From Depression to Business Triumph: Matthew Sanjari's Inspiring Story

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I think it was about three years into the business.

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And at this point I was severely overweight, incredibly unhealthy,

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dealing with everything I had done.

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And I just said.

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Look, something has got to change.

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And so while I love the big picture, what's the one thing I

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can do right now in front of me?

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You know, there's that leadership adage.

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You always hear you can't manage what you're not measuring.

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And I took that to heart and I was like, I'm going to start to

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measure the crap out of everything.

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And that started to really flip my journey.

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Um, uh,

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How do you turn personal tragedy into a powerhouse for business success?

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Today on seek, go create the leadership journey.

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We welcome Matthew Sanjari, a trailblazing entrepreneur and coach who transformed

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his life after a near fatal accident.

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is the visionary behind.

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Prime Consulting, where he utilizes his 15 years of

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experience to mentor entrepreneurs through critical growth phases.

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His unique methodology, not only focuses on scaling businesses, but

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also emphasizes personal development to lift clients into their full potential.

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Join us as Matthew shares his inspiring journey and invaluable

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insights on turning obstacles into opportunities for leadership growth.

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And growth, Matthew, welcome to seek, go create.

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Thanks for having me, Tim.

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I'm excited to have a great conversation today.

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I'm excited about it too.

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Now you mentioned before we kind of get rolling here, you mentioned you just made

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a move, tell everybody where you are and where you were from before you made that

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move, because it sounds like a big change.

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Yeah, yeah, this has been the year of big changes.

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So I made my way on down.

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I'm in Orlando.

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so central Florida.

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six months ago.

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I moved up from Canada where I had lived practically my whole

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life on and off different spots.

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But yeah, six months ago from Canada to Florida, leaving winter behind.

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that's what I'm doing.

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We, before we hit record, I told you I'm in Colorado Springs as of the time we're

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recording and by the end of day, I'll be in New Mexico working my way south

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for my wintering have, the people in Orlando welcomed you with open arms or,

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or they said like you darn Canadians.

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Why do y'all keep coming down here?

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What's that been like?

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the most part, it's been with open arms, but I'm still getting way too many maple

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syrup jokes for my liking And so I kind of lean into them now when I do business

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pitches, you know, I don't have plat on, I don't have maple syrup for you

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guys, but I do say hello from Canada.

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Very good.

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All right.

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my first question, Matthew, was something like an icebreakery.

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What do you do?

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But I've recently made a shift.

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I'm going to give you choice to answer my first kind of big question.

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I'm just going to give you the two questions and you could say I picked

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this one and start answering it.

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The two questions are what do you do or are you?

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Which question would you prefer to answer and just go ahead and

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pick it and answer the question.

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Hey, let's go with, who are you?

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cause you know what, this is something I'm finding is evolving

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constantly to my surprise.

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but to the question, who are you?

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I would say I'm someone.

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Who's a dreamer.

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I'm passionate about people.

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I've done a variety of things over the years.

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I'm a business coach.

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Now I was a pastor.

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I owned a marketing company, just a variety of things.

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And it really doesn't matter what the skin has been.

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I've realized that at the end of the day, I just want to see

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people reach their potential.

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And so who I am is dedicated to helping people build relationships,

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realize what's on their lives and hopefully get to live it out.

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So something, especially on this podcast, because we kind of mash together

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business, leadership, and ministry.

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that's going to perplex people right away is the fact that you were a pastor.

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you've gone out into the, the world of business and all of that money

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and all of that kind of stuff.

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So I think the first thing I'd like to know is I'd like to know

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a little bit Matthew, the pastor, and then the transition into

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something other than pastoring.

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Sure.

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Yeah.

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I mean, listen, I loved it.

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you know, pastored on and off for, almost 14 years.

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but in 2010, just a group of eight of us in a living room

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decided to play into church and went on this wild, exciting ride.

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But, you know, I learned pretty quickly.

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Basically on day two, we're eight people.

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This probably isn't going to sustain me.

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I need to go find work.

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And so, found a corporate job that eventually led to my first

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round of entrepreneurship.

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And, as I'm sure you can appreciate, I've just over the years realized

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there's so much synergy across both, but again, going back to the, who am

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I, as a pastor, I absolutely loved being able to walk people through life.

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And, you know, it's funny.

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Cause again, I see this.

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Now in my current iteration of work, you know, as a pastor,

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I didn't need to be an expert.

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I just needed to be a great shepherd.

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I just needed to be a great friend.

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I just needed to be someone that was there to help people zoom out or zoom

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in depending on where they were to point them to things that were bigger than me.

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to the person that actually matters.

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And so I loved pastoring, you know, it didn't matter what hat I was wearing,

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you know, I did worship, did creative arts, did some executive role things at

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the end of the day, being able to work, not just with people, but seeing them

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develop, you know, in that leadership level and actually, step into, and I know

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you appreciate this, but so many times.

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And I went through this journey myself so many times seeing people kind of peek

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behind the curtain and realize, Oh, you know, the things that I was critiquing.

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Now, now I'm in the kitchen.

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Now I'm making the food.

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This is a little different and seeing people kind of go

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on that leadership journey.

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I loved it.

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And more than being on a stage more than leading meetings, I think

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it was all just the relational time that we all spent together.

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it's the moments that nobody sees that I look back on and just think were

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these beautiful, profound moments.

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So yeah.

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did you grow up in Canada?

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Is that where you grew up and spent most of your early years?

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Born in Montreal, lived in Ottawa, went up to Bible college in Vancouver, but spent a

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lot of my time in Ottawa, central Canada.

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Okay.

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Cause you, I mean, Montreal all over to Vancouver, that's all over that,

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spanning the, for, for those south of the border, we have no idea how far.

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We think Canada is just, you cross over somewhere in Detroit

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and all of Canada is right there.

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So, that, Montreal is a long way from Vancouver, long ways away.

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did, did you grow up with the mindset or the heart or whatever you want

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to call it of, I'm going to go into ministry and be a pastor or what was

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Matthew like in his growing up years?

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You know, after you got over there, you want to be a fireman or an

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astronaut or those type of things.

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What was, what was your desires of what you wanted to be growing up?

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You know what?

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Funny enough, I was constantly oscillating.

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my parents had different ideas for me, but I was constantly oscillating

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between either actually wanted to go into ministry, youth ministry,

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or I wanted to be a football coach.

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I love sports, love playing it, love the coaching side,

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love, inspirational stories.

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the older I got, I really started to realize, wow, this idea of coaching or

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helping people reach their potential.

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obviously very passionate about it in a Christian context, in a ministry context.

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But I think, even as a kid, I'd look at that and be like, man, as

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if a coach can sit there, like, I'd watch basketball and Michael Jordan,

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like he's the greatest player alive.

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And even he has a coach, right?

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Even he's got someone who's drawn up plays, who's pulling them aside and

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saying, Hey, make these adjustments.

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So were you in a Christian home growing up?

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Were your parents, you know, spiritual depth church goers?

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how would you define the spiritual atmosphere of your home?

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So to give people some context.

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Love my parents.

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they're definitely on the crazy side.

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I grew up in this beautiful dichotomy where my father to

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this day is still an atheist.

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My parents are still married.

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my father's an atheist, smartest man, philosophy.

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Logic, probably, you know, on the political spectrum, goes

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one way as far as he can.

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and then you have my mother who on the other side flips to the political

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side on the other side, and she, I don't think she met a plant,

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she wasn't willing to pray for it.

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And so I grew up in this dichotomy where my mother was like, I'm going

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to raise my family in the faith.

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And my dad said, that's wonderful.

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I'm just going to make him question it at every turn.

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And looking back, it's funny because when you zoom back, it's kind of messed

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up and feels like a recipe for disaster.

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But I look back and say the ability to question and the ability to wrestle

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with my faith at an early age, teenage years, young adult years, especially as

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I started, experiencing personal tragedy.

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Was so formative and has allowed me to help other people on those journeys

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where now hopefully people aren't afraid to question and they're not afraid

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to get into the messier areas of what leadership and ministry looks like.

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And so, yeah, my upbringing was such a dichotomy.

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A master class in diversity, but one that I'm really, really grateful for.

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So one thing that's fascinating about that, I actually don't think,

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I mean, obviously I would pray for your father for salvation and all,

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but I don't think that's a bad thing you were able to recognize a

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dichotomy I've been studying a lot of.

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Revelation recently and you know that church that was so lukewarm.

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I think many families have this, church going I interviewed someone recently.

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They said, you know what 52, days out of the year we were in church That

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was it, know, there wasn't like this One way the other I think it actually

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would be healthy to have this is what this looks like I'm holding my hands up

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for those that are listening in on the audio, the video, they say, Oh, okay.

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And this is what this other looks like.

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Obviously your mother was attempting to move you along a certain way, but at what

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point did your faith become your own?

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it wasn't maybe your mother's or something like that.

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When did you own it?

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Yeah, I would say there was two, I had two distinct come to Jesus moments as

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well as how I would refer to the mass.

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You know, there was one where I,

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Yeah.

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Come to Jesus.

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I had one, the first one was the guy who really mentored me in a ministry, my

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pastor for many years, he basically sat me down and we had this conversation, he

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had a youth ministry at the time and he was attracting people that would never

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step foot otherwise in the churches.

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And I remember going there and, one of the frustrations

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growing up for me is I was like.

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Church feels so stuffy.

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I'm like, why is Christianity so stuffy?

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I had a really diverse upbringing, And so my friendships mirrored that.

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I grew up with guys who were Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, and I'm like,

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this feels just as stuffy as them.

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Like, what's the difference?

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And I remember, we'd have these long conversations over coffee,

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till the wee hours in the morning.

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and I'd start to realize that maybe God is, so much bigger

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than a laundry list of rules.

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Maybe there's much more than just the moral law of the Ten Commandments.

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And so that sent me down a journey where for the first time in my life, I started

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to get into the word and I started to read the Bible and I didn't want to

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stab myself in the leg while reading it.

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It didn't feel like a chore anymore.

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And that first experience really set me down this path where I was like, Okay.

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I'm getting a different picture of God.

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That's no longer secondhand it's firsthand.

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And it's starting to change and transform who I am.

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and then we'll talk in just a moment.

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Cause you obviously had, a catalytic event occur with an accident,

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but there was one thing that you brought up that was so interesting.

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It's so kind of closer to my story.

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I would say my upbringing would be more We kind of popped in and out

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of church and spiritual foundation because we grew up in the south.

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Everyone just assumes they're a christian, you know, it's like kind of like we

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are here There's bibles all around there's churches all around therefore.

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We all are christians.

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Obviously, that's not good theology right there, but I Wanted to be both

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my parents were educators and matthew.

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I wanted to be a coach a teacher.

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So I wanted, I felt like I was created to coach from an early age.

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The thing that kind of set me in a different direction was that I had a

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conversation with my parents at some point, late high school career, and

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I found out how much money they made.

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And it sort of changed a good bit for me.

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I said, you know what?

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I don't think I want to do that.

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I didn't realize we were poor and so I don't want to be poor.

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And so I went after like engineering and went to Georgia tech, I

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did, I came back to coaching.

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And so what I'm curious about, because you talked about ministry.

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And coaching, talk about, compare those two, especially now that you've

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gone through, you've been a pastor, you've obviously been a coach, you've

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worked in ministry environments, you've worked in business environments.

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Talk about if there's, contrasts like differences, talk about what that is,

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but talk about the similarities because truthfully, I see a lot of similarity.

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So talk about those two.

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Oh, you hit it on the head.

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I think there's so many similarities and I was just having this conversation

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actually with someone the other day.

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To me, I view both of them as a coach, as a pastor.

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I view them as invitations to stewardship, right?

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Like someone, I'm being entrusted.

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With someone's life, someone's business, someone's journey, and

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you know, I didn't get to choose when they joined themselves to me or

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when I joined myself to that, right?

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That's the starting point.

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And sure, we'd all love.

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I mean, you know, whether you're on social media or the books you read.

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it doesn't, we all want that linear journey.

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That's just not life.

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But how I respond during that journey with this person, with this entity,

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that's actually what matters, right?

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How we prepare each other, how we zoom out, how we talk through blind spots,

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how we prepare when no one's looking.

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These are the things that matter, you know, in pastoring, it's

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the moments of having these conversations and walking people.

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Through the times that are neither hard nor good.

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That'll impact how they then handle the hard and the good.

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And in coaching, especially on the business side, the leadership side, before

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you ever get on a platform, what does it look like on how you treat your team?

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In the silos in the quiet, right?

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And so I think I just see so many similarities and they all

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come back to stewardship for me.

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And it's this idea that I try and pass on to people is, hey, as long as there's the

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grace for you to be in my life and for this to be in my life, how I treat this,

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how I steward this, how I handle this.

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I think says a lot about me and says a lot about the value I place on them.

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Yeah, I think that's good.

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Stewardship is such a great word.

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And I love the contrast between stewardship and ownership because,

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you know, as a pastor, truthfully, I don't think you own anything as

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definitely in the role that you play, you go in and you don't own anything.

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Any of that, you probably don't have ownership in companies, businesses.

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There, there's been times that I've had discussions about some ownership

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piece with what I do, but not really.

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We're just stewards, caretakers, overseers, trustees, whatever

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word you want to use.

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There's another word in I'll call it church world that's used a lot, but I

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don't know that it's understood in that word is discipleship or discipling.

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Let's go ahead and throw that into the mix and talk about comparisons, contrasts,

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same thing, discipling, discipleship, as it relates to coaching and that word that

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we use a lot in business, which is coach.

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Do you see any similarities there also?

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yeah, so many.

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I feel like people are going to think we rehearsed this.

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No, this is actually just happening all the fly.

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But, on the discipleship side, I think it's a great word to use in this

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context because I think to myself, You know, based on what I feel like the

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Bible said, and the life that Jesus is modeled, discipleship is how do we

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equip people with the tools so they can best run the race set before them?

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Right?

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And I think the same is true in leadership and in business.

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If we teach people, I'm all for frameworks, I'm all for guidelines.

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But if we try and force people into frameworks and guidelines, when something

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off the map, Or something that they can't handle gets thrown at them.

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A lot of times things blow up and people get erratic and they go off course.

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But when we equip them with the skills and we equip them with the tools, we

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put tools in their tool belt to say, Hey, when this comes, I love how the

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Lord frames it where it's like in this world, there will be trouble, but take

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heart for I've overcome the world.

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And I think in discipleship, it's this idea.

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Hey, bad things are going to happen.

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Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

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You're going to be disappointed.

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You're probably going to experience failure.

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There's going to be rejection.

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I don't care if it's sports, ministry, business, life, relationships, whatever.

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So let's get really honest.

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And start to equip each other with the tools and that might

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be, why'd you get in your Bible?

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Right?

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Why don't you get into some, some personal development?

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Why don't you get in prayer?

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Why don't you start to work on your communication?

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Why don't you get some accountability in your life?

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Again, there's parallels on either side, but how well we embrace those tools.

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I think those, that's what sets us up for the journey of discipleship.

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the thing that I love and I appreciate the, passion when

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I asked that question for you.

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I like that.

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the thing that I've noticed.

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is that in church world, they talk about discipleship, but they have

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difficulty with it because it's sometimes difficult, standing in a

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pulpit, talking to a hundred, 200, 300, that's not necessarily discipling to

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me, but I am sure that today, yesterday, probably tomorrow, you were on.

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Phone calls, probably 30 minutes to an hour, maybe longer.

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And you'd probably do that monthly, if not weekly with the same people.

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And it's really connecting.

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And I think you can't disciple coach influence, steward someone, once

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a week, 45 minutes up on a stage.

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You might have some influence over them, but I think it's one of the

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closest things to discipleship that we have in our current culture.

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What are your thoughts?

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I love that.

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I'd agree, right?

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Like, I think one thing that I really.

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started to delve into is, you know, there's a difference between

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information and revelation, right?

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and again, this transcends whether we're talking about church or the

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business world, it's like information.

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I can say, Hey, you know, this person is six foot four.

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They weigh 200 pounds.

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They've got a wingspan.

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That's 70 inches.

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That's information.

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Revelation is when they punched me in the face and I feel the contact of that

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punch that, you know, like that's impact.

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And so I can give a lot of information in these mass settings

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just like you have, right?

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Speaking on stages, but that revelation, that coaching, that intimacy, that's

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actually born out of these smaller environments where we're able to

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make it personal and we're able to address things and just talk

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about things that actually connect.

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I love that word connection.

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There's a connection between two individuals or, you

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know, even in smaller groups.

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as impressive and, sometimes needed as these big information gatherings are, I

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think these revelatory moments and these moments of discipleship, have to happen up

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close because they involve relationship.

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As you moved out of what we would call pastoring or ministry, it sounds like

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you recognized early on that to have full time income in a ministry role was key.

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Going to be challenging.

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Is that correct?

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Did I hear that earlier?

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Yeah, yeah, especially just because, again, we planted, right?

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Like, it's not like, you know, I had thought about going the route of

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working at different churches, but we were young, dumb and naive and

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had what we felt like was, The call of God to do this, and so we did it.

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did you at all have this thought of I'm gonna i'm gonna throw a word out.

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I don't like to use but I think most people understand it Do

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you have a thought of failure?

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when you decided to move away from a ministry role into a Corporate role and

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then your own business and other things.

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So is there any like failure or Darn or anything like that that crossed your mind?

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Tim Daley.

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tell your mom or anything like that.

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Tim Daley hourly actually.

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Yeah.

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And, it feels a little stupid to think that, but I also think it's

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just reality, you know, ministry.

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It's funny because like, and I know you know this and so many of your listeners

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know this, but it's like everything's ministry if we're honest with it, right?

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It's all ministry.

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But when we think of pastoral ministry, because it's an emotional investment

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that we're so tied to, I think the disconnect that of, you know, Oh,

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well, I'm not doing this full time.

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This isn't the thing that's putting food on my table can be

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really hard for a lot of people.

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And I know it was true for me, right?

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This idea that like, oh, man, I, my attention is divided.

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I have to do this because I need to put food on the table.

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But I just wish I was spending all of my time.

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You know, I could be doing more.

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I could be talking more people.

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I could be taking more people out for coffee.

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I could.

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And so, yeah, I feel like failure was definitely a thing for a long

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time and the business, even early business success didn't mask that.

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Interesting.

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So I want to fast forward briefly and then I'm going to go back for a

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couple of things to fill in the gaps because we're heading towards you and

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I are going to have some fun shortly.

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Just really talking about business strategy leadership

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So this is going to be some good content, but there's a couple

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of things about Matthew I want to know a little bit more about.

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I love the story and the journey here.

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we go back and we talk about that failure or that time that you would have been

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in ministry in a church plant, which is like one of the highest, Echelons

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that in ministry world, they elevate you and say, Oh, you did church plant.

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That's like two, two notches below missionary in Africa.

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And, you know, evangelist that travels the world and, you know, gets people saved.

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And then it's church planner.

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So you were there today.

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Do you believe you're doing less than as much as, or more?

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ministry than you were doing then, which one of those would it

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be less than as much as or more?

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Yeah.

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and I think that's a great question.

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I think I would have answered this very differently at different

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points of my life, but right now I would say as much as.

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you and I talked about this earlier.

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I think for me, I've really stepped into this honest revelation from God where I

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am like, man, I've been called to people.

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I've been called to help steward relationships and help

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people reach their potential.

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And it doesn't matter what the skin is.

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It doesn't matter.

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You know, at the end of the day, God has very kindly changed the skin on

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me a few times over the last 14 years.

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But at the end of the day, I still get to have an impact.

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the methods have changed, but the message hasn't.

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And so to me, I would say just as much, and I'm not sure I would

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have been as honest with you, over the course of the last 14 years.

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Yeah, that's good.

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I agree with that.

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I had long discussions with people at Bible school that, their measure

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of doing what God wants and people have to go on their own journey.

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Period.

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I was a business guy.

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I was saved in a business setting.

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I've always been in the business arena you know, have never been in truth.

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Kind of like you always felt churches were a bit stuffy.

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I, Don't really enjoy going in our traditional church settings.

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Give me a business setting where I'm facilitating a leadership group

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and man, that's church for me.

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I love that.

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So all right, Matthew, I'm a firm believer that there's two ways people

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make significant change in their lives.

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One is we hire a coach, we focus, we come up with a plan.

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We go through a methodical, Change process to do something different

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and I think this is the more common one some catalytic event occurs And

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it literally a two by four or a car accident or a financial collapse in my

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situation Changes everything about who we are Sounds like there was quite a

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catalytic event in your life that occurred I think it was 12 plus plus years ago

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something like that I me about that.

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And, and did it, did it have that change that I'm talking about?

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Or if it didn't, that's fine, but tell me about that and what occurred there.

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Oh, listen, it did.

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It had the Hollywood movie effect that, that I think I could have never imagined.

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you know, 12 years ago, I was driving at the time.

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I think I was 23 years old.

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I was driving home late at night from a girl I was dating.

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I was driving home from her house.

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I think it was like 11 p.

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m.

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at night and a country road.

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And two horses jump out onto the road at the last second.

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Yeah, horses.

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And I don't know if you know horses.

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I did not.

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I know now.

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But it was two Clydesdales.

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and I, I couldn't stop.

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They were joined.

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And I slammed on the brakes last second.

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Absolutely totaled my car.

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one of the horses fell onto the car, absolutely crushed the, like the

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car crumbled and, when the, when the proverbial and literal dust settled

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and the, and the car had spun a few times, I realized like, you know, it's

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dark at night, the windshield, like three inches is what they measured

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and I would have been toast and, and, you know, I, I basically broke out the

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car door because the frame had bent.

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Knocked on the door of the closest house again, we're in the country, so we're

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talking a mile between every house and ended up making my way to the hospital I

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tell everybody, you know, I did what every young, dumb, naive, 20 something year old

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male does where they give it a few days and they say, nothing's wrong with me.

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Everything's fine.

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turns out as, days turn to weeks and weeks turn to months

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that everything wasn't fine.

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I actually got diagnosed with multiple disabilities, some cognitive that

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truthfully still affect me to this day.

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that led me to this place where within a few short months, I was no longer working.

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I had to take a break from church.

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And serving and being on staff.

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and it felt like the extrovert in me didn't want to see people.

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And I found myself in this place, that, uh, I didn't want to do anything.

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I found myself in bed depressed in a year out.

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I basically would be completely different human than what I feel like I had

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signed up for to be my lot in life.

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And, uh, so what were the results of that?

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You couldn't do certain things what, what of your life trajectory

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changed due to an unfortunate event?

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I, I've got to ask this too.

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Um, Pretty confident the horses didn't come out of that situation

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very well either, correct?

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No, no, they didn't.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Instant on impact.

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Um, yeah.

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As for life changes again, you know, everything without without exaggerating

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everything ground to a halt, right?

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I had to leave my job because the headaches and the pain just got so

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bad that I actually couldn't stay.

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I was calling in sick all the time.

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And so I found myself depressed.

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in bed, not seeing people, all things, just the antithesis of, of me.

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Um, and you know, I found myself angry at God, you know, like what the heck

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here I am starting a promising career in two different fields, loving my life.

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I'm, I'm in my early twenties, I'm getting opportunities.

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You know, it feels like I have the, the world's my oyster.

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I have a, I have a, the whole canvas ahead of me and truthfully,

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everything just ground to a halt.

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For about a year.

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And, and so, so what you out of it, snapped you out of it, led you out of it.

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What did you do?

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What did others do?

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Let's talk about that journey beyond that, because it's my belief.

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I don't think it's a car accident.

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I don't know if it's financial collapse, like we went through, but I think everyone

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has to go through stuff and, and I think we find out what people are made of or.

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Who they are or where their faith is or whatever.

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We could throw a lot of words in there when those situations occur.

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So talk about the journey after that year and moving beyond that.

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Yeah, so you know what?

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About a year in and this is the kindness of God.

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I can say this over every aspect of my story that we'll cover today.

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Every aspect that I can just see the kindness of God woven through it.

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And, I had a friend reach out about a year in and said,

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Hey, I work at a pool company.

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They make custom pools.

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They need some help with some computer stuff.

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And, you know, my dad worked in I.

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T.

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And he said, can you come help us?

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And I was like, well, that's my dad's thing.

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And he's like, no, can you come help us?

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And he was just throwing me a bone.

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He was like, they're going to pay you cash.

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Just take the job, just get out of the house.

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And I was like, okay, I'll give it a shot.

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And, you know, I went out there, business owner comes and talks to me and he starts

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asking me some really random questions.

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We just hit it off.

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And, you know, within a matter of time, he said, Hey, like,

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what do you think of our website?

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And, you know, he pulls it up and I'm looking at it and I'm like,

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this website's awful in my head.

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I'm like, I can't tell him this.

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I just met this man.

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I'm like, he's going to ask me to go home right now.

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and he, he just kept pushing.

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He's like, no, no, be honest.

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I'm like, yeah, if I'm honest, I'm like, I, I wouldn't do this.

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I think this looks terrible.

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And he said, you know, what can you do better?

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And I was like, probably.

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And he said, okay, well let's try it.

Speaker: 00:30:24

And I walked out of there, Tim, with my first marketing client.

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Didn't go to school for marketing, had no marketing experience, had

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never worked a marketing job.

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and looking back, it was just the Lord being like, Hey, here's, here's your shot.

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Here you go.

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And I use that money for my first client to teach myself marketing.

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And that was the day my marketing company was born.

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And, um, I would love to end the story there and say that it was a

Speaker: 00:30:47

happy ending and everything was great.

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Truth is for the next three years, business was awful.

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Um, you know, because as kind as the Lord was to provide that initial start, I came

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into this reckoning where I realized that everything I knew about leadership and

Speaker: 00:31:01

business was really one sided, right?

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I was a great face.

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I could communicate well, I was an A type, you know, big ideas,

Speaker: 00:31:10

but I had zero life experience.

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I'm like, I actually didn't know anything about the details.

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I never really proven any the things I had talked about in

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settings, um, which is shocking.

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Cause you know, I think a lot of people think, Oh, if you speak

Speaker: 00:31:24

from a platform, you've lived this.

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I didn't was way too young still.

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And, uh, and I basically for those first three years, as quick

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as I got a client, I'd lose it.

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There was no systems, no strategy, no structure.

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And, um, if you're talking turning point quickly, I remember looking myself

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in the mirror in 2016, I think it was about three years into the business.

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And at this point I was severely overweight, incredibly unhealthy,

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dealing with everything I had done.

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And I just said.

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Look, something has got to change.

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And so while I love the big picture, what's the one thing I

Speaker: 00:32:03

can do right now in front of me?

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You know, there's that leadership adage.

Speaker: 00:32:08

You always hear you can't manage what you're not measuring.

Speaker: 00:32:12

And I took that to heart and I was like, I'm going to start to

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measure the crap out of everything.

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And that started to really flip my journey.

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So would you say, I mean, one of the things that I know you address, I

Speaker: 00:32:26

address this also with, with leaders is attempt to see what their mindset is.

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What their mindset is like, because often that can ripple

Speaker: 00:32:38

throughout an organization.

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What was your mindset at this time?

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Would you, I'm going to throw a few words out and then you could either

Speaker: 00:32:44

agree, disagree or pick them apart.

Speaker: 00:32:45

But I mean, when someone's gone through stuff, even though they could be

Speaker: 00:32:50

attempting to be optimistic, there could be a victim type mindset in a poor,

Speaker: 00:32:56

pitiful me or blaming or mad at God.

Speaker: 00:32:59

that earlier or things like that.

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And if we look back on it, we.

Speaker: 00:33:04

We think we should have been more successful, but then we realized,

Speaker: 00:33:08

no, I shouldn't have been because my mindset or something like that.

Speaker: 00:33:13

What would, what was your mindset like during that years?

Speaker: 00:33:16

You said that was still challenging post at least getting business going.

Speaker: 00:33:22

Yeah, this is, this is such a good question.

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I, to speak to that victimhood, I literally looked at this

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accident, anything associated with as having robbed my life.

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It ruined my life.

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It took everything from me.

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And, for the first year or two, there was a lot of people who agree.

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They're like, Oh yes, that's awful.

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As if that happened to you.

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Yeah.

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And then I found myself now surrounded by, God bless them, people

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and opinions and my own internal thoughts that were just echoing this

Speaker: 00:33:51

chamber of, yeah, you're a victim.

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And I sat there for years, years, from 2012 to about 2016, blaming my pain

Speaker: 00:34:01

for the reason why I wasn't living up to my potential or walking out my

Speaker: 00:34:05

purpose, uh, only to realize that it wasn't my pain that was doing that.

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It was my perspective and when I dialed in and actually more than a

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nice motto, figured out what that perspective was, I really think that

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that was the shift for me in every area of my life, not just my business.

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And one of the things I think this is important, I think it's

Speaker: 00:34:28

in Matthew seven towards the tail end of the sermon on the mount.

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Very significant that I'm interviewing Matthew here and

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I'm quoting Matthew seven.

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I'm not going to quote it.

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I'm going to give the reference.

Speaker: 00:34:38

Jesus says the rains come, the storms come for those that are built on set

Speaker: 00:34:46

for those houses that are built on sand.

Speaker: 00:34:48

And also the rains come in the storms come for those that it's built on a foundation.

Speaker: 00:34:55

You had a spiritual foundation there that was underneath

Speaker: 00:35:00

that mindset and that victim.

Speaker: 00:35:02

How,

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when did that rear its head up and start taking over and start

Speaker: 00:35:08

getting you back on track of where you kind of started transitioning

Speaker: 00:35:12

from, okay, I'm not a victim.

Speaker: 00:35:14

I'm a victor.

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I'm operating in the kingdom of God, not in the Babylonian

Speaker: 00:35:19

system or the world system.

Speaker: 00:35:21

And because I'm guessing a lot of the situation some of the pain all that

Speaker: 00:35:26

stuff probably didn't change between the years is what's changed or maybe

Speaker: 00:35:31

the soul So just tell me more about that before we get into I want to

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go strategy, but this is good stuff right here This is foundational.

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I mean, full disclosure, it's 12 years since the accident and

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I still live with that pain.

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I woke up this morning with some of that pain.

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So you're right, it hasn't gone away.

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But I remember this, I just said the whole perspective shift.

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I'm having this conversation with someone at church.

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And we're having this, we're having coffee, just having

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this, this great conversation.

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And this person starts to open up about chronic pain.

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They start to open up about some really serious things

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that they had been battling.

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And I'm sitting here shocked because I'm like, you know, This person is pretty well

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known in our church, you know, they hadn't really to my knowledge ever voiced that.

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And so I started to say, hey, you know, why, why me?

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Why are you sharing this with me?

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And what what's made you comfortable enough to share?

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And they went, because when you share your struggle, Matt, and I see you

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keep showing up to things like this coffee, and I still see you, you know,

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playing keys at church or talking.

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It, it pushes me that there's hope for me, and I remember going home and

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crying my eyes out because I thought to myself, I'm like, if this person, I'm

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like, first off, I don't have half the hope this person does, but if they can

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pull from the mess that I am right now.

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And they can choose in the midst of what I thought was an awful situation

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that they were disclosing to me.

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Like, I wonder if there's some, there's some perspective to be had here.

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I wonder how much of this is like me in my head.

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And obviously things didn't switch overnight, but that

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was such a catalyst for me.

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Seeing someone be able to draw these These beautiful conclusions

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from what I felt was like this absolute mess of a life at the time.

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Yeah, that's good.

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And I i'm i'm sure not only there was physical stuff i'm guessing things

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like that Wreck our finances and those things are challenged but 2016

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there's Things started to Obviously, you started getting more business.

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You had your company and then you have now moved into coaching.

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I think you exited your company.

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Let's start now talking about what all that was like.

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What what are some of the success keys that you learned along the way there?

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That we could learn from.

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So let's go to 2016 on, tell me what we need to know about that.

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Yeah.

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So you know what, let me, if it's okay with you, I'm going to paint

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the dichotomy, you know, you asked me to be getting two questions

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and I answered the second one.

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Let's, let's answer the first one quickly.

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So, So I'm a both a business coach and a business consultant.

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And so to me, the dichotomy of the two is really important.

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Cause I function as a hybrid and that's important because as a coach, I feel

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like I'm there with the entrepreneur.

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We're talking high level problem solving.

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What are the things that are ailing you?

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Can I help you zoom out?

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And as I started to do that, I started to realize there was a real disconnect.

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Full disclosure.

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I'm sure you can appreciate this.

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I never wanted to use the title coach because in my mind, I had this judgment

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that I was like, there's a million coaches on social media, Lord knows if.

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99 percent of them or even I'm qualified.

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but it fits, right?

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You're coaching people.

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So I'm like, what else is there?

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But I started to realize as I worked with people, there was a

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disconnect on the implementation.

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Didn't matter how good our strategy was, how good our sessions were.

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If you weren't taking this back to your team or your business.

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And so the consultant side of me said, well, we need this.

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And rather than this just be a good idea, that was the key to me

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unlocking the success in my own business, in my own life, realizing,

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look, I've been an A type problem solving strategic guy my whole life.

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That's wonderful, but I'm a one man shop right now.

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So I've got to do the work and I've actually got to put the effort in.

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And so I learned what it meant to build systems and structures and things

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that I previously didn't care about.

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And so.

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Going on that journey for me led me to this from a leadership perspective.

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I said, look, I've read all these books, you know, 80, 20 rule, all this stuff,

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Pareto principle, what can I apply to me?

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So I started to go with the mindset that I said, look, I'm, I'm, I'm an eight type.

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I'm a visionary.

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I'm a sales guy.

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So I'm going to fill my capacity to a hundred percent.

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I'm going to go until I feel like the absolute stress.

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And then when I get there and I can feel the tension.

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I'm going to start to delegate.

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I'm going to start to offload.

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And, you know, now I know that as my framework, the automate delegate

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eliminate that I use with my clients.

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But my goal in the beginning was the realization is if I took myself

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from a hundred to 70%, well, I just bought back 30 percent of my time.

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And so once I brought somebody else on that was doing that, I

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was like, Oh, I just freed up 30%.

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What am I going to do?

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I'm going to focus on the things that I know how to do.

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I know how to sell.

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I know how to talk to people.

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I know how to create a good culture and treat my employees.

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Well, fill myself up to a hundred.

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Oh, we reached the capacity start.

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And whether it was automation and figuring out technology stacks and some of the

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cool things, AI, uh, or delegation.

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You know, actually figuring out, okay, you know, what are the

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things not just delegating tasks, responsibilities, uh, elimination?

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Am I doing redundant things?

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All of these things started to put me down this path, Tim, of over and over again,

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I started to build something that was scalable, that was, you know, Not just

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relying on me anymore, and that's kind of what I've carried into what I'm doing now.

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I guess one of the things I'd love to know, we don't shy away

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from, you know, uh, the, like we talk about the mature topics here.

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Where did you personally start seeing, I guess, let's, let's say financial reward.

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That's not a, our, our ultimate measure of success, but it's, it's like where

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you looked around and said, okay.

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This is working.

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Where, where was that timeframe?

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16, 17, 18 yesterday.

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I don't know whenever, you know, when, when would you say, man, okay, is

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working, the systems are working and I'm gaining financial reward for it.

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Yeah, 2017.

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2017 was the moment where I felt the shift, and it was that exact thing,

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or the first time I went, Look, if I, if I measure my capacity from

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0 to 100, and I'm at 100, this is great, but now I'm capped, because

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everything's reliant on me, on my labor.

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So when I did that, that first offloading, without even realizing it, it, it,

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again, it sounds so good on paper, but it hadn't hit my head yet when I realized.

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Wait, I've now brought somebody on.

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I can go generate more revenue.

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Wait.

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This is amazing.

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And it actually became addictive to me.

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And it's something that for me unlocked in business, but also unlocked in

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leadership because now from a church perspective, I was like, wait, you know,

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I had routinely just, I'm like, okay, we've got four leaders, you get this,

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you get this, you get this, you get this.

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And you know, we had survived, but it never felt like we

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were harnessing momentum.

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Now, when I applied that same logic, I was like, wait, what would

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it look like to now help people build a third level of leadership?

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Whereas they get filled up.

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They start to bring somebody on.

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And so to me, that was the real shift in my leadership and in my financial, when

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I realized that I'm capped, I have a capacity, I have an emotional capacity,

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physical capacity, all the capacities.

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And the key is how well I'm able to leverage the things in my life so that

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I can keep focusing on the things that I feel like God has equipped me to do.

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Sure.

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Are you working prime?

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Are you working primarily with, we'll call them for profit companies.

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You mentioned church just then.

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because one thing that is.

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Somewhat aggravating to me at times is how structures don't use some of the

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things like automate, delegate, eliminate.

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They, they, they think in different terms.

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And listen, there is a spiritual component I know, and you know,

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there's some differences there, but do you work all four?

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for profit or do you do anything in the non profit arena also or the church world?

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Yeah, not in the church world right now per se, but I do have some non

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profit clients because again, and I'm sure you can appreciate this to me, and

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this is just my opinion, so hopefully nobody sends you any nasty emails, but,

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I'm just of the opinion that I think sometimes we over spiritualize things.

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I think that this is a God given principle.

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Again, the message can remain the same.

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The skin can change, but the message at the end of the day is like, Hey, is this

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going to help us pastor people better?

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Is this going to help us lead people into a deeper relationship with Jesus?

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Is this going to give people the skills and talents and unlock the things in

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their life to live healthier marriages, better lives, more God given and God

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purposed lives, then yeah, let's do it.

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Even if that's as simple as sending out a scheduling request and, you know,

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starting to automate some of these, introducing some software, you know,

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in our lives, it would be inexcusable.

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I think for many of us that are listening to ever say, well,

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we've always done it this way.

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And yet that's the exact same thing I hear time and time again.

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I'm sure you have.

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Uh, in churches and in ministry.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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We've always done it this way.

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I'm a, I am so non traditional.

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It truly annoys quite a bit of people around me so much so that even,

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you know, we're recording this, we're about to be in the holiday

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season of Thanksgiving, Christmas.

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I am like, so non traditional when it comes to that stuff.

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family does kind of get a little bit annoyed it truthfully, but know, it's

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just the way I push the envelope and all that so tell me give me give me some

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profiles of the type people that you work with that you feel like you're You

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are jamming you're rocking with them and it is really working to either size

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company size organizations uh Things that are going on, things like that.

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Just tell me more about the type people you work with.

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Okay, so I asked two questions that I think really delve into

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who my ideal client is, who the people I love working with is.

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So the first question, uh, is a bit jarring for a lot of people.

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But the first question is, Hey, heaven forbid, if you got knocked out of your

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business or your church or your leadership for 30 days and you had no contact, right,

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no plan, no contact, heaven forbid it happened, what would you come back to?

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What kind of finances would you come back to?

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What, what kind of team would you come back to?

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What, what, what kind of clients would you come back to?

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And everybody always has this like I see this like awkward

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laugh and they just go pale.

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And for me, I go, Hey, I know that's, that's uncomfortable, but this is

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a really good revealing question.

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It may, it may hurt a little bit because you go, Oh, maybe I don't have a business.

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Maybe I have a job because if I don't show up to my job, I don't get paid.

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Right.

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Or maybe my leadership team.

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is really not that much of leadership and more management, right?

Speaker: 00:46:29

It's revealing, but it helps me unveil.

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Hey, well, now we know the areas to work on.

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How do we build something where you get to actually function?

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As an executive function as a, as a pastor function as a leader.

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So that's that first question.

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And I think the second question you actually touched on this earlier and

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I was like, again, disclaimer, we did not plan this, but, um, I asked

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the question, you know, if money, you're not allowed to use a number.

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What does success look like for you?

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And a limit, taking the number off the table, paralyzes people.

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They sit there and they're like, Oh, well, I was going to say a million dollars.

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I was going to say 500 people in a room.

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And I say, no, you can't numbers off the table.

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And so then, you know, with some probing, they start to get into the why.

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And the why oftentimes is I want to have financial freedom.

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I want to have time freedom.

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I want to see healthy marriages happen.

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Um, you know, I want to see the next generation raised up in

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our church or in our business.

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And I go, there we go.

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That's the thing.

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And now that you know that thing, why are you building the way that you're building?

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You tell me that you want to spend time with your family, but

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you're answering emails at 9 p.

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m.

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And so those two questions, Tim, they helped me unlock so much of

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that client profile because at the end of the day, it is fairly.

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Generic, right?

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As long as you've got three people and you do half a million in revenue,

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we're technically a good fit on paper.

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But how you respond to those two questions really gives me perspective into the kind

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of person that I'm talking to, the kind of outlook that they have, and really

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some perspective into where they're at on their journey, and truthfully,

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if I can be helpful to them or not.

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Yeah.

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Has it taken a while for you to evolve to those two questions that narrow it down?

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My guess is you probably worked with some people that wouldn't have

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answered those questions well early on.

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I, I have, I mean, we made it, I made it work.

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It was enjoyable, all that kind of stuff.

Speaker: 00:48:27

And, but, uh, how have you evolved into those questions?

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Yeah, you're absolutely right.

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I absolutely started working with people in the beginning that I, that

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looking back, I'm like, they did not fit this ideal client profile.

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And I think that that's come out of this place where, again, it's the struggle.

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I said, if I didn't, I didn't want to be a coach or a consultant, I definitely didn't

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choose to go down this road originally.

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but how I found myself here was realizing, oh, wait, I have

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done this over and over again.

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I've done this in ministry.

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I've done it starting the marketing company.

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I've done it with a real estate company.

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And so now I find myself not having to spout theory to people, but getting to

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tell people, Hey, this is what I've done.

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That's worked.

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Are you willing to consider it when it comes to systems, when it comes to

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strategy, when it comes to structure?

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And so again, to loop that back, it's allowed me.

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to now evolve into those questions because I look back and go, Oh man, I was solving

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the answer to these two my entire life.

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I still am.

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I'm still evolving.

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So

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Yeah.

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And Matthew, this is, people ask me this a lot.

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So I'm going to ask you this.

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People feel as if their situation is always unique.

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It's like, you know, I, I know you've never, this is, I'm going

Speaker: 00:49:43

to be a little bit snarky here.

Speaker: 00:49:45

I know you've never seen this before, but we've got some conflict on our leadership

Speaker: 00:49:50

team and Joe is not getting along with Sally and we can't figure out what's going

Speaker: 00:49:56

on, blah, blah, blah, things like that.

Speaker: 00:49:59

But.

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So, and, but yet, I have.

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Found that most things are fairly common, uh, or, and not everything fits, but,

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uh, what are some two, three, four, I don't know, you know, whatever it is,

Speaker: 00:50:17

what are some things that you see when you are invited in after you ask those

Speaker: 00:50:23

questions and you raise that hood up and you look down in that engine or the

Speaker: 00:50:27

organization, whatever metaphor you want to use, what are some things you see?

Speaker: 00:50:33

In almost every organization.

Speaker: 00:50:35

yeah.

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So just to shoot that snark back.

Speaker: 00:50:37

There is nothing new under the sun.

Speaker: 00:50:39

Okay.

Speaker: 00:50:40

There is nothing new.

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You're not a surprise to the Lord.

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It may be new information to me, but it's not a surprise to him.

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Um, but, but I think to answer that some of the biggest things that I've

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seen and come across that I'm, I'm constantly addressing both in my life

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and in for my clients and the people that I try and help, um, is again,

Speaker: 00:51:01

asking, I love to ask the question, Hey, Are you focused on growth?

Speaker: 00:51:04

Are you focused on health?

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Because healthy things grow.

Speaker: 00:51:07

And oftentimes when we focus on growth, it's at the expense of health, right?

Speaker: 00:51:11

Nobody looks at a plant and yells at the plant and says, Why aren't you growing?

Speaker: 00:51:15

No, we water it.

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We make sure it has great soil.

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We adjust it, put it in the right sunlight.

Speaker: 00:51:20

And, uh, and if we put it in the right conditions, then it will grow right.

Speaker: 00:51:24

And so I think that that's always a big one.

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Um, I like to use it in my file.

Speaker: 00:51:28

Often I tell people you can build business.

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And then build people.

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But I promise you, even with the advent of AI and all the

Speaker: 00:51:37

technological advances, if you build people, they will build business.

Speaker: 00:51:41

And again, can't just be a great model can't be a great slogan, because

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if you want to build something that holds up to my first question, you

Speaker: 00:51:49

probably want to invest in people.

Speaker: 00:51:51

And I'm so fortunate that I have a bunch of clients that are investing in people.

Speaker: 00:51:54

Leadership pipelines and developing people.

Speaker: 00:51:57

Um, and I, I think if I could rapid fire another one at you, I think the

Speaker: 00:52:02

two is one and one is none is gold.

Speaker: 00:52:05

Um, you know, you, you may have been the entrepreneur.

Speaker: 00:52:08

You may be the chief decision maker.

Speaker: 00:52:10

You may think you're the smartest guy in the room.

Speaker: 00:52:14

You don't want to be.

Speaker: 00:52:15

And the sooner that you can bring someone else on that journey, um,

Speaker: 00:52:19

and you can start to transfer, not just the tasks, but some of the

Speaker: 00:52:23

responsibility and the authority.

Speaker: 00:52:25

Because if you just hand off tasks again, you know, if something were to

Speaker: 00:52:28

happen, then that person isn't equipped or empowered to actually make decisions.

Speaker: 00:52:33

They're just equipped to check boxes on a to do list.

Speaker: 00:52:37

And so two is one and one is done.

Speaker: 00:52:39

Simply meaning, hey, if you have somebody that you're constantly

Speaker: 00:52:42

mentoring and raising up and pouring into and showing, then that's great.

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You always have one person, but if just you, there's actually nobody

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there in case anything happens.

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Yeah.

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The way I word that is that we're trying to purge that if it is to be, it's up to

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me mindset that probably got them to the success point that they're at, now it's

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hindering them to get to the next step.

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And, uh, and I've had it, you've probably had it.

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We, we all, you know, achievers a heavy dose of if it is to be, it's up to me.

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And, uh, and, and, but, you know, I love the automate delegate and

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eliminate system that you talk about because it, I think it's a way

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that people can check themselves.

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when you step into an organization, what is some of the first things you look for?

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To do, or to identify, or to find, or to snoop around, or whatever words

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you want to use, give somebody a like.

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If they're working with you, and Matthew shows up virtually or in person, what's

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one of the first things that you like to do when you step into an organization?

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Yeah.

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So, you know, assuming that we've, we've gone through the two

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questions, cause I always do that.

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You know, I walk people through my four Ps.

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And those are purpose, predictability, profitability and productivity.

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And the reason why I do that is I ask people, Hey, like what's important to you?

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And I mean, listen, Tim, you know, the answer to this, everybody

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always has profitability, right?

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Like we're in business, right?

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Even if it's a nonprofit or a church, like, Hey, we have to get the lights on.

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And I go, that's the least important of the four piece.

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So that's actually the last thing we're going to work on.

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Because if you find your purpose.

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And I'm not talking about use the owner.

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I'm talking about if I go ask all the team members, Hey guys, what's the

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reason we exist, and if they're not all aligned, which Spoiler, they never are.

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Um, if they're not all aligned and we're actually not operating from

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the same framework and finding that purpose that allows us, takes me

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to the next step where I go, Hey, how are we doing with productivity?

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Right.

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Are we actually operating at the levels that we want to be wasting

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time, wasting energy or people happy.

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That's again, the automate eliminate delegate.

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That's such a great framework to assess our productivity.

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Then that gets us into our predictability, right?

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And predictability.

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Is our ability to actually measure how well our systems are responding?

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Can we turn this on and off?

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Can someone take a vacation?

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Um, you know, predictability isn't just I run a marketing campaign and I get leads.

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And if we've built a business that is built on purpose, That

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is productive and predictable.

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It's only a matter of time before our profitability increases.

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And I like to explain profitability and I really challenge

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people on this as a product.

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Profitability is not my income minus my expenses equals my profitability.

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I just had a conversation with a newer client.

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She's profitable.

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Until I peeked under the hood and found that 60 percent of

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her clients lose her money.

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And I was like, it's a miracle you're profitable.

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But imagine the 15, 000 a month you're leaving on the table with those 60%.

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She had no idea.

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Right.

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And so profitability is far greater than what's left over.

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What's working for us?

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80 20 rule.

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How are we making our money?

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Right?

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What are the most leveraging tax for us for the nonprofit?

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They're putting all this effort into this donation that donated donation.

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Turns out they have a corporate match program where people can give 1000

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and their company will donate 1000.

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guys, we could just double all of our revenue in one shot.

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And they sat there and they were like, why aren't we putting

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all of our time into this?

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And I was like, Exactly.

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You, you just answered your own question.

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And so, yeah, those four P's, I find it helpful to lay it out.

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And again, just to gauge where people are at, because almost

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always people go profitability.

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Let's talk about that one.

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And I go, yeah, that's the one we're going to hit to last.

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And, uh, it's, it's only a matter of time before we get there.

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So when are you going to write a book on Matthew's four Ps?

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When's the book coming?

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I, I, I don't know, honestly, I've got a bit of imposter syndrome full

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of disclosure where some, some days I'm like, yeah, let's write it.

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And some days I'm like, I still don't know if I'm qualified to do this.

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So.

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Uh, I'm sure it's, I'm sure at some point I'll get on the horse because, uh,

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you know, if I can help people through that writing medium, I'm, I'm down.

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But yeah, it's a journey.

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Sure.

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Hey Matthew, give me, um, that was sort of a success story you just gave, but

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just something off the top of your head, a success story with the client that is

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just going to be helpful to the listener that goes, Ooh, I like the sound of that.

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What's, what's something that jumps to your head when I ask for a success story?

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Silence.

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coaching side when I went down this road a few years ago, um, in the health and

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fitness space, she's incredible, had been an entrepreneur for a decade plus,

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and it achieved some measure of success.

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The hard part is that the entire thing was built on her.

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And she had never taken a vacation.

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I'm talking, she had not gone a full week away from the business.

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And this business was run 360 out of 365 every year.

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And so I asked her, I said, well, why haven't you taken one?

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It's, it's really important that you get out.

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You say that time is so important to you and your family and your friendships.

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And she goes, well, I'm scared.

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I'm scared of what will happen if I leave.

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And so, you know, obviously we talked through her fears and, you

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know, we really boiled it down to.

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She was afraid because she hadn't transferred enough responsibility

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over to her team, just tasks.

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So she was afraid that when she left, if the place burned down, They were done.

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And, uh, the beautiful thing about going on the journey, both with both

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her and her operations manager again, that coaching and the consulting is that

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she literally within a few months was able to take her first first vacation.

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We had multiple check ins during her vacation, where I was like, hey, just

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so you know, places and burned out.

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You're still fine.

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And she came back and it was so cool because her team not only stepped

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up, they, for the first time, got to realize what they were capable of.

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Right?

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Because.

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Even though she's an incredible owner, she didn't realize that

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she was capping their leadership.

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She was always there to save them, always there to rescue them.

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And now we had this beautiful thing where everybody's sitting

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here realizing the possibilities.

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And that's when we really got to go to work.

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And here we are, uh, you know, almost two years into that journey.

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And I have to tell her to stop taking vacations.

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It's, it's gone a little too far now.

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I need to be like, hey, dial it back.

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But it's beautiful.

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And, you know, she's the one I alluded to earlier.

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She's building a leadership pipeline.

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You know, they used to hire.

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External managers, and it was creating this chasm with the employees

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that she wasn't even aware of.

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Now their last three management promotions have all been internal

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and people are excited that they're showing ownership because they're

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seeing that they can potentially live out their dreams within her company.

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And she's operating at a level that she always wanted was

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That's a high level leader.

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I love it.

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I love it when someone moves from that task person to I

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believe a leader really is.

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And, uh, man, that's awesome that you're leading and guiding people.

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Into that, uh, that area.

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Hey, Matthew, if someone wants to connect with you, get more information, maybe have

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you ask them those questions you mentioned earlier, where can people find you?

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Yeah.

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I love connecting with people.

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You can look me up on LinkedIn, Matthew Sanjari, S A N J A R I, or you can

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go to my website, consultingbyprime.

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com.

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That's consultingbyprime.

Speaker: 01:00:34

com.

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I'd love to connect with you.

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Awesome.

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We are seek, go create Matthew.

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Those three words to allow you to choose one of those as my final question.

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Seek, go or create and why?

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Yeah.

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Uh, I'm going to say, uh, and both selfishly and unselfishly,

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I'm going to say seek.

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Um, and when I think of seek, I think, man, go seek out someone

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who knows what you don't know.

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Right?

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The old adage is you don't know what you don't know.

Speaker: 01:01:04

And I think that that's so true.

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Um, I think surrounding myself personally with people who are so

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much better than me, smarter than me, wiser than me in so many different

Speaker: 01:01:16

areas, we all get to play a part.

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but has been so good for me because it doesn't matter how smart I think

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I am or how much success I get.

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There's just someone out there who's going to challenge my perspective and allow

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me to view things in a different way.

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And so, you know, whether that's a coach, whether that's a consultant,

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whether that's a pastor, you know, surround yourself with people, seek

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that out and try and get people that will challenge your perspective

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and help cover your blind spots.

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Excellent.

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Love it.

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Matthew, thanks for joining us here.

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This has been great conversation.

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You know, you, like you said, it may look as if we were scripted,

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but we were just sinking, man.

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It was just like we were, we were on the same page sending out the vibes

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here over the, uh, over the waves, man.

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I appreciate you being here.

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If you feel that Matthew said something that resonated with you, or you want to

Speaker: 01:02:07

connect, I encourage you to reach out.

Speaker: 01:02:09

I mean, both of us are coaches, but listen, you need to find

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someone that you connect with.

Speaker: 01:02:15

And it may not be me.

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It might be Matthew.

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And I think he would probably say the same thing.

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It's like, find someone seek as though, as he used that word, seek someone

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that can help lead and guide you.

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And I'm convinced that Matthew's a guy that can lead a bunch

Speaker: 01:02:29

of you that are listening in.

Speaker: 01:02:30

So reach out to him.

Speaker: 01:02:31

We have new episodes here at Seek Go Create.

Speaker: 01:02:34

Every Monday, we're on YouTube.

Speaker: 01:02:36

We're on all the platforms and I want to make a quick shout out.

Speaker: 01:02:39

Thank you so much to the people that have been supporting us financially.

Speaker: 01:02:44

We put this link up seek, go create.

Speaker: 01:02:46

com forward slash support.

Speaker: 01:02:48

I get tips that keep showing up 50, 75.

Speaker: 01:02:52

Just people saying, we support you.

Speaker: 01:02:54

Thank you.

Speaker: 01:02:55

Thank you for that.

Speaker: 01:02:56

I appreciate it.

Speaker: 01:02:56

Keep doing it.

Speaker: 01:02:57

I'll accept it and receive it So, I appreciate you listening

Speaker: 01:03:02

in until next time continue being all that you were created to be