00:27:08

from the person in front of you.

Joshua Brown: 00:27:11

And so to finish this life of golly, man, husband, and father

Joshua Brown: 00:27:14

means that you love without any expectation of anything in return.

Joshua Brown: 00:27:18

And so I think that is the emotion and when we talk about

Joshua Brown: 00:27:21

emotion,

Joshua Brown: 00:27:23

I don't know if your listeners can resonate or if you can resonate.

Joshua Brown: 00:27:27

I get tore up when I love and that love is not returned.

Joshua Brown: 00:27:34

It's almost I thought you would love me if I loved you, but sometimes you

Joshua Brown: 00:27:39

love and that

Joshua Brown: 00:27:40

that love is not reciprocated.

Joshua Brown: 00:27:42

I think that father's love is the love without anything

Joshua Brown: 00:27:45

in return, and I feel like

Joshua Brown: 00:27:47

that's

Joshua Brown: 00:27:47

The father wound that I've experienced as a child that I tried to mask

Joshua Brown: 00:27:53

myself to be a great husband, man and

Joshua Brown: 00:27:55

father.

Joshua Brown: 00:27:56

But to be great means you love without expecting anything in return.

Tim Winders: 00:28:01

I think it's difficult for

Tim Winders: 00:28:02

most of us to grasp

Tim Winders: 00:28:06

unconditional love that the father

Tim Winders: 00:28:08

has for us.

Tim Winders: 00:28:11

My, my wife and

Tim Winders: 00:28:11

and I had this discussion probably three

Tim Winders: 00:28:13

months ago because of relationship she has with her father and her mother.

Tim Winders: 00:28:19

I was praying for her

Tim Winders: 00:28:20

and I was asking the Lord what

Tim Winders: 00:28:22

I could

Tim Winders: 00:28:22

do

Tim Winders: 00:28:23

for her.

Tim Winders: 00:28:25

And the Lord

Tim Winders: 00:28:25

I believe

Tim Winders: 00:28:26

spoke to me and said

Tim Winders: 00:28:27

she struggles

Tim Winders: 00:28:30

More

Tim Winders: 00:28:31

than most, more than I do

Tim Winders: 00:28:33

with

Tim Winders: 00:28:33

understanding and accepting and receiving unconditional love.

Tim Winders: 00:28:38

And to me that's what I heard when you

Tim Winders: 00:28:40

just said

Tim Winders: 00:28:40

that I didn't try to connect dots that don't need to be connected, did I?

Tim Winders: 00:28:44

Unconditional love is tough for all of us to grasp, but I

Tim Winders: 00:28:48

think it's even tougher when

Tim Winders: 00:28:49

when people have had issues with their

Tim Winders: 00:28:51

earthly

Tim Winders: 00:28:51

parents.

Tim Winders: 00:28:52

I.

Joshua Brown: 00:28:54

We can go into a lot of conversations here cuz we can even

Joshua Brown: 00:28:57

get into doctrine and theology and how we're taught a certain way to believe

Joshua Brown: 00:29:03

and think that lends us to a place that might be bigger than whether or not

Joshua Brown: 00:29:10

God loves us while we were at sinner.

Joshua Brown: 00:29:12

Or do you ha can a question I ask sometimes that gets a lot of, gets

Joshua Brown: 00:29:17

me in trouble or gets the a lot of interesting questions is, can

Joshua Brown: 00:29:22

you be a Christian and be wrong?

Joshua Brown: 00:29:26

And then what are you allowed to be wrong about and what are you

Joshua Brown: 00:29:29

not allowed to be wrong about?

Joshua Brown: 00:29:31

And

Joshua Brown: 00:29:32

And unpacking that conversation does a lot of good because it allows us to

Joshua Brown: 00:29:36

expose the fact that we're probably wrong about something, and that wrongness

Joshua Brown: 00:29:42

doesn't equate with God's love and goodness and forgiveness and grace

Joshua Brown: 00:29:49

and Holy

Joshua Brown: 00:29:49

Spirit for our lives.

Joshua Brown: 00:29:51

And so when God went up and

Joshua Brown: 00:29:54

Jesus went up

Joshua Brown: 00:29:55

up

Joshua Brown: 00:29:55

sent

Joshua Brown: 00:29:55

us Holy Spirit down.

Joshua Brown: 00:29:57

He's here with us.

Joshua Brown: 00:29:58

He loves us, and he loves the people you don't know that He loves, just

Joshua Brown: 00:30:01

like he loves you, but you don't always understand that when you're indoctrinated

Joshua Brown: 00:30:07

and inside different denominations.

Joshua Brown: 00:30:09

And so it's a long unpacking, and I'm not even know if I'm okay

Joshua Brown: 00:30:12

to talk about stuff like this.

Tim Winders: 00:30:13

It is and but what that does is it causes the

Tim Winders: 00:30:16

conflicts

Tim Winders: 00:30:17

that occur primarily, they occur within our, what we'll

Tim Winders: 00:30:22

call our organized church circles.

Tim Winders: 00:30:26

Because I think as humans we like nice, neat

Tim Winders: 00:30:29

little answers, but

Tim Winders: 00:30:32

but that's not the way

Tim Winders: 00:30:34

things are

Tim Winders: 00:30:34

structured.

Tim Winders: 00:30:35

I'm in the middle of reading

Tim Winders: 00:30:36

the

Tim Winders: 00:30:36

Bible and

Tim Winders: 00:30:38

I just finished First

Tim Winders: 00:30:39

Chronicles.

Tim Winders: 00:30:40

I'm moving into

Tim Winders: 00:30:40

Second Chronicles, the life of David.

Tim Winders: 00:30:43

Just that microcosm of David, goodness gracious.

Tim Winders: 00:30:48

You

Tim Winders: 00:30:48

The

Tim Winders: 00:30:48

one that was after

Tim Winders: 00:30:49

God's heart.

Tim Winders: 00:30:50

He had He to me as the

Tim Winders: 00:30:51

focal point

Tim Winders: 00:30:53

outside of the pointing to Jesus.

Tim Winders: 00:30:55

He's

Tim Winders: 00:30:55

focal point of

Tim Winders: 00:30:56

the Old Testament.

Tim Winders: 00:30:57

Let's don't

Tim Winders: 00:30:57

talk about a lot of

Tim Winders: 00:30:58

his

Tim Winders: 00:30:58

issues

Tim Winders: 00:31:00

because there's a lot to unpack

Tim Winders: 00:31:01

there.

Tim Winders: 00:31:02

I want to transition though, because

Tim Winders: 00:31:06

the pre

Tim Winders: 00:31:06

19 year old Joshua,

Tim Winders: 00:31:08

all of a sudden, Event.

Tim Winders: 00:31:11

And now

Tim Winders: 00:31:11

we've got a journey that you're

Tim Winders: 00:31:13

on after you're 19 that led quickly into those circles of organized

Tim Winders: 00:31:19

religion

Tim Winders: 00:31:20

training to be in the ministry

Tim Winders: 00:31:22

and moving into ministry.

Tim Winders: 00:31:24

What are

Tim Winders: 00:31:25

you being nudged to tell us about that

Tim Winders: 00:31:28

period or that time

Tim Winders: 00:31:29

in your

Tim Winders: 00:31:29

life?

Joshua Brown: 00:31:31

It's appreciated

Joshua Brown: 00:31:32

and it's valuable.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:33

And so I would definitely not be the person that I am today

Joshua Brown: 00:31:38

without all those experiences.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:40

But one of the things that I would encourage is like, when I went forward

Joshua Brown: 00:31:45

to the pastor I really needed to be

Joshua Brown: 00:31:47

to be

Joshua Brown: 00:31:47

discipled.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:48

I really was asking for someone to show me what it means to be honest.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:52

Stop looking at pornography.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:54

Don't, do things you shouldn't be doing.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:56

How to stop having sex with your girlfriend.

Joshua Brown: 00:31:58

I just needed to know how to read the Bible.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:01

Like maybe just read with me.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:02

me.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:03

And

Joshua Brown: 00:32:03

And that transitioning me to Bible school, I'm thankful for those

Joshua Brown: 00:32:07

experiences, but it is almost the default position inside the church

Joshua Brown: 00:32:12

culture is to send anyone who shows an aptitude to learn God's word that wanted

Joshua Brown: 00:32:19

be discipled.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:20

I just wanted to know what it meant to be discipled.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:22

And what

Joshua Brown: 00:32:23

I would encourage is to say what all avenues can we create inside of ministry

Joshua Brown: 00:32:29

that would produce and make disciples?

Joshua Brown: 00:32:31

Cuz at the end of our lives, all that really matters is being and

Joshua Brown: 00:32:35

making disciples in my opinion.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:37

And then everything else is supposed to help us get

Joshua Brown: 00:32:39

get there.

Joshua Brown: 00:32:39

And so I

Joshua Brown: 00:32:39

think we can create a lot of different

Joshua Brown: 00:32:41

intentional

Joshua Brown: 00:32:42

and organic conversations around

Joshua Brown: 00:32:45

it.

Tim Winders: 00:32:46

Yeah and the thing that kind of bothers

Tim Winders: 00:32:48

me

Tim Winders: 00:32:50

is that

Tim Winders: 00:32:51

discipling someone is

Tim Winders: 00:32:54

extremely time consuming,

Tim Winders: 00:32:57

requires a lot of patience.

Tim Winders: 00:32:59

It requires just a

Tim Winders: 00:33:01

lot of interaction

Tim Winders: 00:33:03

and being around someone.

Tim Winders: 00:33:06

In many ways,

Tim Winders: 00:33:07

this is me being a little critical of

Tim Winders: 00:33:09

the church structure.

Tim Winders: 00:33:10

I think we're just lazy.

Tim Winders: 00:33:12

We don't wanna spend the time.

Tim Winders: 00:33:13

We think if

Tim Winders: 00:33:14

someone pops in

Tim Winders: 00:33:15

on a Wednesday night and a Sunday morning, we give

Tim Winders: 00:33:18

we give 'em a couple verses.

Tim Winders: 00:33:20

That's good

Tim Winders: 00:33:20

enough.

Tim Winders: 00:33:21

It's also one

Tim Winders: 00:33:22

of the reasons, Joshua, I'd maybe like to know your thoughts on

Tim Winders: 00:33:24

this, that I've always been

Tim Winders: 00:33:27

wired to coach.

Tim Winders: 00:33:28

That's something I've always done and I look around now and I don't

Tim Winders: 00:33:33

think I'm elevating my profession more than I should but I spend a lot

Tim Winders: 00:33:39

of time with people

Tim Winders: 00:33:40

that I coach and work with, leadership teams of

Tim Winders: 00:33:42

businesses and

Tim Winders: 00:33:43

organizations, and I have in-depth

Tim Winders: 00:33:46

communications with them,

Tim Winders: 00:33:47

kinda like

Tim Winders: 00:33:48

this on a regular basis as I look over the horizon.

Tim Winders: 00:33:54

The closest

Tim Winders: 00:33:55

thing to discipleship that I see now are

Tim Winders: 00:33:57

are some people that do what

Tim Winders: 00:33:58

I do, leadership coaching, executive coaching, because my calendar forces

Tim Winders: 00:34:03

me to spend time with people like you that are running organizations

Tim Winders: 00:34:08

on a regular basis.

Tim Winders: 00:34:10

And if my heart's right, then we're discipling.

Tim Winders: 00:34:12

So

Tim Winders: 00:34:12

I, I wonder if we're just not creating the

Tim Winders: 00:34:15

right

Tim Winders: 00:34:15

structures to disciple

Tim Winders: 00:34:17

people, what are your thoughts

Tim Winders: 00:34:18

looking back on it

Tim Winders: 00:34:19

now?

Tim Winders: 00:34:20

Yeah,

Joshua Brown: 00:34:20

when I was chatting with coaches at school locally,

Joshua Brown: 00:34:23

I'm like, you guys are shepherds.

Joshua Brown: 00:34:25

I used to be jealous of you.

Joshua Brown: 00:34:27

Y'all have kids for 20 hours

Joshua Brown: 00:34:29

a week and

Joshua Brown: 00:34:30

you play games.

Joshua Brown: 00:34:31

I used to think man, I sure wish we could do something in ministry

Joshua Brown: 00:34:35

versus just have a service.

Joshua Brown: 00:34:38

And there's things to do, but it can't be a conflict with everything

Joshua Brown: 00:34:41

else that's going on in their lives.

Joshua Brown: 00:34:42

And I'm like

Joshua Brown: 00:34:44

the amount of

Joshua Brown: 00:34:44

time that you get when you end up opening a, a business.

Joshua Brown: 00:34:48

And so if discipleship is best life on a life, not from a pulpit to a

Joshua Brown: 00:34:54

pew, then real life discipleship would be you walking alongside

Joshua Brown: 00:34:58

of other

Joshua Brown: 00:34:58

people, inviting them over to the home.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:01

They're, you're confessing your sins, your fault, you're being transparent.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:05

When you get frustrated, they see

Joshua Brown: 00:35:06

how you

Joshua Brown: 00:35:07

frustration and how you confess different situations.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:10

That's discipleship.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:12

And so I feel like creating a business creates opportunity to spend life

Joshua Brown: 00:35:18

on a life and making disciples.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:21

And so that's why I almost would argue that if you really wanted to

Joshua Brown: 00:35:24

make disciples, might as well plan a, a business because then you have

Joshua Brown: 00:35:28

all the opportunity in front of

Joshua Brown: 00:35:30

you.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:31

to have a life on a life discipleship.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:32

Plus now you can pay your volunteers.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:34

You don't have to ask them to give up more time if they're their

Joshua Brown: 00:35:37

week, if that makes any sense.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:39

Yeah.

Joshua Brown: 00:35:39

Yeah, that's

Tim Winders: 00:35:39

good.

Tim Winders: 00:35:40

So as you progressed

Tim Winders: 00:35:42

going the traditional ministry route,

Tim Winders: 00:35:46

at what

Tim Winders: 00:35:47

point

Tim Winders: 00:35:48

did you start

Tim Winders: 00:35:49

recognizing

Tim Winders: 00:35:50

the need to be

Tim Winders: 00:35:52

more aggressive

Tim Winders: 00:35:54

with

Tim Winders: 00:35:55

business?

Tim Winders: 00:35:56

One quite thing.

Tim Winders: 00:35:57

My guess is

Tim Winders: 00:35:59

that regardless of what you were doing, if

Tim Winders: 00:36:00

it was

Tim Winders: 00:36:01

drugs or

Tim Winders: 00:36:02

selling God, you were always a pretty

Tim Winders: 00:36:05

strong work ethic

Tim Winders: 00:36:06

guy.

Tim Winders: 00:36:07

Would that be a correct assumption?

Tim Winders: 00:36:09

I would say the

Joshua Brown: 00:36:09

desire to not be poor always motivated me to

Joshua Brown: 00:36:13

hustle.

Joshua Brown: 00:36:14

And so I always worked two or three different jobs.

Joshua Brown: 00:36:17

I went to college, worked two or three different

Joshua Brown: 00:36:19

jobs while having kids.

Joshua Brown: 00:36:21

So always been a hustler because I always wanted to provide.

Tim Winders: 00:36:26

And so at

Tim Winders: 00:36:27

what

Tim Winders: 00:36:28

point.

Tim Winders: 00:36:29

in

Tim Winders: 00:36:30

your, you went to Bible school

Tim Winders: 00:36:32

starting doing ministry, you had

Tim Winders: 00:36:33

things going on.

Tim Winders: 00:36:34

Were you doing pressure washing on the side all along?

Tim Winders: 00:36:37

I.

Joshua Brown: 00:36:38

No I was doing Uber and Papa John's and Domino's Pizza

Joshua Brown: 00:36:41

and so I was either delivering pizzas, and this is kinda what

Joshua Brown: 00:36:44

moved to a business is I Googled

Joshua Brown: 00:36:47

top five

Joshua Brown: 00:36:47

businesses to open with 5K or less cuz I didn't have a lot of cash.

Joshua Brown: 00:36:51

And taking pictures of Cap was on the list, but also this

Joshua Brown: 00:36:54

thing called pressure washing.

Joshua Brown: 00:36:55

And so I had a friend that had done it and so I went out and visited

Joshua Brown: 00:36:59

him

Joshua Brown: 00:37:00

and he made $800 and four hours is the most legal amount

Joshua Brown: 00:37:04

of money I had ever seen.

Joshua Brown: 00:37:05

I'm like, bro, you're the richest dude.

Joshua Brown: 00:37:07

I know, I think I can open up a pressure washing company.

Joshua Brown: 00:37:10

And so I thought of what can I do to provide more value for my time?

Joshua Brown: 00:37:16

And it was opening a side business and I didn't have all

Joshua Brown: 00:37:20

the disciples stuff figured out.

Joshua Brown: 00:37:22

It was more, I.

Joshua Brown: 00:37:23

Organic discipleship because I, all the evangelism explosion or discipleship

Joshua Brown: 00:37:30

curriculum did not teach, start a business, spend time with people

Joshua Brown: 00:37:35

and be yourself who loves Jesus.

Joshua Brown: 00:37:37

They didn't teach

Joshua Brown: 00:37:37

that.

Tim Winders: 00:37:38

Sure.

Tim Winders: 00:37:39

And at what

Tim Winders: 00:37:40

either year,

Tim Winders: 00:37:41

timeframe, or whatever did the pressure washing company move

Tim Winders: 00:37:46

from the side hustle to a mission,

Tim Winders: 00:37:51

to a business's mission?

Tim Winders: 00:37:53

Because I know

Tim Winders: 00:37:54

at some point there was probably a click or

Tim Winders: 00:37:57

transition or transformation or something.

Tim Winders: 00:37:59

When was that?

Joshua Brown: 00:38:01

Yeah, that's a good question.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:02

And it's trying to put a date and a term or a definition

Joshua Brown: 00:38:09

on a time, and I don't think.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:11

I knew that we were already ministers in the marketplace.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:15

We were already praying with people.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:16

We were already sharing every property manager.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:18

Every time I spoke at a real estate agent, I said, Hey, I'm gonna share

Joshua Brown: 00:38:21

with you what we do, but before we that, can I tell you a little bit

Joshua Brown: 00:38:24

about who is gonna be working with you?

Joshua Brown: 00:38:26

And then I'd share a little bit of story and that story resonated

Joshua Brown: 00:38:30

and opened up more doors.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:31

My cpa, my lawyer, the different folks, it's like they have someone

Joshua Brown: 00:38:37

in front of them that loves him.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:38

So the date would be in the last six months.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:42

I didn't realize it was a, cuz I had to do work on this thing of pressure washing

Joshua Brown: 00:38:47

pastor

Joshua Brown: 00:38:47

year.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:48

I asked God this question, what do you want me to do for rest of my life?

Joshua Brown: 00:38:51

Do

Joshua Brown: 00:38:51

for

Joshua Brown: 00:38:51

others what I've done

Joshua Brown: 00:38:52

you?

Joshua Brown: 00:38:52

Invite them into the

Joshua Brown: 00:38:54

to make disciples.

Joshua Brown: 00:38:55

And I was like, okay, what do I call it?

Joshua Brown: 00:38:57

He's what do people call you?

Joshua Brown: 00:38:58

I was like, they say that I'm pressure washing pastor.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:00

And then it's am I using that as a marketing tool or am I like

Joshua Brown: 00:39:03

legitimately really a pastor?

Joshua Brown: 00:39:04

So I started reading all these shepherding books.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:06

I'm like, wait a minute.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:08

Shepherding is not a pulpit, that's not shepherding, like that's teaching

Joshua Brown: 00:39:13

and we're called to teach and equip and

Joshua Brown: 00:39:15

she

Joshua Brown: 00:39:15

do different things.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:16

But long story short, it wasn't until the last six months that I

Joshua Brown: 00:39:19

would say we defined it as a stamp of

Joshua Brown: 00:39:24

we are

Joshua Brown: 00:39:25

called to be and make disciples.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:27

We're going to utilize.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:28

But we had already been doing it the whole time.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:31

We just didn't know that's what we were doing.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:33

Does that make any sense?

Tim Winders: 00:39:34

It does.

Tim Winders: 00:39:35

I

Tim Winders: 00:39:35

think it's

Tim Winders: 00:39:36

almost an awareness.

Tim Winders: 00:39:37

I believe that you were probably in that role

Tim Winders: 00:39:40

all along, but

Tim Winders: 00:39:42

you weren't aware

Tim Winders: 00:39:43

of it.

Tim Winders: 00:39:43

Would that be correct?

Joshua Brown: 00:39:45

A hundred percent.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:45

That's

Joshua Brown: 00:39:46

what I'm saying, because I wasn't, I did not have the

Joshua Brown: 00:39:49

framework to connect the dots.

Joshua Brown: 00:39:51

My, my framework was the same framework as a guy at an exponential table who told

Joshua Brown: 00:39:57

me that he believes common day people can start businesses, but not pastors.

Joshua Brown: 00:40:01

And he

Joshua Brown: 00:40:02

was selling Miv degrees.

Joshua Brown: 00:40:05

and

Joshua Brown: 00:40:05

so my framework was still somewhat maybe he's right because he's

Joshua Brown: 00:40:09

educated and knows and he works at this school, if that makes any sense.

Joshua Brown: 00:40:13

Yeah.

Tim Winders: 00:40:14

So one thing that's funny, I wanna read

Tim Winders: 00:40:16

this.

Tim Winders: 00:40:17

Sometimes I'll take someone's

Tim Winders: 00:40:19

bio.

Tim Winders: 00:40:20

and I'll pop it in

Tim Winders: 00:40:21

chat, g p t and say,

Tim Winders: 00:40:22

I'm about to interview this guy Joshua Brown.

Tim Winders: 00:40:25

What are 10 questions

Tim Winders: 00:40:26

I should ask?

Tim Winders: 00:40:28

And this one

Tim Winders: 00:40:28

was a funny one.

Tim Winders: 00:40:29

It relates to what we were talking about.

Tim Winders: 00:40:31

This is, this question is

Tim Winders: 00:40:32

sponsored by chat

Tim Winders: 00:40:33

g p t, by the way, and it shows the the reason why we cannot use AI for everything

Tim Winders: 00:40:40

it says.

Tim Winders: 00:40:40

Asking this question, as the pastor of one of the largest pressure washing

Tim Winders: 00:40:46

companies in Nashville, Tennessee,

Tim Winders: 00:40:48

How do

Tim Winders: 00:40:48

you integrate your faith and

Tim Winders: 00:40:51

work?

Tim Winders: 00:40:51

How

Tim Winders: 00:40:52

does this unique role

Tim Winders: 00:40:53

allow you to serve

Tim Winders: 00:40:54

God and people?

Tim Winders: 00:40:55

I think it's

Tim Winders: 00:40:55

a great

Tim Winders: 00:40:56

question.

Tim Winders: 00:40:57

I don't

Tim Winders: 00:40:57

like the preface of it because it's

Tim Winders: 00:40:59

really marrying those things we're

Tim Winders: 00:41:00

talking about.

Tim Winders: 00:41:02

You are a pastor,

Tim Winders: 00:41:03

you're a shepherd.

Tim Winders: 00:41:05

So I guess it's maybe prophetic, but

Tim Winders: 00:41:08

it sounds weird to ask it.

Tim Winders: 00:41:09

As the

Tim Winders: 00:41:10

pastor

Tim Winders: 00:41:12

of the largest pressure washing

Tim Winders: 00:41:14

business, how do you

Tim Winders: 00:41:16

marry your faith in your work?

Tim Winders: 00:41:18

So I'll, this

Tim Winders: 00:41:19

is

Tim Winders: 00:41:19

sponsored by chat, G P T.

Tim Winders: 00:41:21

Answer

Tim Winders: 00:41:22

that question from her.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:24

Yeah.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:24

So good.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:25

And I appreciate chat doing that for me, like that's a great question and I'm gonna

Joshua Brown: 00:41:29

start putting that more in it because in my head I'm thinking whoever controls

Joshua Brown: 00:41:32

chat controls the world and so we need to start programming chat as much as we can.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:37

But, so this is my thought there.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:40

Is that when Jesus gave an

Joshua Brown: 00:41:41

example of

Joshua Brown: 00:41:42

of how pastors are supposed to live their lives.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:46

He took out his outer robe, he grabbed a water basin, got on his knees and

Joshua Brown: 00:41:51

started washing his disciples sheet.

Joshua Brown: 00:41:54

He gets up from the table and he looks at him and says, do you

Joshua Brown: 00:41:57

know what I just did for you?

Joshua Brown: 00:41:58

for you?

Joshua Brown: 00:41:59

And he says, if you, if your Lord and master has washed your feet,

Joshua Brown: 00:42:02

you go and wash each other's feet.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:05

And I feel like if you want to be a great pastor, you gotta be a

Joshua Brown: 00:42:11

great lover and servant of people.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:12

And I think of no greater role than the role of a servant leader.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:16

And

Joshua Brown: 00:42:17

And so instead

Joshua Brown: 00:42:17

of saying, Hey, feed me, let me feed you.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:20

And so I love the idea of this ministry in the marketplace.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:23

So I'm taking it back to that terminology.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:26

Be a great example of a confessor and a server.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:30

And so when we talk about employees, we never use that word.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:33

It's called team members.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:33

When we talk about an org chart, I'm at the very bottom.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:36

I'm an old root.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:38

And hopefully I'm giving life and support for the tree and the fruit that

Joshua Brown: 00:42:41

falls to grow and become more fruit.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:43

And a lot of ministries and a lot of businesses, the pastor and the c e

Joshua Brown: 00:42:47

o are at the top of the org chart.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:49

And

Joshua Brown: 00:42:50

And all their slave, all their followers and employees, I was about to say, slaves

Joshua Brown: 00:42:54

trying to be funny, are all below them.

Joshua Brown: 00:42:56

And it's man, we're called to die and serve and

Joshua Brown: 00:42:58

support

Joshua Brown: 00:42:59

all that are connected to us.

Joshua Brown: 00:43:01

And so that's the way that a pastor of the largest per washing company in

Joshua Brown: 00:43:05

the globe should answer that question.

Tim Winders: 00:43:08

The

Tim Winders: 00:43:08

reason that's so good.

Tim Winders: 00:43:10

I shared

Tim Winders: 00:43:10

before we started recording.

Tim Winders: 00:43:12

I just finished

Tim Winders: 00:43:12

up doing.

Tim Winders: 00:43:14

some episodes

Tim Winders: 00:43:15

on what I call the

Tim Winders: 00:43:16

faith-driven leader.

Tim Winders: 00:43:18

And

Tim Winders: 00:43:18

in my mind,

Tim Winders: 00:43:19

someone

Tim Winders: 00:43:20

who

Tim Winders: 00:43:20

is driven by

Tim Winders: 00:43:21

their faith

Tim Winders: 00:43:22

and they're in a leadership role,

Tim Winders: 00:43:24

they really do not own anything.

Tim Winders: 00:43:27

Very similar to Jesus, but they're a steward over those things

Tim Winders: 00:43:32

they have been gifted with.

Tim Winders: 00:43:32

with.

Tim Winders: 00:43:33

And I think you've been gifted with this.

Tim Winders: 00:43:36

Have you earned a lot of it with your effort?

Tim Winders: 00:43:38

Yeah, you

Tim Winders: 00:43:38

have.

Tim Winders: 00:43:40

But you've

Tim Winders: 00:43:41

gifted that.

Tim Winders: 00:43:41

So you're a

Tim Winders: 00:43:42

steward.

Tim Winders: 00:43:43

And a steward has one task.

Tim Winders: 00:43:46

It's to take care

Tim Winders: 00:43:47

of something and then return it

Tim Winders: 00:43:50

in a better condition than when they received it.

Tim Winders: 00:43:53

That's good.

Tim Winders: 00:43:54

And that's the mindset that I

Tim Winders: 00:43:56

just heard you say.

Tim Winders: 00:43:57

So

Tim Winders: 00:43:58

I'm so excited.

Tim Winders: 00:43:59

It kind of ties in with some of the teaching we just did.

Tim Winders: 00:44:02

It says on your site that your core values are culture,

Tim Winders: 00:44:07

business.

Tim Winders: 00:44:08

Ministry here at Seek Go Create, we say

Tim Winders: 00:44:13

that we redefine success in leadership,

Tim Winders: 00:44:16

business.

Tim Winders: 00:44:17

And ministry.

Tim Winders: 00:44:18

So we are really meshing together well.

Tim Winders: 00:44:20

But

Tim Winders: 00:44:21

talk about those core values, and

Tim Winders: 00:44:23

I've always heard it said that you need to be able to preach

Tim Winders: 00:44:25

a sermon on your core

Tim Winders: 00:44:26

values, so we don't quite have

Tim Winders: 00:44:28

time for a sermon

Tim Winders: 00:44:29

but just give whatever

Tim Winders: 00:44:31

makes sense of

Tim Winders: 00:44:32

what comes to

Tim Winders: 00:44:33

mind when I

Tim Winders: 00:44:34

bring up your core values, culture, business, and ministry.

Joshua Brown: 00:44:38

I feel like is king.

Joshua Brown: 00:44:39

Culture

Joshua Brown: 00:44:40

is ultimately what other people experience when you're, when they're around you.

Joshua Brown: 00:44:44

And so how does my presence make someone else's presence feel?

Joshua Brown: 00:44:49

In doing great work inside of our own culture

Joshua Brown: 00:44:53

creates the

Joshua Brown: 00:44:53

opportunity To affect the culture around us.

Joshua Brown: 00:44:56

And so for me, culture is at the very top business.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:00

If it's not sustainable, it will die.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:02

And so you have to be smart.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:03

You have to learn from the marketplace.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:05

You gotta be, in my opinion, why not be better than any

Joshua Brown: 00:45:09

other?

Joshua Brown: 00:45:11

Blank

Joshua Brown: 00:45:11

out there, whether it's, selling shoes or pressure washing

Joshua Brown: 00:45:15

services or doing podcasting.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:17

Why

Joshua Brown: 00:45:18

not do it as good as anybody out there on it?

Joshua Brown: 00:45:21

And it's gotta be sustainable through making money and providing

Joshua Brown: 00:45:24

jobs, or you're gonna die.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:25

And then ministry.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:27

The fruit of our businesses, in my opinion, should have some

Joshua Brown: 00:45:31

type of efforts to do for others what they could never do for you.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:35

And so one thing that we do in Nashville is we wash every widow's home.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:39

We are on a mission to wash every widow's home in Nashville for free.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:44

There's a long story there.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:45

Don't know how much time we have, but I originally said there's no way that we

Joshua Brown: 00:45:50

can wash every widow's home for free.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:52

But there was an Andy Stanley quote that said, if you do, you.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:56

Just cuz you can't do it for everybody.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:57

It doesn't mean you can't do it for somebody.

Joshua Brown: 00:45:59

So do for one what you wish you could do for everybody.

Joshua Brown: 00:46:02

And so we've started washing Widow those homes in Nashville and

Joshua Brown: 00:46:05

that's

Joshua Brown: 00:46:05

part of our ministry inside the marketplace.

Joshua Brown: 00:46:08

And there's other behaviors, but that's one that we can

Joshua Brown: 00:46:10

measure.

Tim Winders: 00:46:10

That's

Tim Winders: 00:46:11

very good because

Tim Winders: 00:46:12

because we're commanded

Tim Winders: 00:46:13

take

Tim Winders: 00:46:13

care

Tim Winders: 00:46:14

the widows and the orphans.

Tim Winders: 00:46:18

And I

Tim Winders: 00:46:18

kinda love how you're bookending your life where.

Tim Winders: 00:46:21

in many ways

Tim Winders: 00:46:22

were adopted, you

Tim Winders: 00:46:23

were orphan and obviously you've

Tim Winders: 00:46:26

overcome that.

Tim Winders: 00:46:27

And then now here

Tim Winders: 00:46:28

you are in the

Tim Winders: 00:46:28

position to

Tim Winders: 00:46:30

minister to and do some taking care of the widows.

Tim Winders: 00:46:33

Very cool.

Tim Winders: 00:46:33

Now, at some point, and I think you said it's probably been recent,

Tim Winders: 00:46:38

you've recognized that this pressure washing pastor

Tim Winders: 00:46:44

model

Tim Winders: 00:46:46

can be duplicated.

Tim Winders: 00:46:48

It may not be just Nashville, Tennessee.

Tim Winders: 00:46:50

It can be something that can be done in

Tim Winders: 00:46:53

other places with other people.

Tim Winders: 00:46:56

Tell me about that.

Tim Winders: 00:46:57

that.

Tim Winders: 00:46:57

Tell me about the

Tim Winders: 00:46:58

progression that's gone on there

Tim Winders: 00:46:59

to

Tim Winders: 00:47:00

expand this beyond just Joshua Brown and his business.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:05

Yeah, so in prayer last year, trying to figure out,

Joshua Brown: 00:47:07

we did 1.8 last year and I'm like, okay, what's, what should we do next?

Joshua Brown: 00:47:11

And I felt like the Lord said, do for others what I've done for you.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:15

And that's where we got the pressure washing pastor conversation.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:18

And then I studied what franchising and license and met with lawyers and

Joshua Brown: 00:47:22

started looking at what all systems and what all infrastructure has to

Joshua Brown: 00:47:27

be created to do here, what do in other places, what we're doing here.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:31

And so basically we've created the infrastructure of how

Joshua Brown: 00:47:34

to come alongside of a, in.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:37

Whether it's a pastor, former pastor, or faith-driven entrepreneur, that's

Joshua Brown: 00:47:41

the terminology that I would use.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:42

Someone man, who is a disciple and loves Jesus and is not afraid of connecting

Joshua Brown: 00:47:48

business and discipleship, I believe they need to be married, not divorced.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:53

And there are a lot of businesses that it is divorced, it's not married.

Joshua Brown: 00:47:57

And so we have created

Joshua Brown: 00:47:59

opportunity

Joshua Brown: 00:48:00

for other folks who are interested in opening a home service business to

Joshua Brown: 00:48:04

Hey, come underneath our brand,

Joshua Brown: 00:48:05

come underneath our blueprint and our coaches.

Joshua Brown: 00:48:08

And so we've created the infrastructure to be able to launch

Joshua Brown: 00:48:11

other pressure washing companies in other areas and not be on an island.

Joshua Brown: 00:48:15

And when you look at ministry as a whole, a lot

Joshua Brown: 00:48:18

times you

Joshua Brown: 00:48:18

feel like you're all alone and you have nobody to support you or to

Joshua Brown: 00:48:21

learn from or to keep you accountable.

Joshua Brown: 00:48:23

That's what the branding allows in the coaching and the blueprint of growing

Joshua Brown: 00:48:27

your own pressure washing company.

Joshua Brown: 00:48:29

If that makes sense.

Joshua Brown: 00:48:30

Yeah, no,

Tim Winders: 00:48:30

that's, that makes

Tim Winders: 00:48:31

a lot of sense and I

Tim Winders: 00:48:32

love it.

Tim Winders: 00:48:33

I love that ability to scale

Tim Winders: 00:48:36

and minister to more people, minister to more

Tim Winders: 00:48:38

people, is what I'm hearing.

Tim Winders: 00:48:40

But you mentioned licensing, franchising from the legal standpoint.

Tim Winders: 00:48:45

What is the opportunity that people

Tim Winders: 00:48:47

have?

Joshua Brown: 00:48:49

We

Joshua Brown: 00:48:49

have a licensing agreement that we basically go through.

Joshua Brown: 00:48:52

We

Joshua Brown: 00:48:52

weren't

Joshua Brown: 00:48:53

trying to control, we were trying to gift and create opportunity, but

Joshua Brown: 00:48:57

you have to have a lethal structure in order to not get in trouble.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:00

And so we created a license agreement that basically sets forth the

Joshua Brown: 00:49:04

foundation of what it looks like to be a pressure washing pastor.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:07

You

Joshua Brown: 00:49:07

utilize The branding browns, pressure washing and outta Nashville.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:11

If you just look up Browns pressure washing.com, you'll see that we are

Joshua Brown: 00:49:14

crushing it in the Nashville market.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:17

And in my mind a brand has the ability to

Joshua Brown: 00:49:21

grow.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:22

And brings support when you're doing it on your own or trying

Joshua Brown: 00:49:25

to figure out what's next.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:26

It's like you make so many financial mistakes and it's hard to be able

Joshua Brown: 00:49:30

to create, okay, how do I do this?

Joshua Brown: 00:49:32

What do

Joshua Brown: 00:49:32

I

Joshua Brown: 00:49:32

do here?

Joshua Brown: 00:49:33

How do we hire, how do we soft wash a house, roof wash, and blah, blah blah.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:37

And it's like, why don't we create the whole system where we can

Joshua Brown: 00:49:40

give the playbook, give video structure, we even answer the phones.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:45

Cuz one thing I learned is pastors don't have time to grab their phones.

Joshua Brown: 00:49:48

If they're trying to open a business we send the phone straight to our

Joshua Brown: 00:49:51

headquarters, which creates a lighter payload and then like as far as your

Joshua Brown: 00:49:56

payroll and gives the support to be able to get that pastor at that person's house.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:01

And so that's some of

Joshua Brown: 00:50:02

the things that

Joshua Brown: 00:50:03

we're doing.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:04

So

Tim Winders: 00:50:05

how

Tim Winders: 00:50:05

give

Tim Winders: 00:50:06

yourself a grade.

Tim Winders: 00:50:06

How's the expansion going?

Joshua Brown: 00:50:09

We just started this year and so we've got five locations and.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:14

We're actually this week we have a Chattanooga Pressure Washington pastor

Joshua Brown: 00:50:18

that's down training with the team.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:20

And we've got a Houston Pressure, Washington pastor coming down,

Joshua Brown: 00:50:23

which we're super excited about.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:25

And we've got Birmingham and we have two locations that I

Joshua Brown: 00:50:29

started that ended up crashing.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:31

And I learned a lot about those two fir two first locations.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:36

And it's like you learn more from your failures than you do successes.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:40

And we learn a lot from that situation.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:42

So three.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:42

Good two, a lot of learning that I went

Tim Winders: 00:50:45

Give us the quick tip.

Tim Winders: 00:50:46

What's a learning point?

Tim Winders: 00:50:47

We got a lot of business people listening in.

Tim Winders: 00:50:49

in.

Tim Winders: 00:50:49

What's something that you

Tim Winders: 00:50:51

learned that

Tim Winders: 00:50:51

you could share

Joshua Brown: 00:50:51

with us?

Joshua Brown: 00:50:52

Number one, this is

Joshua Brown: 00:50:53

a n

Joshua Brown: 00:50:53

I would say there's three points and then in action.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:56

You gotta have time, money, and framework.

Joshua Brown: 00:50:59

If you don't have time, don't have money, don't have framework.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:02

Very difficult to grow a business.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:04

If you make

Joshua Brown: 00:51:05

a choice

Joshua Brown: 00:51:05

to grow a business, you need to spend money on marketing.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:09

At the end of the day, if you don't invest in whatever lead

Joshua Brown: 00:51:13

generation tool that is for

Joshua Brown: 00:51:15

your business, it is very difficult.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:18

You either have to have phenomenal relationships, boots on the ground

Joshua Brown: 00:51:22

mindset, which requires a lot of time.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:24

Or you have to say, I've got, X amount of dollars to invest in

Joshua Brown: 00:51:28

marketing that can generate it.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:29

And we've learned the two that shut down.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:32

They did not have the money to market.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:35

They just, and without marketing you, you crumble.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:39

But I was trying to be super kind.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:40

I was like, Hey, I'm going to teach you everything we can.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:43

I'm gonna give you our branding our blueprint, our coaches, and.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:49

They did not have the resources that I didn't check and say, Hey, do you have

Joshua Brown: 00:51:52

money to spend on Google Ads or Facebook or Bing or whatever you wanna use?

Joshua Brown: 00:51:56

And they just didn't.

Joshua Brown: 00:51:57

And so if you're out there and you're struggling to grow your business, you

Joshua Brown: 00:52:01

need to figure out what people are doing.

Joshua Brown: 00:52:03

They're growing in your industry and market like they're marketing market.

Tim Winders: 00:52:09

The thought

Tim Winders: 00:52:10

that just came on my mind, so many people, especially people of faith,

Tim Winders: 00:52:14

they'll say

Tim Winders: 00:52:14

God

Tim Winders: 00:52:15

will just bring people to me which is

Tim Winders: 00:52:19

correct.

Tim Winders: 00:52:21

However, you've gotta have the nets out there, right?

Joshua Brown: 00:52:25

Yeah.

Joshua Brown: 00:52:26

If you have a service to offer, there's people always looking to be served.

Joshua Brown: 00:52:29

And I'm not a big faith-driven prosperity gospel where it's if we

Joshua Brown: 00:52:34

just speak it, it's gonna happen.

Joshua Brown: 00:52:35

I think God ask us to come join with him and we have to work until and plant.

Tim Winders: 00:52:42

So you mentioned earlier you used the term faith-driven entrepreneur.

Tim Winders: 00:52:45

We've used the term faith-driven

Tim Winders: 00:52:47

leader

Tim Winders: 00:52:48

here and you've talked

Tim Winders: 00:52:50

you used

Tim Winders: 00:52:50

term pastor, but

Tim Winders: 00:52:52

If you were to describe the person, cuz

Tim Winders: 00:52:56

I, I actually believe that someone might be listening in

Tim Winders: 00:52:58

right now that

Tim Winders: 00:53:00

may think I wonder if I'm one that I need to

Tim Winders: 00:53:04

get in touch

Tim Winders: 00:53:05

with Joshua.

Tim Winders: 00:53:05

And I'm not, it's not a

Tim Winders: 00:53:07

or anything, but I'm just like,

Tim Winders: 00:53:08

identify your

Tim Winders: 00:53:10

ideal person so that if someone's sitting there

Tim Winders: 00:53:12

thinking that they'll know if they are or not.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:16

Yeah.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:16

For me, the reason I started is cuz I wanted to figure out

Joshua Brown: 00:53:18

how to provide for my family.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:20

And so I feel like if

Joshua Brown: 00:53:21

got a

Joshua Brown: 00:53:21

fuel.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:23

That feeds the fire to say when the truck goes down, when the pressure

Joshua Brown: 00:53:27

washer doesn't work, when things don't work out the way that you're

Joshua Brown: 00:53:31

gonna figure out how to make it work.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:32

Which is why one of the reasons I love student pastors is cuz they can

Joshua Brown: 00:53:36

make a lot out of a couple of twigs or a small budget or whatever it is.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:40

They get things done.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:41

And so I feel like the mindset of someone that says I'm going to

Joshua Brown: 00:53:44

make this happen, and then it just, you're gonna figure it out as you go.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:49

And someone that's not willing to quit and give up and be

Joshua Brown: 00:53:51

humble, honest, and hardworking.

Joshua Brown: 00:53:52

That's the characteristics that, that we promote is if you're

Joshua Brown: 00:53:56

humble, if you're honest and you're a hard worker, those are the

Joshua Brown: 00:53:59

key fundamental components.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:01

In order to be the right person to grow a pressure washing company, you

Joshua Brown: 00:54:05

need to be in a city that is growing.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:08

If everyone's moving away from your city, it might not be a good.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:11

A choice to try to open up a business cuz people are gonna

Joshua Brown: 00:54:13

be holding onto their money.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:15

Find the cities that people are moving to and open up a business there.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:19

It'll create more opportunities to provide for other people in

Joshua Brown: 00:54:22

your

Joshua Brown: 00:54:22

family.

Tim Winders: 00:54:23

That's good.

Tim Winders: 00:54:24

So how

Tim Winders: 00:54:27

can people connect with you if they

Tim Winders: 00:54:29

want more or just

Tim Winders: 00:54:31

they resonated with your story or background?

Tim Winders: 00:54:34

How would you like people to connect with

Tim Winders: 00:54:36

you?

Tim Winders: 00:54:37

We'll include it in the notes.

Tim Winders: 00:54:38

We'll include it in the notes by the way.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:40

Yeah.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:40

It's PressureWashingPastor.com.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:42

You can read a little bit there and also you can scan a QR code or click a

Joshua Brown: 00:54:46

button and schedule a meeting with me.

Joshua Brown: 00:54:48

I've got two hopes out of doing these podcasts and that's to do more podcasts

Joshua Brown: 00:54:53

where I can share my story, what God's done for me, and then also see whether

Joshua Brown: 00:54:57

or not you'd be a good partner to launch a pressure washing company inside your

Joshua Brown: 00:55:00

city.

Tim Winders: 00:55:01

The,

Tim Winders: 00:55:01

the I love the.

Tim Winders: 00:55:03

Pressurewashingpastor.com.

Tim Winders: 00:55:05

Did

Tim Winders: 00:55:05

you have a challenge getting that

Tim Winders: 00:55:06

domain or was it wide open?

Tim Winders: 00:55:08

Yeah,

Joshua Brown: 00:55:09

go to GoDaddy.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:09

I'm like, it's open, let's go.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:12

So anytime you hit one that's available, you get happy.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:15

And so I was very thankful.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:16

And that pressure washing pastor wasn't taken.

Tim Winders: 00:55:18

So

Tim Winders: 00:55:18

they weren't sending you to.info

Tim Winders: 00:55:20

or

Tim Winders: 00:55:21

anything like that?

Tim Winders: 00:55:21

That's

Tim Winders: 00:55:22

really good.

Tim Winders: 00:55:23

Anything else?

Tim Winders: 00:55:23

I've got one final question,

Tim Winders: 00:55:25

but Joshua, anything else

Tim Winders: 00:55:27

on your heart right now?

Tim Winders: 00:55:29

I

Tim Winders: 00:55:29

I know you're a man that's moved by the Holy Spirit and all.

Tim Winders: 00:55:32

Anything else that

Tim Winders: 00:55:33

you just feel compelled

Tim Winders: 00:55:35

to share

Tim Winders: 00:55:36

before we wrap up with one last question?

Joshua Brown: 00:55:39

I'd

Joshua Brown: 00:55:39

say it's significance.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:40

identity, would be something that's in with a moan heart today, is that you

Joshua Brown: 00:55:44

are perfectly incomplete and lacking nothing where with or without a pressure

Joshua Brown: 00:55:50

washing company or whatever you're doing.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:52

So if your listeners are here today, I believe completion is not required.

Joshua Brown: 00:55:58

I, I feel like to accomplish something doesn't mean now you're

Joshua Brown: 00:56:02

complete and whole based on what God has already done for you.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:06

I feel like if we more, if we walked into the fact that God loves

Joshua Brown: 00:56:10

us based nothing on what we have done, but just the fact of his favor

Joshua Brown: 00:56:14

and his goodness and his kindness and we're not trying to accomplish

Joshua Brown: 00:56:19

anything for him, but just trying to live in light of what he's done for us.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:23

I feel like just walking wholeness be free today.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:26

Significance and values found out

Joshua Brown: 00:56:27

the foot

Joshua Brown: 00:56:28

of cross.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:28

It's a great place to

Joshua Brown: 00:56:29

live.

Tim Winders: 00:56:31

What a great way to wrap a great conversation.

Tim Winders: 00:56:34

Thank you, Joshua.

Tim Winders: 00:56:34

My

Tim Winders: 00:56:35

final question, we are

Tim Winders: 00:56:36

seek,

Tim Winders: 00:56:38

go

Tim Winders: 00:56:39

create

Tim Winders: 00:56:39

three words

Tim Winders: 00:56:40

that

Tim Winders: 00:56:40

mean a lot to me that

Tim Winders: 00:56:42

share with the audience.

Tim Winders: 00:56:43

gonna let you pick one of those

Tim Winders: 00:56:45

words over the other two

Tim Winders: 00:56:47

that resonates.

Tim Winders: 00:56:47

Tell me which word and

Tim Winders: 00:56:49

why.

Tim Winders: 00:56:49

That's my last question.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:51

Do you know how hard this question is?

Joshua Brown: 00:56:54

I almost wanna ask you maybe, I don't know.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:56

Yeah, I wanna find out which one your favorite.

Joshua Brown: 00:56:58

But I would say create,

Joshua Brown: 00:57:01

I'd

Joshua Brown: 00:57:01

say create and I love Go.

Joshua Brown: 00:57:03

It was a strong tie between go and create.

Joshua Brown: 00:57:06

But if I could invite your listeners or myself to be thinking, it's like,

Joshua Brown: 00:57:10

how do I create value inside the world?

Joshua Brown: 00:57:12

How do I make a difference?

Joshua Brown: 00:57:14

And so if I were to pick out a word, I'd say go create something glorious

Joshua Brown: 00:57:20

in the name of God and His glory.

Joshua Brown: 00:57:23

And just, man, don't sit on your hands.

Joshua Brown: 00:57:26

Go create

Joshua Brown: 00:57:27

something beautiful

Joshua Brown: 00:57:28

for the glory of

Joshua Brown: 00:57:29

God.

Joshua Brown: 00:57:29

That's

Joshua Brown: 00:57:29

what I

Detached audio: 00:57:30

would

Tim Winders: 00:57:30

say.

Tim Winders: 00:57:31

That's cool.

Tim Winders: 00:57:32

Just to

Tim Winders: 00:57:32

give you a little clue for me,

Tim Winders: 00:57:35

they are

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in the order that the Lord gave them to me

Tim Winders: 00:57:39

in a very significant time that I was

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forced to

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seek first.

Tim Winders: 00:57:46

And then

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go and create,

Tim Winders: 00:57:48

because I had been in

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the mode of creating

Tim Winders: 00:57:50

and anyway.

Tim Winders: 00:57:51

What's beautiful is that

Tim Winders: 00:57:53

right now you've got a business

Tim Winders: 00:57:55

model that you are in the mo in the

Tim Winders: 00:57:57

mode of creating

Tim Winders: 00:57:59

and growing.

Tim Winders: 00:58:00

So I also think that create it makes

Tim Winders: 00:58:02

total sense that would be what resonates

Tim Winders: 00:58:04

with you

Tim Winders: 00:58:04

you more than anything else.

Tim Winders: 00:58:06

Joshua Brown, thank you so much.

Tim Winders: 00:58:08

This has been so good.

Tim Winders: 00:58:09

I knew

Tim Winders: 00:58:09

that it would

Tim Winders: 00:58:10

be, I'm gonna

Tim Winders: 00:58:11

ask a big favor for those listening in.

Tim Winders: 00:58:14

There's someone.

Tim Winders: 00:58:16

There's

Tim Winders: 00:58:16

either a pastor

Tim Winders: 00:58:18

or someone looking to do

Tim Winders: 00:58:19

something, looking for the hustle or something.

Tim Winders: 00:58:23

They meet that criteria that Joshua

Tim Winders: 00:58:24

mentioned.

Tim Winders: 00:58:25

There's someone that needs to

Tim Winders: 00:58:26

hear this message

Tim Winders: 00:58:28

or

Tim Winders: 00:58:28

someone that may have been,

Tim Winders: 00:58:30

had the

Tim Winders: 00:58:30

upbringing that Joshua

Tim Winders: 00:58:32

had.

Tim Winders: 00:58:33

I'm gonna ask you to take a screenshot, or

Tim Winders: 00:58:34

if you're on

Tim Winders: 00:58:35

a player

Tim Winders: 00:58:35

or listening

Tim Winders: 00:58:36

or watching on YouTube, share it with them right now.

Tim Winders: 00:58:40

Don't wait.

Tim Winders: 00:58:40

Share it right now.

Tim Winders: 00:58:42

This is something that someone needs to hear.

Tim Winders: 00:58:46

This message will

Tim Winders: 00:58:47

minister to them and

Tim Winders: 00:58:49

quite honestly, I believe that you

Tim Winders: 00:58:51

needed to hear it too.

Tim Winders: 00:58:52

I know that I did, so I

Tim Winders: 00:58:54

appreciate it.

Tim Winders: 00:58:55

Make sure

Tim Winders: 00:58:55

you're

Tim Winders: 00:58:56

subscribed and following us on

Tim Winders: 00:58:57

all the platforms.

Tim Winders: 00:58:59

Leave reviews if you haven't done that yet.

Tim Winders: 00:59:01

And until next time, we have new episodes every Monday.

Tim Winders: 00:59:04

Until next

Tim Winders: 00:59:05

time, continue