AI, Economic Shifts, and Career Planning with Joanie Bily

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Companies would start investing again and hiring again.

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So I do think the next few months are going to be really interesting

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to see what the Federal Reserve does, what the election will do.

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But right now the job market is pretty soft and becoming more challenging

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for people that are looking for work

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Um, uh,

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How can you turn your passions into a fulfilling career?

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us on today's episode of seek, go create the leadership journey where we sit

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down with Joanne Biley, the Duchess of labor, an acclaimed employment

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expert, author, and motivational speaker offers her expertise in

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career advancement through her book, dive in deep and her transformative

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deep process design experience.

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Execute and persevere.

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As a regular commentator on networks like Fox Business and a seasoned

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keynote speaker, Joni guides individuals on navigating and

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thriving in the dynamic job market.

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Joni, welcome.

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Thanks for having me, Tim.

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Great to talk with you here.

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I was just kind of chuckling at that last statement there, dynamic.

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Job market.

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That's kind of an understatement.

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We'll talk about that in just a little while.

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But, before we get too much further, I love the intro.

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Great thing.

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I love this title Duchess of labor.

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I'm going to ask you about that later, but if you're just out and about and

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you bump into somebody and they ask you what you do, what's your usual answer?

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Well, the quick answer is I connect great people with great jobs.

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And I think that's kind of a simple way to Describe what I do, but I've

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been in the employment staffing and recruiting industry, going on 30 years.

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It's hard to believe.

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I fell into this career, but I just absolutely love this

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industry and this business.

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because it's all about connecting people with either their first

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job or their next job or really helping them, on their career path

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of what do they want to do next.

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And I also get the benefit of working with, Our customers and clients who

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are looking for talent, and really need solutions when they're thinking

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about hiring their workforce, structuring their workforce.

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So, that's kind of the gist of what I do.

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And I've just been fortunate to have, Such a wonderful career in this industry.

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it's led me to a lot of things that I never expected I would do but

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it's been very rewarding for me.

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Do you think that most people out there understand when someone says they're in

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the employment industry, do they get that?

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Does it make sense?

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Does it click for people?

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No, I don't think they understand what that means because I can tell you my

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family, you know, when I first started at this and said, you know, I'm in the

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staffing industry, they really didn't know like, okay, well, what does that mean?

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So, that's why I like to say I connect great people with great jobs or

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great companies with great talent.

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it's all about those connections and, you know, I have found a lot of fulfillment,

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in this industry because of that.

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To your point, a lot of people don't know what that really means.

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Well, maybe after we go through a few things here, it might be

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clearer to people, but you've used the word multiple time connections,

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or I'll use the word connector.

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If we look at personality profiles, strength finders, things like

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that, connector a big strength.

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that something that you mentioned you fell into this industry, but

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was it something that pulled you?

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But were you a connector all along?

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Have you always been a connector?

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Yeah, you know, I guess my personality, has always been, someone that enjoys

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meeting new people, having conversations.

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I also just have this drive in me to want to help.

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Individuals.

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And so though I fell into this industry, I was going to college

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for a social work career, studying health and human services.

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my mother actually, was a nurse and then a therapist.

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And I kind of was following in her footsteps a little bit in the sense

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that I wanted to help other people.

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What was interesting is I never thought I'd end up in business.

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And I never knew how much I would love.

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Business and the economy and just the whole economics, right?

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Of running a business.

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So I really feel very fortunate that I had an opportunity, you know, right

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out of college to take a job that was called an employment counselor.

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And so I thought it was going to be more of a counseling job, but truly

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what it was, was a recruiting role where I would interview and recruit people.

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And then.

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I would place them in jobs and it just has turned into, a 30 year career for me of,

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learning a tremendous amount right about business and, Pricing and gross margins

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and operating expenses and how to build, a successful business and drive profit.

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And I've loved all aspects of it.

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I have enjoyed every aspect of it.

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but ultimately it still comes down to.

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I think it was always in me that I wanted to help people and that's

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what it really stemmed from.

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So it's interesting and I think it's quite a gift when we are

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attempting to, we'll talk about this when we get into the, formula

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I think that you have for your book.

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It's so interesting that we will attempt to, at a young age, say that I

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am going to be a blank social worker.

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Yeah

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Engineer was mine, by the way.

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Actually, mine was teacher and a coach.

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And I, I say this on almost every episode, but then I found out one day

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in junior and high school, how much money my parents made as teachers.

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I'm like going, Ooh, I don't like that very much.

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I think I need to do something else.

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So engineer, But I don't think I was really wired to be an engineer

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and it just blessed me to later find out I could actually coach and do

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things, but still have that foundation

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yeah,

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were you going back to what we mentioned earlier, where people were kind of.

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to use the strong word of ignorant or not knowledgeable about the staffing industry.

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Would you have been in that category when you stepped into it?

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Would you have been one that if someone says, by the way, you seem to be wired

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for staffing or, you know, temporary service or helping someone find their

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ideal job or helping companies, you have been going, you talking about?

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I didn't have any wisdom to be perfectly frank with you.

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I really didn't know much about the industry or the model, it

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was something that was pretty foreign to me, my, growing up.

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I think I probably had the mindset of, okay, I could be a nurse or be a

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lawyer or, a teacher, you know, like those were professions that I could

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understand and at least relate to or think, is this something I'd want to

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consider being, but I never said, oh, I want to be a recruiter or I want to be.

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Someone that works in the staffing industry, because I didn't know about it.

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And I think a lot of people don't know about the industry and the wonderful

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work, that this industry does and really makes a difference in people's lives.

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So, I did not have the wisdom, about it and I am blessed that I kind of did

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fall into it and ended up on this path.

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Okay, I think it's going to be fun later when we start talking about

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how people's careers develop and how you can craft and do your own and

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we've both now said, Hmm, you know, we sort of know how ours came to be.

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do you find that people that go into this?

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Industry and our buddy Mike Bayer introduced us and he and I've talked

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a little bit about this industry and I skirted it some years ago when he and

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I were doing some projects together.

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Do you find that people go into it with that?

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We'll call it a heart to help others like you seem to be on that path.

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Or are they more, because I do know there's financial benefit

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and reward greatly for people that are in this industry also, and I'm

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not, I'm not anti either one of those, but what is your experience?

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Do you see people kind of more one way than the other that go into the

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specific industry that you're in?

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Yeah, no, that's a great question.

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I would say that this industry, I think people fall in love with it.

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Once they get into it, they might enter it thinking, Oh, this could be

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a good financial opportunity for me.

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and in all fairness, even when I think back to being right out of college.

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You know, I looked at, okay, a counselor job versus the employment

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counselor, which was the recruiter role, the recruiter role was going

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to pay me a little bit more, right?

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And so I'm newly out, you know, have an apartment, a car, you know,

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off of mom and dad's payrolls.

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So I took the job that paid more and, I think maybe people get into

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it, you know, thinking that this could be financially rewarding.

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but I think what keeps people in it, is not only the ability to

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earn a good income, but you truly fall in love with the industry.

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It, if it pulls on your heart, you know, you do have to have that, I think, passion

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for it and find purpose in your work.

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it definitely has kept me like I, I can't imagine doing something else,

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or leaving the industry other than maybe real estate because I've always

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loved real estate and I've, I've had fun with that, over the years and

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I've invested in a lot of properties, kind of, that's been a, a side.

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Interest of mine, but, I can't imagine truly ever doing anything

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else full time than helping people.

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And I've even volunteered in our industry, which led me to becoming a board member

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of the American Staffing Association.

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Which really is the largest association for the industry.

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and I have the honor this year of being the chair of the board for

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the American Staffing Association.

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So again, kind of comes back to, I would have never imagined that I would have, you

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know, been on a board of directors or then been the chairperson of the board, when I

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started out, you know, in this industry to think that that's the role I'm in today.

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And it's just been So rewarding.

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And I feel like it's, it's given back to me more than I've ever could give to it.

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So somewhere along the way, you were able to obtain or you inherited or

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whatever the title Duchess of Labor, I think I know where it came from.

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However, I just love for you to tell me the Duchess of Labor.

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How did that come to be?

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yeah, it is kind of a funny story.

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so one of the things that I started doing, gosh, about maybe 15 years

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ago, was I started speaking about the employment market and talking about labor

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trends and workforce data, you know, what's happening with the job market.

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with unemployment, with wages.

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And again, kind of coming back, this conversation is kind of fun

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because it takes me down memory lane.

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But you know, here I was someone that went to school for social work,

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wasn't taking the business classes or the, you know, analysis classes,

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but I really dove into understanding the data and analyzing the data.

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And then I started speaking about the data and what was

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happening with the job market.

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And that led to me ultimately, being asked to be on television on the

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national news and, had the chance to be on Fox News, Fox Business, CNN.

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I did, you know, just different different networks where I would come,

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come on and talk about the job market.

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So I was known as a labor market expert.

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Well, one night at home, my daughter, we were getting ready

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for dinner and she was studying.

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History at the time, and she was learning at all about the Knights of Labor and

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really the movement that they had in the United States, for putting, you

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know, labor laws in place to really protect workers to protect child workers

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to get more women in the workforce.

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And she was, and I had never really heard of it.

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I'm like the Knights of Labor.

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And so she said to me, yeah, mom, it's like, you know, like you,

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you're the Duchess of Labor, you know, you're doing everything from

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volunteering with the American Staffing Association, putting people to work.

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And she said the Knights of Labor, you know, did this

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work like over 100 years ago.

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So my daughter actually gave me the title.

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Duchess of Labor.

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All right, good.

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And so it's, unofficial, sort of,

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It's definitely unofficial, but hey, when your daughter gives you a title

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like that, I said, I'm taking that.

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So we had some fun with that and, you know, have used it through social

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media and, just kind of took off.

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All right, so one more, and it might be a tough question, more about Joni.

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And then I want to go macro.

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And then I want us to, as we finish up, allow plenty of time to do micro and

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talk about design, experience, execute, and persevere for the individual.

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But, What is the thing that you really enjoy?

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The most out of all of that because when I see someone with a lot of thing out

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So one of the questions that comes to my mind is like what gives them the most

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energy and joy of all of those things That that they do so i'm putting that

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on you and kind of forcing you to say What's the one thing that you really

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really really dig the most right now?

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Well, it's easy to answer personally, because the thing that comes to mind

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first is I'm a mom to two great kids that I just adore, and that's been

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the greatest joy, truly, in my life and they're both in college now.

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So it's also fun to help them.

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With their, college experience, what they're studying, getting internships, and

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helping them get on the right career path.

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so that definitely is an easy thing to answer.

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from a professional standpoint, if I think about, all the things that I've.

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Accomplished, what has meant the most or probably been the most rewarding,

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has really been just being recognized, for giving back, to communities for

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helping people with careers, having someone come to me and say, you

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really made a difference in my life.

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you coached me or you gave me great advice.

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it would all boil down to that one thing that I was able to help someone and,

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be recognized for that has meant a lot.

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I like that.

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A couple of episodes ago, we had someone that talked, they use the

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word significance a bit, and then we, it kind of tailed off into impact.

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And I would sort of, I wouldn't have guessed it, but I would have sort of

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expect that from someone who started off life, considering being a social

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worker that has done all of these things.

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you're handed microphones, you're behind cameras and things like that,

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but it's really, it's still boils down to, you want to make that impact.

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Yeah, you want to make the impact.

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You know, recently I gave a speech as a keynote and I was in

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front of, I would say maybe about 1500 people, in the auditorium.

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And I kind of felt like, it wasn't my best speech.

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It was good, but I was kind of beating myself up about it after, like, gosh,

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I wish I delivered it a little bit stronger, you know, didn't come across

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exactly the way I had envisioned it.

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And, but anyway, you know, people are always nice.

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Oh, you did a great job.

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It was great.

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I go to the airport.

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I get on the train, you know, that takes you in between the terminals

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and there's a gentleman that's kind of standing a few people away.

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And he said, excuse me.

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He said, Joni, I heard you speak at the conference today.

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And he said, I just want to let you know that your message

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really resonated with me.

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And it was something that I needed to hear.

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And I have been holding back from making a decision and listening to you today.

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Just reassured me that this is what I need to do.

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And it completely changed, how I felt about that speech, even was like, I

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just thought I could have done better.

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And then here I had someone and I was so like taken back and I just

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said, Oh, that means the world to me.

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And it comes back to your point, Tim.

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It was that if you can have an impact, and help someone.

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that's, you know, the greatest gift, you know, to me as well is just

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that I made a difference, right?

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for someone so, that I really do believe in making an impact.

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And I think that's a key to being successful in life.

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if you feel like you're making an impact, You have purpose in your work.

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You will be successful.

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Yeah.

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to me, I've, I think I'm sort of wired a little bit.

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It's the reason why I like to coach so much because more like instant feedback.

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when spoken, even with the podcast and things like that, sometimes it's

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either delayed the feedback that you get from like the guy that you bumped

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into on the train or you never get it.

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And so.

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I've, I've kind of had with my soul had to just get to this place where I believe

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that I'm doing what God wants me to do, and I need to just put forth the effort,

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persevere and execute like we're going to talk about here in just a moment.

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And not be concerned about the results.

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That's a tough one for me because I like to look at the numbers I like

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to see things I like to know if if we do a podcast episode What does it

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lead to and all that but some of that we just you never know So I see I I

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guess I look at you and I go Here's someone who's spreading a wide net.

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She's got a lot of things and a lot of it.

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You probably never hear it,

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Yeah.

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It's a really good point.

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And I think accepting that is, important for all of us because

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sometimes We won't hear all of it.

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Like, it's great, that I was able to, write a book and I've had

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many people reach out to me and say, this message really resonated

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with me and thank you so much.

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I got so much from it, but you're right.

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Not everyone's going to do that.

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You don't know everyone you touch, but you hope that you do make an

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impact and just have to accept that.

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like you said, doing God's work and hopefully, on the right path to help

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other people live their best life, and achieve greater success because of that.

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I want us to go from what we were talking about, your

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background and all, which I love.

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That's the reason I like doing these type interviews because I like connecting and

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talking to people a little more, but I also love talking about the big picture.

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And if I've got someone with the experience and background in the labor

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staffing jobs market, someone who's on news shows and all, I would like to.

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educate myself and others with what we need to know, what's going on, what

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are some things we need to look for.

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so let's do this first.

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Let's go big picture.

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And I know you look at a lot of things.

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I don't usually like to timestamp these episodes, but unfortunately

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I think we may need to.

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We are recording this in early August 2024.

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in the United States, there's an election almost.

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Three months out, which impacts a lot of this kind of stuff.

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And so if I were to ask you, are we at now with the labor market,

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is that too broad a question?

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Can you respond to that?

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What would you say if I just said, just tell me what you're

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thinking and where we're at.

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Well, you know, it's interesting.

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You mentioned before when we started the podcast, I think we called it a

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dynamic labor market and unfortunately it's not a dynamic labor market today.

Speaker: 00:21:41

So it would be static?

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it's pretty static.

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it has been declining.

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slowly, but I would say over the last two years, there has been much

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softness in the overall labor market.

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You know, after the pandemic, we certainly rebounded and the labor

Speaker: 00:22:00

market came back very strong.

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The economy came back very strong.

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There were more jobs being added.

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there were more jobs than there were available people

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that really drove wages up.

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we started to see people really come back into the workforce and all sectors

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across the board, from services, To manufacturing, construction, job growth

Speaker: 00:22:24

was happening really in every sector.

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And of course, healthcare was probably the strongest sector.

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fast forward to today.

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what we've been seeing is that the job growth is really coming from three

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main sectors in the United States.

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We're seeing job growth continue in healthcare.

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leisure and hospitality.

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So people are still out there traveling and spending money, which we see in

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the consumer spending numbers as well.

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And then we've seen the government sector add jobs.

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So those have been the three sectors that have added jobs.

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So the headline number for the overall job market still looks good.

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We're seeing, Oh, 200, 000 jobs created 300, 000 jobs created.

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But unfortunately, if you dig into the data and this is where I get my

Speaker: 00:23:16

Duchess of labor, hat on, but a little bit of a data geek and you start, you

Speaker: 00:23:21

know, kind of peeling back all these numbers, What's happening is there are

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many sectors that are not adding jobs.

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They're actually declining.

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Manufacturing has been very hard hit over the last year.

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Um, the industry that I work in, the temporary staffing industry, has

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actually been losing jobs for two years.

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And so what that means is employers are tightening their purse strings and

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they're saying we need to cut back.

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And one of the first things that they will cut back on when things get tough is they

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will let their temporary workers go first.

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and so we've been seeing this kind of trickle along and it really hasn't been

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a great job market for the past year.

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And we're now seeing unemployment, you know, start to climb.

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So we're up to 4.

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3 percent unemployment.

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That was just released for the first Friday in August.

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We just got that data point out and there's some concerns

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around these numbers.

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Now, this could mean that, you know, it could mean, are we going into a recession?

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it could mean that maybe the Federal Reserve will look at the labor

Speaker: 00:24:39

market and say, you know what, we're not seeing as much movement

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in wages and unemployment is rising.

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We really need to lower interest rates.

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and that could quickly turn things around because then.

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Companies would start investing again and hiring again.

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So I do think the next few months are going to be really interesting

Speaker: 00:24:57

to see what the Federal Reserve does, what the election will do.

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But right now the job market is pretty soft and becoming more challenging

Speaker: 00:25:09

for people that are looking for work.

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Very good.

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there's a few questions I have that might border on the cynical.

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So I'm just going to go ahead and telegraph that right now.

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My first one would be The methodology for coming up with the numbers.

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do you in the role you're in have confidence numbers that are created

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or are they're just our numbers and we have to go with them and or maybe even

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give me a range on how confident there are times that I am not, this is going

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to kind of show my political hand.

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So I'm going to be careful here.

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there are times I don't trust that come from the government.

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I'm not saying that they're doing it maliciously.

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Sometimes they might be, but, so what are your thoughts when

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you look at these numbers?

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Are you like so confident when you get these reports

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Yeah.

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or,

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it's, I'm glad you're asking me that because, I'm going to be brutally

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honest and say I'm not confident in these numbers and every month the

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government revises the numbers that go back for the last two months and

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they're always adjusting them downward.

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So I do question it.

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It amazes me that when the numbers come out, billions of dollars are

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probably traded on Wall Street and based on what these numbers say, knowing

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that next month they're going to get revised anyway, either up or down.

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But lately, they're always revised down.

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So I don't have a tremendous amount of confidence in those numbers.

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However, what I do trust is I'm on the front lines of employment.

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And I would tell you, I actually think it's worse.

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Then what the numbers are reporting.

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I think the economy has been more challenging for the last two years,

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but it hasn't always showed up in the employment data and that

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could be for a number of reasons.

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These challenges have existed through, you know, whether you have a Republican

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in office or a Democrat in office, it's the same challenges with the data.

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So I do think there's questions around that.

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Very good.

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that was a healthy, response.

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And I think it was, I'm glad I asked that question.

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followup that is, again, maybe my second cynical question is that.

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Depending on who's in charge in Washington, they will take credit be

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faulted for some of these numbers that we've already said that we may not

Speaker: 00:27:59

exactly be extremely confident in.

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And with 30 years in the industry, this is not Pointing to one, unfortunately,

Speaker: 00:28:09

in the United States for those listening overseas, we only have two parties here.

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I'm getting to the place where I do think there's some policies and things

Speaker: 00:28:19

like that that impact, but I'm not sure that there's that much control

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with the person that's sitting in the White House or things like that.

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And maybe, maybe the question is.

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What are some things that do impact at that level?

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Maybe some big sweeping policies or tax policies or things like that.

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What are, what's the answer, Joni?

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what should we be doing right now?

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I wish that, yeah,

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no, I

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take that sort of weird comment that I made and do something

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with it to make it sound better.

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know where you're going is a great question.

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And I think We certainly need to figure that out, right?

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To grow our overall economy and our job market.

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I can tell you from my last 30 years where I've seen the most

Speaker: 00:29:08

growth has been a few things.

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One is tax credits.

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If the government is giving employers payroll tax credits, anything to kind

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of stimulate job growth, It usually leads to some pretty big growth.

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employers are incentivized to hire, and keep people on their payrolls.

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So, I will tell you, that does work.

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it does boost the economy.

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Employers will invest in their businesses.

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and having investments, too, for small business to accelerate some of

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that can really make a difference.

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So I do believe that those policies work.

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in addition, I will say, there are other things that do create job growth.

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Some of them good, some of them bad.

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even the pandemic, which had a negative impact right away.

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I think a lot of the policies that were put in place coming out of that.

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led to a boom in the job market, and we started to really add a tremendous

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amount of jobs and kind of get the U.

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S.

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Back up and running better, than it was before.

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so it can almost be like a crisis or, a war.

Speaker: 00:30:27

there are certain things that, do stimulate that can be significant,

Speaker: 00:30:33

milestones, but overall tax credits and policies to employers, can be a big boost.

Speaker: 00:30:42

Very good.

Speaker: 00:30:43

All right.

Speaker: 00:30:43

So let's talk briefly about technology and the one that pops into my head is AI

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and AI seems to be The current technology hot button, we've had other things in

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the past and with the experience that both of us have, we can go back and go.

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Yeah, we've heard this before.

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Yeah, we've heard this before, but maybe just technology in general or

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specifically a I, what are you seeing?

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What are you thinking?

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Is it an exciting thing?

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Is it a concern?

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what says Joni?

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Well, I will say that overall AI is going to help the majority

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of people do their jobs better.

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And I do think it's going to drive productivity and

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efficiencies for business.

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it will eliminate some jobs.

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There's no doubt about it and it will impact.

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Certain industries more than others.

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you know, we see what's happening even with, writing and what's

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happened in the media industry.

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They don't need as many writers, and editors, and that that's been

Speaker: 00:31:56

kind of an evolution, but there's been a big impact to, the media

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industry, over the course of time.

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And an AI is a big driver in that.

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but it definitely, I mean, it's helping doctors and nurses do their jobs better.

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It's changing, you know, the ways people work in call centers

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and assisting, you know, like a call assist makes a difference.

Speaker: 00:32:19

So it will eliminate some of those lower level jobs.

Speaker: 00:32:24

And, it'll change, right?

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Even engineering.

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We were talking about you and your engineering background, like it will

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have impacts certainly on the I.

Speaker: 00:32:34

T.

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industry and engineering industry, where we can leverage A.

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I.

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to really do a lot of the work, but you're still going to need people to oversee it

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and really make sure, that it's correct.

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And that's very important.

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If you just look at.

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what happened with, the I.

Speaker: 00:32:52

T.

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Global outage that we just experienced a few weeks ago.

Speaker: 00:32:57

you know, someone kind of dropped the ball there and we can't let that happen.

Speaker: 00:33:04

Well, because some people are sitting here thinking this is an old reference

Speaker: 00:33:08

that, you know, Skynet, you know, from the Terminators taking over and we'll now

Speaker: 00:33:12

I don't, I don't quite see that just out.

Speaker: 00:33:14

Just an example of a small little project.

Speaker: 00:33:16

We've got here.

Speaker: 00:33:17

This product, this podcast I had a little over a year ago to I'm just three

Speaker: 00:33:23

contractors that were working and helping.

Speaker: 00:33:27

And now I've got one person that helps a little bit.

Speaker: 00:33:31

then everything else is, I mean, a lot of the heavy lifting with editing

Speaker: 00:33:37

and, you know, transcripts, all of those things are being done with.

Speaker: 00:33:43

I like to call it machine learning.

Speaker: 00:33:44

AI is a little bit of a misnomer it's not technically AI yet.

Speaker: 00:33:49

I don't think but Anyway, just last big picture question What is super what is

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something that you're looking out over the horizon and you are very excited about?

Speaker: 00:33:59

And then what a secondary and you might have already addressed some of these What

Speaker: 00:34:02

are you concerned about and you could flip the order if you want to end with

Speaker: 00:34:06

a more positive So what is joni super excited about and what concerns are

Speaker: 00:34:10

about the whole the current labor market?

Speaker: 00:34:12

Well, when I look at kind of the horizon, I will say the one thing I really want

Speaker: 00:34:18

to get us past, not that you ever want to fast forward time because you need

Speaker: 00:34:23

to enjoy being in that present moment.

Speaker: 00:34:25

But I'm ready to get the election over with, regardless of who's in office.

Speaker: 00:34:31

the news cycle is very difficult to listen to.

Speaker: 00:34:35

I think there's just a lot of negativity right coming back on both sides.

Speaker: 00:34:39

So as I look at the horizon, I'm going to be very excited that we get beyond that.

Speaker: 00:34:45

And I also think that that will be good for the job market either way, because

Speaker: 00:34:50

whoever's in office needs to make this, you know, the economy and inflation.

Speaker: 00:34:55

A top priority, you know, that that needs to be fixed.

Speaker: 00:34:59

You see in any poll out there, that's the number one issue for

Speaker: 00:35:03

Americans is dealing with inflation.

Speaker: 00:35:05

And we see it with the job market where wages have gone

Speaker: 00:35:08

up over the last few years.

Speaker: 00:35:10

but they're starting to cap out.

Speaker: 00:35:12

Companies can't afford, to increase wages anymore.

Speaker: 00:35:15

So, I think we need to kind of get through that, through that cycle.

Speaker: 00:35:20

as I look at, what I'm most excited about is it will be interesting to see what

Speaker: 00:35:27

machine learning, AI, robotics, what that will do for the overall outcome.

Speaker: 00:35:35

And I'm also excited that we see A tremendous amount of construction

Speaker: 00:35:43

and manufacturing plants throughout the United States that is happening.

Speaker: 00:35:49

And so I do believe there is going to be a renaissance, almost of

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manufacturing coming back to the U.

Speaker: 00:35:56

S.

Speaker: 00:35:57

And that will have a very big positive impact in the overall labor market.

Speaker: 00:36:03

You know, for America, but that is taking some time because they're just

Speaker: 00:36:07

being built now, but we'll start to see that in 2025 and 26 and beyond.

Speaker: 00:36:14

I have some clients that I work with.

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I work with leadership teams of organizations and with

Speaker: 00:36:20

them on strategy and things.

Speaker: 00:36:21

And I have clients are there around the construction industry.

Speaker: 00:36:27

I'll say it that way.

Speaker: 00:36:28

And it was warehouses for a while.

Speaker: 00:36:32

Now it's data centers that are going up everywhere.

Speaker: 00:36:38

I do think there'll be some employment around the data centers that that also

Speaker: 00:36:41

tells us a little bit about some trends.

Speaker: 00:36:43

We just talked about that's important.

Speaker: 00:36:46

all right, another hard pivot here.

Speaker: 00:36:48

We were, you know, we've been flying at 40 50, 000 feet and I'm going to bring

Speaker: 00:36:53

us down ground level and I want to read.

Speaker: 00:36:58

The tagline for your book that is dive in deep we're going to go through

Speaker: 00:37:05

at least a few of the four items related to deep in just a moment, it's

Speaker: 00:37:09

strategies to advance your career, find balance and live your best life.

Speaker: 00:37:18

That's That's what everybody wants, right?

Speaker: 00:37:23

I hope so, right?

Speaker: 00:37:26

We all want to live our best life and we, sometimes have to get out of our

Speaker: 00:37:30

own way in order to do that, but just as we started talking about the podcast,

Speaker: 00:37:37

the reason I really wrote the book was to try and help provide guidance

Speaker: 00:37:44

and advice to people that might be struggling whether it's in their career

Speaker: 00:37:49

or Are they in the right career or do they want to make a pivot, into a

Speaker: 00:37:54

different industry or a different role?

Speaker: 00:37:56

and then how do you do that?

Speaker: 00:37:58

which is a, you know, I think sometimes a bit overwhelming, but

Speaker: 00:38:02

could be holding somebody back.

Speaker: 00:38:04

You know, if they don't make that move, if they're not doing

Speaker: 00:38:06

the work that they really love, are they living their best life?

Speaker: 00:38:11

Probably not.

Speaker: 00:38:12

So that's really what the book is about and I broke up the

Speaker: 00:38:17

book into the four strategies.

Speaker: 00:38:20

the deep process, you know, is all about how do you design kind

Speaker: 00:38:26

of the right career for you?

Speaker: 00:38:28

and really think about what are your interests?

Speaker: 00:38:30

What are your goals?

Speaker: 00:38:32

You know, what are you good at?

Speaker: 00:38:34

How do you find purpose in your work?

Speaker: 00:38:36

How do you play to your strengths, the gifts, you know, that God has given you?

Speaker: 00:38:41

And so that's really all in that design phase.

Speaker: 00:38:44

And then when you start to figure that out, of course,

Speaker: 00:38:47

you need to gain experience.

Speaker: 00:38:49

In that field and in that industry to help, you know, move

Speaker: 00:38:53

yourself forward and advance.

Speaker: 00:38:56

and I talk about moving up, you know, it's whether it's moving up

Speaker: 00:39:00

the corporate ladder, moving up spiritually, you know, it doesn't

Speaker: 00:39:04

always have to be a promotion, right?

Speaker: 00:39:06

But that you're really.

Speaker: 00:39:08

Finding fulfillment and success from your work and you gain that experience.

Speaker: 00:39:12

and then it's about executing, which is putting in the hard work to

Speaker: 00:39:16

make it happen, following through.

Speaker: 00:39:18

So lots of tips around that.

Speaker: 00:39:21

and then we all know there's going to be.

Speaker: 00:39:23

roadblocks.

Speaker: 00:39:24

You know, the name of the book is dive in deep.

Speaker: 00:39:26

I think of diving in a pool.

Speaker: 00:39:28

and sometimes that can be a little scary, right?

Speaker: 00:39:31

If you're going off a big diving board or diving, into a new pool

Speaker: 00:39:35

of work or trying something new.

Speaker: 00:39:37

and there's going to be times where you may make a belly flop in life.

Speaker: 00:39:42

and it might hurt and some might sting more than others.

Speaker: 00:39:46

But you're going to be okay.

Speaker: 00:39:48

There's water in the pool and you can get coaching and advice and refine your

Speaker: 00:39:52

technique and continue to keep diving in and that's all about perseverance, right

Speaker: 00:39:58

not giving up going after your dreams and ambitions so that you can make it

Speaker: 00:40:03

happen and Really just try to encourage everyone to pursue their dreams And go

Speaker: 00:40:10

after what they really want to do in life.

Speaker: 00:40:13

and don't hold back.

Speaker: 00:40:14

Don't have regrets.

Speaker: 00:40:15

So that, that was really the premise of the book and kind

Speaker: 00:40:19

of how the book's designed.

Speaker: 00:40:20

it was really a fun project for me to do.

Speaker: 00:40:25

So I love all that we're going to cover and I actually might ask you to go a

Speaker: 00:40:29

little bit deeper into one of those items there, but The question i've had you say

Speaker: 00:40:35

you mentioned you've got two children.

Speaker: 00:40:36

I don't know if girls boys, whatever in college

Speaker: 00:40:40

Yeah.

Speaker: 00:40:40

and we've got our children a little bit older than that they're kind of

Speaker: 00:40:43

out and getting started and one of the things that My wife and I will often

Speaker: 00:40:47

say Is that we consider ourselves decently bright, knowledgeable

Speaker: 00:40:52

stuff, we're not really sure.

Speaker: 00:40:57

What to tell our children as far as entering the job market work business,

Speaker: 00:41:03

whatever So and you don't have to get personal here, but i'm just curious

Speaker: 00:41:09

What are you telling your children right now that are in college?

Speaker: 00:41:13

I mean, did you say here's a book you need to read it read this book and then come

Speaker: 00:41:16

back to me I'll fill you in or something, you know, i'm the duchess of labor, right?

Speaker: 00:41:20

You gave me that title, but What are you telling them?

Speaker: 00:41:23

And you know, what can you share that you're coaching the young person?

Speaker: 00:41:26

And then I'm also in a little while, I'm going to ask about the person

Speaker: 00:41:29

who's more advanced in their career that might be wanting to do something

Speaker: 00:41:33

different, but let's talk starting out almost like with your children.

Speaker: 00:41:38

Yeah.

Speaker: 00:41:39

Well, and I have volunteered and spoken at, high schools and middle

Speaker: 00:41:44

schools on this topic because I am so passionate about it.

Speaker: 00:41:49

And what I.

Speaker: 00:41:51

Tell students, and what I tell my own children is you really need

Speaker: 00:41:57

to find a career that aligns with your interests, your God-given

Speaker: 00:42:04

talent, with, opportunities, that you feel like are going to.

Speaker: 00:42:10

Be fulfilling and where you feel like you're making an impact and it's going

Speaker: 00:42:16

to be different for every single person.

Speaker: 00:42:18

We're all on our own path.

Speaker: 00:42:20

There's no right way or wrong way or, one way, for everyone to go, you really

Speaker: 00:42:26

need to reflect on what you want to do with your life and what skills do you

Speaker: 00:42:33

have that you can leverage and try and even with going through to get their

Speaker: 00:42:39

bachelor's degree, you know, where both of my kids are right now, it was

Speaker: 00:42:43

trying to set them up with degrees that will also give them some flexibility.

Speaker: 00:42:48

It doesn't mean like, okay, you have to just be an engineer

Speaker: 00:42:51

and you can't do anything else.

Speaker: 00:42:53

I have two very different children.

Speaker: 00:42:57

It's a challenge, right?

Speaker: 00:42:58

To say like, okay, what works for one isn't going to work for the other, but

Speaker: 00:43:02

I am excited that I think they're both.

Speaker: 00:43:05

on a path that they will get degrees in a field that they

Speaker: 00:43:10

will end up doing something with.

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they love the industry.

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They love the classes they're taking.

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And sometimes it comes back to that, like students, but figure out what

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are the classes that you're really good at, that what things come

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naturally to you dive into that.

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You know, and and see what opportunities you have in that area to pursue, but

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you have to try different things.

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I think internships are so important.

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I think every college and university should require them and have ways

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where where their students can get opportunities to gain experience.

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I can't tell you how many times I have spoken with college

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graduates that have come out, worked so hard, got their degree.

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Get their first job in the field and they really don't like the

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work and then they have to think about what am I going to do next?

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So getting experience is so important those internships and

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summer jobs All of those things, are really, really important.

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And a really bad formula is when they have debt for that education

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that they've gotten for the work.

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Now, I was real fortunate when I was at Georgia tech, I was

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able to co op and it was like,

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You go to school a quarter, then you work a quarter.

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And I was working for at that time, Georgia power.

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And I realized early on that I did not want to be an electrical engineer.

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Part of my journey has always been doing things and going, that's not it.

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Yeah.

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then making an adjustment and change.

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So another kind of big question for young people, you mentioned both

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of, your children are in college.

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my father was very involved with vocational education.

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We had a lot of conversations when he was still alive.

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He passed recently that he really believes we are driving too many people

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into college I don't know if you have any insight on this, but I'm a big

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believer and I think we've gotten away from the plumbers, electricians,

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apprenticeships, working with someone.

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Any thoughts or responses when I bring that up?

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are we, Sending too many people to college?

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Maybe that's the question.

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Well, So they're, I'm going to give you both sides.

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One, when I look at unemployment, you know, unemployment is across the board, 4.

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3%.

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But if you look at, let's say someone that doesn't have a high school diploma,

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it's just jumped up to almost 7%.

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if you look at someone that has a college degree, It's lower

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than the national average of 4.

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3.

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It's down to about maybe 3.

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5 percent unemployment.

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So there is something to be said.

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Having a college degree really can help you get gainfully employed

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and lead, you know, lead to work and participate in the labor force.

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However, I don't think we have enough people going into the trade.

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And it does come back to the point, right, where college is

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not going to be for everyone.

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And there may be some people that would be better off going through

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an electrical program, becoming an electrician or, you know, becoming a

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plumber or working in construction.

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There are some great jobs out there.

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Six figure incomes if you have the experience in the trades.

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So, and, you know, it comes down to, is this the type of

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work that you're really good at?

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You have a mind for it.

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You have a craft, a talent, and you can make a great living.

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So I do think we should have more people going into the trades.

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I'm also a daughter of an electrician, who had a very long, successful career.

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as an electrician and he loved what he did and he went

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through the apprentice program.

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And my father was someone that did go to college.

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And it really wasn't for him where he found what he was passionate.

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What he enjoyed doing was when he became an apprentice in the electrical field and

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then ultimately became an electrician.

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So, you got to find your path and kind of figure out what's going

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to be that right path for you.

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We recently spoke to someone and they said, know, it's interesting.

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They didn't do it apologetically, but it was, it was almost.

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It wasn't as excited when they said their son was interested

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in possibly becoming a mechanic.

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and my dad's family were all mechanics.

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I didn't get that gene.

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Yeah.

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but I guess one of the things I would love for us to see is to equalize.

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The honor and respect for someone who decides to do something

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like that versus so you're not oh You're not going to college.

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I'm especially again because of the whole debt thing and all of that So

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anyway, I don't know that we'll we won't solve that here, but thoughts

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Well, I agree with you a hundred percent.

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And we do somehow need to normalize that because there are great

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opportunities and we don't have enough people going into the trades.

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All right.

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So what I heard for younger people was Attempt to get a lot of experience

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trying a lot of different things.

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Sometimes it's easy to do, sometimes it's tough, but I love that thought.

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All right, now let's jump to person who's been, maybe they got a degree,

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they got out, they started working somewhere, and they've been there 10,

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15, 20 years, and they have either hit the wall, or they've hated it for 10

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years, or they want to do something.

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different.

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They are just saying, I can't picture doing this for another 10,

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15, 20 years or something like that.

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So talk to that person, give them some tips.

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You could pull from some of the things from the book if you want to.

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But, what can you coach that person?

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to do.

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No, it's a great question.

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And that could be a really challenging time for someone.

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I do talk about this in my book and give specific examples

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of people that I worked with.

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You know, I had a gentleman come to me one time and he really seemed depressed.

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You know, he had spent, his education and his first part of his

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career in the accounting industry.

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And he just.

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Was not fulfilled and didn't feel like he was making an impact.

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but at the same time, he now owned a house, had a mortgage, had little kids.

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And it's like, how do you pivot from here?

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And I think you need to take a very, very thoughtful approach.

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when you're thinking about possibly making a change.

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And I do talk about that kind of.

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You know, and even steps and questions you can ask yourself in the book.

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but really had to think about, okay, let's go back.

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What were, what were even the classes that you loved back in college?

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and what parts of your job do you really enjoy?

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And what are you really, interested in and kind of like work through, a plan

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of thinking about, all of those things.

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And, from there, I think you have to start thinking about, okay, if I, if

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I was going to make a change, where could I take the skills that I have now?

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And how do I transfer those skills into a different industry

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and into a different career?

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Where I can, you know, kind of port that with me, but, get myself on a path, you

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know, in a new industry or in a new field.

Speaker: 00:50:44

using your network is so important.

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Especially for people that are a little bit further down in their career.

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They have the advantage of having a larger network, and really networking

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with people and figuring out who might be in an industry or in a

Speaker: 00:51:00

career that you're interested in and leveraging them as a mentor or a coach.

Speaker: 00:51:06

hiring somebody like you, Tim, I mean, having a coach, it really can be extremely

Speaker: 00:51:11

helpful if you're at that point, right?

Speaker: 00:51:13

You have a career and you want to make a pivot.

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How are you going to do that?

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I would highly recommend getting a coach, an executive coach to kind

Speaker: 00:51:19

of help you through that process.

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Yeah, I actually spoke to someone yesterday that was in a role.

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He didn't hate it, but it didn't fuel him.

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And when he said, this is what I do, blah, blah, blah.

Speaker: 00:51:33

But then I've got a ministry where I did this.

Speaker: 00:51:35

And I told him, your voice tone just changed totally

Speaker: 00:51:38

when you describe those two.

Speaker: 00:51:40

But he also knows he needs to be doing a, he's called.

Speaker: 00:51:44

God wants him in that business role, but he's still doing the ministry.

Speaker: 00:51:49

So I do think, and maybe that's where the perseverance, I think that you,

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sometimes just need to stick it out.

Speaker: 00:51:54

You're supposed to be somewhere, even if it may not see, and sometimes people

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just need to change their attitude.

Speaker: 00:52:00

Truthfully, they just need to kind of shift that.

Speaker: 00:52:03

think the thing that's bothersome to me and Joni, I don't know if

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we have the answers for this.

Speaker: 00:52:08

really bugs me when people feel financially.

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handcuffed.

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they've invested so much into a role or a career or whatever.

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And they've got, like you mentioned, the house, the mortgage, the car

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payments, all that kind of stuff.

Speaker: 00:52:21

And they just say, Oh, I'd love to, I'd love to, you know, be a chef.

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I would just have always wanted to be a chef.

Speaker: 00:52:27

I'd love to go to court on blue and get trained and then be a pastry chef.

Speaker: 00:52:32

but I'm sure that's a real scenario for someone,

Speaker: 00:52:34

my wife would have loved that.

Speaker: 00:52:36

She didn't know that existed when she was, in college and all that.

Speaker: 00:52:39

they don't feel like they could do it for financial.

Speaker: 00:52:42

to me, I'll chime in with something practical is spend less than you

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make, put some money away and maybe get in a position where you could

Speaker: 00:52:52

Take a sabbatical for six months and experiment with some stuff.

Speaker: 00:52:56

I think that's cool, I love sabbatical or all for, taking a few months and

Speaker: 00:53:01

exploring testing going, Nope, I need to go back and I've seen people come

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back into their job with a renewed vigor that they never had before.

Speaker: 00:53:10

that's such great advice and, would back that up 110%.

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I think you got to find a way, you know, the old saying, when

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there's a will, there's a way.

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and, you know, maybe being a little bit, more fiscally responsible, save

Speaker: 00:53:24

a little bit more, but give yourself those opportunities, Don't look back

Speaker: 00:53:28

20 years from now and have regrets that you didn't try something that

Speaker: 00:53:31

you didn't take the sabbatical and go try working as a pastry chef.

Speaker: 00:53:36

And who knows what that could have led to, right?

Speaker: 00:53:38

So don't have regrets.

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You know, it does kind of come back to, to my book as well,

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but we really try to encourage people, dive in, give it a chance.

Speaker: 00:53:48

Even if you make that belly flop, it's okay.

Speaker: 00:53:51

better to have tried than, you know, to not try it.

Speaker: 00:53:55

Better to try and fail, but to never try at all.

Speaker: 00:53:58

And, I really do believe that the people that take chances and risks,

Speaker: 00:54:03

and go after what they are passionate about, get the biggest rewards.

Speaker: 00:54:09

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker: 00:54:10

I do want to caution people, though.

Speaker: 00:54:11

Be careful.

Speaker: 00:54:11

You could end up living in an RV traveling the world, no possession, stuff like that.

Speaker: 00:54:18

You could be a nomad or someone called me a hobo recently.

Speaker: 00:54:21

I said, hobo.

Speaker: 00:54:22

I said, I don't like that term hobo.

Speaker: 00:54:25

what do you really want people to take away from, from your book?

Speaker: 00:54:29

We, I, I'm going to encourage people to get it and go through the structure

Speaker: 00:54:33

and the system and all that, but what do you, you know, who would you

Speaker: 00:54:36

say it's for and what do you want people to really take away from it?

Speaker: 00:54:41

Yeah, you know, thank you for asking that.

Speaker: 00:54:44

I do believe this book can be helpful to students, but it can also be helpful to

Speaker: 00:54:51

people that are later in their careers.

Speaker: 00:54:55

So it is very general.

Speaker: 00:54:57

it has a lot of advice on how do you take your career to the next level and how do

Speaker: 00:55:02

you, 80 dreams that you are aspiring to.

Speaker: 00:55:06

Maybe you haven't reached a certain point or there's

Speaker: 00:55:09

something new you want to achieve.

Speaker: 00:55:10

So, I do think it could be for anyone.

Speaker: 00:55:13

As a good friend told me, her 80 year old mother read it and loved the book.

Speaker: 00:55:18

that made me, kind of chuckle.

Speaker: 00:55:19

I didn't write it for the 80 year old person, but she really enjoyed it.

Speaker: 00:55:23

but the one thing that I really hope I inspire people to do

Speaker: 00:55:29

is to take those chances.

Speaker: 00:55:32

and to pursue their goals and their ambitions of what they

Speaker: 00:55:37

really want to do the things that are deep down important to them.

Speaker: 00:55:42

I want to encourage people to find that path and find a way to dive into that.

Speaker: 00:55:51

Otherwise, it kind of comes back to what I mentioned before, I don't want people

Speaker: 00:55:54

to have regrets that they didn't try something, that they didn't try a new

Speaker: 00:55:57

industry, that they didn't try that next job, that maybe they didn't become a

Speaker: 00:56:01

mentor or coach to someone else younger.

Speaker: 00:56:05

you know, whatever it may be, go for it.

Speaker: 00:56:08

Don't hold yourself back.

Speaker: 00:56:11

Very good.

Speaker: 00:56:12

Joni, where can people find you and, you know, get the book.

Speaker: 00:56:15

I'm guessing Amazon, but where do you want people to go?

Speaker: 00:56:18

If they go, I need to connect with Joni.

Speaker: 00:56:22

tell us where to go.

Speaker: 00:56:23

We'll include it down the links and I've got one more question and we're done.

Speaker: 00:56:27

All right.

Speaker: 00:56:27

Well, it is easy to connect with me on LinkedIn, or you can go to my

Speaker: 00:56:32

website, which is www dot Joni Biley.

Speaker: 00:56:36

com.

Speaker: 00:56:36

And you can send me a message through the website as well.

Speaker: 00:56:40

I appreciate promoting the book.

Speaker: 00:56:42

I have donated all my proceeds of the book to Women in Leadership,

Speaker: 00:56:48

a scholarship program with the American Staffing Association.

Speaker: 00:56:51

So, thank you, for the promotion of the book as well.

Speaker: 00:56:54

I appreciate that.

Speaker: 00:56:57

Very good.

Speaker: 00:56:57

All right.

Speaker: 00:56:57

Thanks.

Speaker: 00:56:58

Make sure that you connect with Joni, in the areas and places that she mentioned.

Speaker: 00:57:03

Joni, we're Seek, Go, Create, those three words.

Speaker: 00:57:06

And I'm going to allow you, as my final question, to choose

Speaker: 00:57:10

one of those words and why.

Speaker: 00:57:12

It just resonates with you, means more to you currently.

Speaker: 00:57:15

Seek, Go, or Create.

Speaker: 00:57:18

Well, it's so hard, Tim, to just pick one because I love the whole concept.

Speaker: 00:57:24

But I'm going to pick Go because I want to encourage people to dive in, right?

Speaker: 00:57:31

Go.

Speaker: 00:57:32

and maybe it's even before you're creating something, but you

Speaker: 00:57:36

gotta try and pursue your dreams.

Speaker: 00:57:38

So, that's the one that resonates with me the most, but I love them all.

Speaker: 00:57:45

Thank you, Joni.

Speaker: 00:57:46

I appreciate it.

Speaker: 00:57:47

Make sure you get the book, Dive in Deep Strategies to Advance Your Career,

Speaker: 00:57:53

Balance and Live Your Best Life.

Speaker: 00:57:56

I appreciate you being here, Joni.

Speaker: 00:57:58

Thanks for this conversation.

Speaker: 00:57:59

I'm also thankful for all of those that have listened in.

Speaker: 00:58:03

We have new episodes here at Seek, Go, Create.

Speaker: 00:58:06

Every Monday on YouTube and on all your podcast platforms.

Speaker: 00:58:11

We appreciate people commenting and sharing, giving us ratings,

Speaker: 00:58:16

all types of things there.

Speaker: 00:58:17

So thank you for that until next time, continue being all

Speaker: 00:58:22

that you were created to be.