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AI-Powered Marketing: Bridging the Gap Between Data and Art with Branden Cobb

In this episode of Seek Go Create, host Tim Winders sits down with marketing expert Branden Cobb, an innovative business educator. They dive into the fascinating world of artificial intelligence and its impact on various industries, particularly marketing. From the fear of job replacement to the power of AI in content creation, Branden shares valuable insights and thought-provoking perspectives. Discover how AI is reshaping the marketing landscape, the importance of adaptability, and the possibilities for creating personalized ads. Join us as we explore the captivating intersection of AI and marketing on Seek Go Create with Tim Winders and Branden Cobb.

"Marketing could be one of the biggest beneficiaries of AI, just because of the generative portion of creating content. The human is still the pilot and AI is the co-pilot, but you're still giving instructions and it's just speeding up the process, maybe eliminating the need for some specialist positions." - Branden Cobb

Access all show and episode resources HERE

About Our Guest:

Branden Cobb is a passionate advocate for companies that make a positive impact on the world. His mission is to support these businesses in their growth and profitability so that they can continue to add value on a larger scale. While many might associate value with charitable endeavors, Branden believes it extends beyond that. Whether it's a product, service, efficiency, or convenience, if it contributes positively to society, he is eager to assist these companies in improving and expanding their reach. Through his expertise and guidance, Branden empowers these organizations to keep scaling their valuable offerings.

Reasons to Listen:

  • Decipher the influential role of AI in rewriting the rules of the marketing industry.
  • Peer into the job market of the future, particularly in the sphere of marketing.
  • Recognize the compelling necessity to engrain technology in today's marketing practices.
  • Navigate the often perplexing road to quantify the returns on marketing initiatives.
  • Become conversant with the harmonious blend of creativity and analytical thinking in devising marketing strategies.

Episode Highlights:

00:00:00 - Introduction

The host introduces the podcast and the guest, Branden Cobb, a marketing and profit driving executive. They discuss the focus of the podcast on challenging conventional definitions of success and exploring stories of transformation in leadership, business, and ministry.

00:02:41 - Coolest Gig: Not Impossible Labs

Branden shares his experience working with Not Impossible Labs, a company that seeks to solve medical problems with cheap and easy hacks. They created innovative solutions like eye-tracking glasses for a paralyzed artist and a vibration system for deaf people to experience music. The company also partnered with big brands to highlight their positive impact on the world.

00:07:42 - AI in Marketing

Branden discusses the impact of AI on the marketing industry, particularly in content creation and personalization. AI can generate ads tailored to specific customer personas and create thousands of variations for display ads. While some jobs like graphic design and copywriting may be at risk, new jobs will be created to oversee and direct AI.

00:11:56 - Future of Work in Marketing

Branden addresses concerns about job displacement due to AI. He explains that while certain jobs may be replaced, new jobs will emerge in managing AI systems. Graphic designers, copywriters, and even actors in Hollywood are at risk, but the shift in job skills will likely create more thoughtful and creative roles.

00:15:22 - Final Thoughts

The conversation about AI concludes with a reminder that technology has always replaced jobs but also created new opportunities.

00:15:17 - The Impact of Social Media on Content Creation,

The guest discusses the ease of creating content on social media platforms and wonders if the influx of content will affect the marketing arena. He emphasizes the importance of grabbing people's attention in a saturated content environment and suggests that attention-grabbing information that challenges people's beliefs can be effective in marketing.

00:18:29 - Background and Journey to Marketing Expertise,

The host asks the guest about his background and how he became an expert in marketing. The guest shares that he has always had a passion for storytelling, video creation, and the creative space. He also mentions his skills in math and numbers, which have been helpful in the marketing field. The guest believes that marketing skills can be applied across industries to bring fresh perspectives.

00:21:11 - The Confidence of Being Good at Marketing,

The guest recounts instances where he received positive feedback and recognition for his marketing skills, such as being awarded Corporate Employee of the Month and being appointed as a keynote speaker. However, he also acknowledges that there have been times of doubt when he couldn't convince others to believe in his ideas.

00:23:19 - The Challenge of Convincing Others in Marketing,

The guest reveals that he sometimes struggles to gain trust and convince CEOs or CFOs to approve his marketing campaigns. He emphasizes the need to present data and projections to back up marketing strategies. The guest acknowledges that there are different ways to achieve marketing goals and highlights the importance of collaboration and alignment.

00:29:48 - The Value of Marketing and the Intersection of Art and Science,

The conversation begins with a discussion about a digital billboard in downtown Atlanta and the value of advertising for companies like Miller beer. They explore the balance between the science and art of marketing, estimating that around 50% can be supported by data while the rest relies on creativity and intuition.

00:32:35 - The Challenge of Predicting Marketing Outcomes,

The conversation delves into the difficulty of predicting marketing outcomes, comparing it to trying to predict stock market movements. While data can explain a certain percentage, there will always be a significant portion that remains unknown. The goal is to continuously improve and find ways to justify artistic choices in marketing.

00:33:24 - The Limitations of AI in Marketing,

The discussion turns to the limitations of artificial intelligence in marketing. While AI can automate processes and analyze data, it cannot replicate the emotional connection that humans can make and understand. This human touch is a valuable aspect that cannot be duplicated by AI.

00:34:05 - Trends and Divisions in the Economy,

The conversation shifts to the trends and changes in the economy. Despite predictions of a recession, spending and business opportunities continue. However, there is a growing divide in wealth and skills, with those who adapt to the changing world benefiting the most. The affordability of goods and services is increasing, but the divide between those doing well and those struggling is widening.

00:44:55 - The Importance of Audience-Specific Marketing,

The guest discusses a previous engagement where a company focused on Facebook ads, even though it wasn't the right platform for their audience. He emphasizes the need to evaluate the target audience and choose the appropriate marketing strategies, such as utilizing LinkedIn. It's essential to have a well-rounded marketing generalist who can select and deploy the right strategies at the right time.

00:50:02 - How to Determine If You're Dealing with a Generalist or a Specialist,

The host asks how business owners can know if they're working with a generalist or a specialist in marketing. The guest suggests that instead of focusing on specific tactics or strategies, business leaders should focus on their goals and ask marketers how they would help achieve those goals. The marketer's answer will reveal if they are a generalist or a specialist.

00:52:19 - No One-Size-Fits-All Platform for Marketing,

The guest explains that there is no one-size-fits-all platform for marketing. The choice of platform depends on the specific audience and goals of the business. He emphasizes the importance of utilizing all that the internet has to offer for tracking and ROI purposes. Local businesses may benefit from offline marketing in their communities, while nationwide businesses need to consider different platforms based on their target demographics.

00:54:53 - Exciting Trends in Marketing and Concerns,

The guest expresses excitement about making consumer experiences more enjoyable and focusing on the consumer's journey. He believes that creating a smooth and enjoyable experience leads to loyalty

Key Lessons:

1. Embrace the opportunities of AI and automation: The guest, Branden Cobb, believes that while certain jobs may be at risk, AI will create new and better jobs. It is important to adapt our skill sets and see AI as a positive development rather than something to fear.

2. Marketing is more than just promotion: Cobb emphasizes that marketing involves product development, pricing, and choosing the right place to sell products. It is an integrated aspect of the business that extends beyond advertising and social media.

3. Agility and adaptability are key in marketing: Cobb stresses the importance of being agile and adjusting skill sets based on changing marketing needs. Having a well-rounded marketer who can select and deploy the right strategies is crucial.

4. Attribution is a challenge in marketing: Cobb's work focuses on attributing ROI to different marketing touchpoints, which can be a complex task. AI can potentially help with calculating and understanding these attributions.

5. The art side of marketing is important: While data is important, Cobb highlights that marketing is not just about numbers. The art side, including human emotion and creativity, plays a significant role in effective marketing.

6. Embrace change and continue learning: Cobb sees the current time as both scary and exciting. It is important to keep trying, learning, and adapting in order to maintain success in an ever-changing world.

7. Collaboration and alignment are crucial: The speaker emphasizes the importance of collaboration and alignment in achieving goals. Working together with others and gaining their trust and support can lead to successful marketing campaigns.

8. Apply marketing principles across industries: Cobb believes that marketing principles can be applied to different industries for fresh perspectives and insights. It is a versatile skill set that can be useful in various contexts.

9. Explore the potential of AI in content creation: AI can revolutionize content creation by generating personalized and targeted ads. While human interaction is still necessary for quality control, AI can greatly enhance the efficiency and customization of the process.

10. Stay informed about AI advancements: Cobb mentions how eBay is already using AI to display personalized ads across the web. It is important to stay informed about the latest advancements in AI technology and how they can be utilized in marketing strategies.

Resources & Action Steps:

You can find Branden at Linkedin and his website MarketingExecs.us.

Action Steps

1. Adapt and Upskill: Take the speaker's advice and embrace the opportunities that AI brings. Start by identifying areas in your profession or industry that may be at risk of automation and focus on developing new skills that complement AI technologies. Seek out online courses, workshops, or certifications that can enhance your knowledge and abilities.

2. Embrace Integrated Marketing: Recognize that marketing is not just about promotion but also about product development, pricing strategies, and choosing the right place to sell your products or services. Expand your understanding of marketing by studying the expanded "seven Ps" concept and exploring how you can integrate marketing into all aspects of your business. Consider outsourcing certain marketing tasks initially to minimize risk and gradually bring them in-house as they prove successful.

3. Utilize AI in Marketing: Take advantage of the potential of AI in marketing by exploring its applications in content creation, ad targeting, and personalization. Familiarize yourself with AI tools and platforms that can help automate and optimize your marketing campaigns. Start small and experiment with AI-generated ads or personalized customer experiences. Monitor the results, make adjustments as needed, and continue to learn and adapt to the changing landscape of AI in marketing.

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Transcript
Branden Cobb:

Now there's going to be a lot of jobs and how you,

Branden Cobb:

prompt and direct and oversee AI.

Branden Cobb:

So yes, you may.

Branden Cobb:

The job skills may shift.

Branden Cobb:

The job titles may shift.

Branden Cobb:

but it's going to, hopefully create a more thoughtful and

Branden Cobb:

creative, a more thoughtful job

Tim Winders:

Hello everyone.

Tim Winders:

Welcome to seek go create.

Tim Winders:

This is your host, Tim winders.

Tim Winders:

I'm an executive coach and I just.

Tim Winders:

Have fun getting to ask the questions.

Tim Winders:

Today's no different.

Tim Winders:

this is the place here at Seek Go Create.

Tim Winders:

This is where we challenge conventional definitions of success, explore

Tim Winders:

stories of transformation in leadership, business, and in ministry.

Tim Winders:

You're going to go heavy in leadership and business today.

Tim Winders:

In today's episode, I've got.

Tim Winders:

Privilege of talking to Brandon Cobb.

Tim Winders:

He's a marketing and profit driving executive with a track

Tim Winders:

record of pioneering, courageous marketing strategies for some

Tim Winders:

really cool, iconic brands.

Tim Winders:

He's got to focus on innovation, customer engagement, and team leadership.

Tim Winders:

He's played an integral role in turning companies around, fostering growth

Tim Winders:

and strengthening brand loyalty.

Tim Winders:

Brandon, welcome to Seek Go Create.

Branden Cobb:

Thank you, Tim.

Branden Cobb:

Thank you for having me.

Branden Cobb:

Excited to be here.

Tim Winders:

Yeah, I'm excited that you're here to we were chit chatting briefly

Tim Winders:

trying to get internet going and all just a minute ago and I think we got it.

Tim Winders:

So let's dive in my question.

Tim Winders:

First question icebreaker.

Tim Winders:

We just bump into each other.

Tim Winders:

Not entirely untrue.

Tim Winders:

And I just like to know more about you.

Tim Winders:

And I say, what do you do?

Tim Winders:

What's your answer?

Tim Winders:

When someone says, what do you do?

Branden Cobb:

I like to say I help companies that are providing a value

Branden Cobb:

to the world continue to profit and grow so they can continue to add, value

Branden Cobb:

to the world and scale that value.

Branden Cobb:

so You know, I'm not talking about just things that are so much, how

Branden Cobb:

people would think of like a charity or something like that, but it could

Branden Cobb:

be, if it's a product or service that's providing an efficiency, a convenience.

Branden Cobb:

It could be a good thing, a positive thing for the world as well, but anything

Branden Cobb:

that, that really is adding value to the world, I like to help them, continue to

Branden Cobb:

improve so they can keep scaling that.

Tim Winders:

And sometimes it's hard to gauge, value sometimes

Tim Winders:

is in the eye of the beholder.

Tim Winders:

we've got a lot of ministry folks and, church things.

Tim Winders:

and then some people think that some products have value.

Tim Winders:

Some don't, I don't.

Tim Winders:

I'm going to get into that because I think the world has a lot of opportunity there.

Tim Winders:

Did I see somewhere, have you done anything with MTV?

Branden Cobb:

I did, yeah.

Branden Cobb:

when I first went to, to undergraduate and everything, I wanted to go do film and I

Branden Cobb:

ended up, doing marketing and producing films and doing marketing in the film

Branden Cobb:

industry for, A handful of years, but, one of my first, things was with MTV and

Branden Cobb:

their on air promotions in New York City.

Branden Cobb:

So right there in Times Square, anybody that may remember back in the

Branden Cobb:

90s or where there was like the TRL, studio, we were right there and where

Branden Cobb:

they used to do those top 10 videos.

Branden Cobb:

And, yeah, right there in Times Square, it was really great.

Branden Cobb:

We were creating a lot of commercials, promoting all their shows.

Tim Winders:

I think I'm a little older than that.

Tim Winders:

I actually remember when MTV still did videos, before I

Tim Winders:

started doing all the other stuff.

Tim Winders:

I remember when MTV hit the air.

Tim Winders:

That's how old I am.

Tim Winders:

So you were there when they were starting to make some changes.

Branden Cobb:

Yeah, and I can say, most of the people, like, when I was

Branden Cobb:

there as one of the younger people and most of the people that were there

Branden Cobb:

were actually, that was their biggest statement was that they were just, upset

Branden Cobb:

that, that was the direction it was going and they wanted the videos back

Branden Cobb:

and, yeah, but anyway, nevertheless, it was a very cool gig and, fun times,

Tim Winders:

Yeah, good.

Tim Winders:

so what is the coolest gig you've had?

Tim Winders:

we, you mentioned some brands and I look through your, your profile and some of

Tim Winders:

the stuff and I know they all are cool in their own right, but what's the one that's

Tim Winders:

you know what, this was a really good gig.

Branden Cobb:

So if you step outside of, just like movie making, cause

Branden Cobb:

that's a whole world on its own, then I would say there was a company

Branden Cobb:

I was with in, in Los Angeles, that was called not impossible labs.

Branden Cobb:

And they basically would try to take somebody.

Branden Cobb:

try to take a medical situation that currently had no solution and come

Branden Cobb:

up with a hack, a cheap and easy hack to solve that medical problem.

Branden Cobb:

and for example, there was a graffiti artist, really great artist that, became

Branden Cobb:

paralyzed and they created a pair of glasses that had a camera on it for about

Branden Cobb:

15 you could make it and he could maneuver a computer through the just moving his eye

Branden Cobb:

and it would track his eye movement and it would spray paint out where he so he could

Branden Cobb:

now draw with his eye or that same company we created like a deaf music experience.

Branden Cobb:

So we partnered with Beats by Dre and there was a vibration, whole vibration

Branden Cobb:

system on people who were deaf and they could experience the music or 3D printing

Branden Cobb:

prosthetic arms for again, like 15.

Branden Cobb:

and the Sudan and Africa, they were having a civil war and we were printing

Branden Cobb:

arms for 15 instead of 15, 000.

Branden Cobb:

So it was like cheap and easy hacks.

Branden Cobb:

And it was pretty cool.

Branden Cobb:

and it, and.

Branden Cobb:

Incorporated a lot of marketing and media partnering with big brands

Branden Cobb:

to do their kind of showing that they're doing good in the world.

Branden Cobb:

They're using their technology and their resources to give back to the world.

Tim Winders:

I love the thought of that.

Tim Winders:

I'm sitting here going, wow, that's almost like in this category of like,

Tim Winders:

where the make a wish foundation, where they're just trying to make things happen.

Tim Winders:

And I, the reason I really love that is that they're, you're looking for

Tim Winders:

solutions that are maybe less expensive, not, high dollar where, you know, and I.

Tim Winders:

I think the term hack is a good one there.

Tim Winders:

So what's, what's maybe the weirdest one you've ever run across?

Tim Winders:

It's this is a weird thing.

Tim Winders:

And especially going back to what you said, you do, you help people

Tim Winders:

that bring value to the world.

Tim Winders:

and I don't want you to, I'm not trying to call out any like former clients or

Tim Winders:

things, but I'm always interested to see things like, this is unique value

Tim Winders:

that they're bringing to the world.

Branden Cobb:

I'd like to maybe hit on something more recently.

Branden Cobb:

So I've been, providing, Fractional services for the last year and a half to a

Branden Cobb:

variety of companies and, so a lot of kind of early stage startups or people, maybe

Branden Cobb:

companies that are existing, but they're they want to bring a new product market.

Branden Cobb:

And, there was with all the talk of AI and everything.

Branden Cobb:

There's a company called Bolster Rue, that is Mixing the, traditional content

Branden Cobb:

management systems of marketing.

Branden Cobb:

the buffer, the HootSuites, the pre scheduling out of

Branden Cobb:

your content on social media.

Branden Cobb:

So they're mixing, that, that pre scheduling out with AI

Branden Cobb:

generative, content creation.

Branden Cobb:

I helped them, I had, experience in real estate.

Branden Cobb:

So I connected them with a couple of clients and the real estate industry.

Branden Cobb:

And they really targeted their product that how do you write a property

Branden Cobb:

descriptions or how do you write, general real estate informational posts.

Branden Cobb:

And then it creates the, it's not just the text, it's the image.

Branden Cobb:

and then there's still a human interaction.

Branden Cobb:

So the human reviews the content.

Branden Cobb:

But then hit schedule.

Branden Cobb:

But it basically you just plug in that.

Branden Cobb:

Hey, I want all the next week a content for next week.

Branden Cobb:

It pumps it out.

Branden Cobb:

You approve it, and it's now scheduled.

Branden Cobb:

So I think this is it's that cutting edge of using AI and trying to provide

Branden Cobb:

a new value to the world that maybe didn't exist a couple years ago.

Tim Winders:

that's fascinating.

Tim Winders:

That actually gives me a line of questioning.

Tim Winders:

I'd love to drill down on.

Tim Winders:

I actually thought of this is the impact that AI is having on, we'll

Tim Winders:

just call it the marketing industry because obviously it's the buzz now,

Tim Winders:

a lot of people are talking about it, which is cool and I think it should be,

Tim Winders:

just with this project, the podcast, we have, I can't tell you how many

Tim Winders:

AI tools that we're using going all the way from the editing process to

Tim Winders:

Even you'll get a kick out of this.

Tim Winders:

One of the things I don't know if I should say this or not, this

Tim Winders:

could be like, I'll say it anyway.

Tim Winders:

One of the things I do before I sit down with someone like you that we haven't

Tim Winders:

met, we've interacted some, you reached out to our people and we scheduled this,

Tim Winders:

is I'll take, A list of things on your LinkedIn, or, what you say you do a

Tim Winders:

resume or one page or something like that.

Tim Winders:

I'll pop it in the AI tool, either chat GPT or cloud or something like that.

Tim Winders:

I said, Hey, write a short little blurb.

Tim Winders:

In fact, the blurb I said at the beginning, sorta came from.

Tim Winders:

And then I say, give me 10 cool and interesting questions to ask this person.

Tim Winders:

Now, I want to say, I rarely get to those questions, but it is interesting to see.

Tim Winders:

So I think it's touching a lot of industries.

Tim Winders:

What's it doing to the world of marketing?

Tim Winders:

What is AI doing there?

Tim Winders:

Y'all think you gave an example with this company, but just either

Tim Winders:

general or specific, whatever, wherever you'd like to go with it.

Branden Cobb:

I think out of any industry or any, department within companies or.

Branden Cobb:

Any industry, I think marketing could be one of the biggest beneficiaries

Branden Cobb:

of AI just because of the generative portion of creating content.

Branden Cobb:

I think if you think of a customer profile or persona, you could Talk with

Branden Cobb:

it and say who you're trying to target.

Branden Cobb:

Hey, create this persona and then you can start to create a community

Branden Cobb:

continue to communicate with the AI to create ads targeted at that persona.

Branden Cobb:

So now, it's still The human is still the pilot, and this is the co pilot, but it's

Branden Cobb:

the, you're still giving instructions, and it's just probably hyper speeding up,

Branden Cobb:

the process, maybe eliminating, the need for some of the, the specialist positions,

Branden Cobb:

but being a marketing generalist, you can still shape it and direct it.

Branden Cobb:

I talked to the CMO of eBay and they are using it to on display ads that

Branden Cobb:

show up, all across the web and follow you around and things, to make a more

Branden Cobb:

personalized, customized experience.

Branden Cobb:

Generally, you would have a graphic designer or somebody create those display

Branden Cobb:

ads and now the exact same ad may have 10, 000 variations, for example, and a I

Branden Cobb:

may have created those 10, 000 variations.

Branden Cobb:

So you may have had a graphic designer create the initial

Branden Cobb:

one or something like that.

Branden Cobb:

But then you want a bunch of variations.

Branden Cobb:

And then now how do you place on where it's really, and it might be

Branden Cobb:

just the slightest tweak, but that slightest tweak may, connect with

Branden Cobb:

somebody a little differently depending on, what their activity is online.

Branden Cobb:

I, that is not fully, nobody's just letting it run, on wild on its own yet.

Branden Cobb:

It's still got that human interaction.

Branden Cobb:

So there's a time lag.

Branden Cobb:

It's not Oh, I click on this website.

Branden Cobb:

Now I have this custom, custom image.

Branden Cobb:

It's still going through a human, checks and balances process.

Branden Cobb:

But, but I figure at some day, there's going to be where

Branden Cobb:

the ads will change for you.

Branden Cobb:

They're not pre created, but they will for you.

Branden Cobb:

based on the pathways you're going down and eventually companies

Branden Cobb:

will just let this run free.

Branden Cobb:

So

Tim Winders:

I actually see this is the way I describe a lot of technology

Tim Winders:

like this is that It's really cool.

Tim Winders:

And then it's a little creepy at the same time There's kind of these things

Tim Winders:

what you just brought up I absolutely can see that because if we just go backwards

Tim Winders:

in time we see some things now that are on full auto with Anyway, I can't think

Tim Winders:

examples, but there's a lot of things that are on auto that we thought we always

Tim Winders:

need a human What about this is Kind of the thing that's bothering people now.

Tim Winders:

This doesn't bother me as much, but what about jobs in the marketing field?

Tim Winders:

I also noticed, I think you do some, I think you're a professor, you do some

Tim Winders:

teaching and all for, some schools.

Tim Winders:

what about the future of work and jobs in the marketing arena?

Tim Winders:

What jobs are going to go away?

Tim Winders:

What's in jeopardy.

Tim Winders:

And then what are some of the opportunities?

Tim Winders:

Maybe that's a way to ask it.

Branden Cobb:

first I'll say I've always been taught through the MBA that I did.

Branden Cobb:

And now I'm also in addition to working.

Branden Cobb:

I've started a doctorate.

Branden Cobb:

it's made for working.

Branden Cobb:

Professional.

Branden Cobb:

So through all the business education I've done, I've always been taught, don't

Branden Cobb:

be afraid of, this was back in the day, like outsourcing because outsourcing will

Branden Cobb:

create a new job, a better job, or don't be afraid of now technology replacing.

Branden Cobb:

And if you go back to okay, email came about what replaced a lot

Branden Cobb:

of, traditional male, snail mail, possibly jobs or something, or, you

Branden Cobb:

go back to alarm clock replaced.

Branden Cobb:

window bangers in the morning of, waking people up.

Branden Cobb:

So these, so yes, jobs are going to be replaced, but new

Branden Cobb:

jobs are going to be created.

Branden Cobb:

Now, email comes about, okay, maybe there's not traditional male jobs, but

Branden Cobb:

there's a ton of jobs in the email space.

Branden Cobb:

and now, same thing.

Branden Cobb:

So now there's going to be a lot of jobs and how you, prompt

Branden Cobb:

and direct and oversee AI.

Branden Cobb:

So yes, you may.

Branden Cobb:

The job skills may shift.

Branden Cobb:

The job titles may shift.

Branden Cobb:

but it's going to, hopefully create a more thoughtful and creative,

Branden Cobb:

a more thoughtful job, maybe.

Branden Cobb:

but I think the specific jobs that will go away are, graphic

Branden Cobb:

designers are in somewhat danger.

Branden Cobb:

The copywriters are in somewhat danger.

Branden Cobb:

you see it in, in L.

Branden Cobb:

A.

Branden Cobb:

right now with the, just in Hollywood that the actors are afraid of, voiceover,

Branden Cobb:

I can still tell always when it's an A.

Branden Cobb:

I.

Branden Cobb:

voice, but, I think humans are going to get better and

Branden Cobb:

better at detecting what's A.

Branden Cobb:

I.

Branden Cobb:

generated, but A.

Branden Cobb:

I.

Branden Cobb:

is going to get better and better at, Creating content that is more human light.

Branden Cobb:

so yeah, I think actors, I think there's certain elements

Branden Cobb:

of things that are in danger.

Branden Cobb:

But, but at the same time, it's going to open up a whole

Branden Cobb:

new world of possibilities.

Branden Cobb:

You just got to be looking at what, shaping what's below it.

Branden Cobb:

So yeah, I think there's you may have to adjust your scope set.

Branden Cobb:

but I think in overall, it's a great

Tim Winders:

a disclaimer here.

Tim Winders:

I want everyone to know that I'm an actual person and talking and asking

Tim Winders:

questions and Brandon is an actual person.

Tim Winders:

Sometimes we, I do think we're coming to that stage where we're going to have to

Tim Winders:

probably do that because someone brought up recently, they say, you know, with all

Tim Winders:

the audio that's out there with you and guests and things like that, 220 something

Tim Winders:

episodes now here at Seek Go Create, it's going to be very easy to train.

Tim Winders:

Yeah.

Tim Winders:

For your voice.

Tim Winders:

I'm going this voice, Georgia boy who's tried to get rid of, Southern accent.

Tim Winders:

I go, yeah, it'll probably be pretty, pretty easy.

Tim Winders:

and so that's, I think that's going to be fascinating.

Tim Winders:

And I do agree with you, for me, It's always been, like the first time I stepped

Tim Winders:

in and I'm not exactly would be considered like, Gen Z or, even these generations, in

Tim Winders:

fact, I'm the tail end of the baby boomer generation, but when I see tech, I usually

Tim Winders:

watch briefly and then I jump on board.

Tim Winders:

And so I started doing things with AI and.

Tim Winders:

And I just perceive it as a writing assistant and a brainstorm partner,

Tim Winders:

for the things that I'm doing.

Tim Winders:

And I guess related to that, there's something that's related to marketing

Tim Winders:

that I do want to bring up and then we'll move on some other things off of AI, but.

Tim Winders:

I have wondered because of the capacity of social media and all

Tim Winders:

the channels that are out there.

Tim Winders:

I have wondered because it is so easy.

Tim Winders:

We notice it just with what we're doing here, this project here, that

Tim Winders:

it is so easy to create content.

Tim Winders:

Is it good content?

Tim Winders:

Is it great content?

Tim Winders:

Is it mediocre content?

Tim Winders:

I'm not sure.

Tim Winders:

I could judge it some.

Tim Winders:

With my eye, but then some, i'm letting the audience judge that are we going to

Tim Winders:

see a massive influx of just More stuff out there and I know that will impact the

Tim Winders:

marketing arena because we're really vying for people's attention In my opinion.

Tim Winders:

And so what are your thoughts on that?

Tim Winders:

Because I know just for me in the last six months, I've created more content.

Tim Winders:

I've considered writing a few more books.

Tim Winders:

I wrote a wrote one that took me five years.

Tim Winders:

Now I'm thinking, gosh, I might could do five a year instead

Tim Winders:

of it taking five years.

Tim Winders:

what are your thoughts just on the ability to just crank it out?

Branden Cobb:

I think, probably, there will be more content.

Branden Cobb:

Yeah.

Branden Cobb:

I think that we may also get better at, Summarizing or getting through

Branden Cobb:

content faster, just the same way.

Branden Cobb:

And unlike listening to videos, you listen to them at 1.

Branden Cobb:

5 speed or two point, 2.

Branden Cobb:

0 speed.

Branden Cobb:

or you can take content now and put it into the chat GPT

Branden Cobb:

and have it sum it up for you.

Branden Cobb:

So I think, yeah, there's going to be, there's going to be more out there.

Branden Cobb:

and I think from a marketing perspective, like you said,

Branden Cobb:

grabbing attention, creating.

Branden Cobb:

you don't want to, you don't want to take a concept or idea that people

Branden Cobb:

are believing and completely just say, Oh, that's garbage or that's all false

Branden Cobb:

and stuff, because a lot of people would just be like, that's absurd.

Branden Cobb:

But you can take a lot of what's going out there and try to be, say something

Branden Cobb:

about what's going on is wrong.

Branden Cobb:

so it's just a slight shift and so if that's the attention grabbing,

Branden Cobb:

information and the attention grabbing content will be the things that don't

Branden Cobb:

fully wipe out a person's belief, but shocks them a little bit and redirects.

Branden Cobb:

so if you're taking, so I guess this is this goes into another So

Branden Cobb:

This is one strategy of how you grab attention, but there's a lot

Branden Cobb:

of ways you can grab attention.

Branden Cobb:

I mean, you know, back there were social media posts where certain

Branden Cobb:

colors would stop the scroll.

Branden Cobb:

but, but yeah, I think you just got to find a way that kind of, as

Branden Cobb:

people are going through a ton of, content passively, it grabs their

Branden Cobb:

attention and makes them conscious.

Branden Cobb:

And that's what you need to, do with your marketing.

Tim Winders:

I want to circle back maybe towards the tail end as we're

Tim Winders:

wrapping up and talk about some strategies and things for some of

Tim Winders:

the business owners and leaders of organizations that are listening.

Tim Winders:

And I think you've got a lot of value there.

Tim Winders:

But I want to, I, one of the things that I love to do here.

Tim Winders:

Is find out how people came into whatever they're doing and you know Some of

Tim Winders:

the highs the lows the you know, some even the good the bad and the ugly.

Tim Winders:

I think that's a valuable story Have you always been?

Tim Winders:

marketing guy Like this kind of a joke on the playground in elementary

Tim Winders:

school or wherever you went to school, where you like, man, I'm

Tim Winders:

going to do marketing someday, or is that something you've moved into?

Tim Winders:

So however you want to share your background or story, that's really me

Tim Winders:

saying, how did Brandon come to be, an expert in the area of marketing

Tim Winders:

and how far back does that go?

Branden Cobb:

I think there's a lot of things that play up to where I'm at now.

Branden Cobb:

And, when you talk about going back to the playground, I remember friends

Branden Cobb:

telling me like, Oh, I love to tell a story or something like that.

Branden Cobb:

And and then.

Branden Cobb:

I fell in love with video creation and creative, the creative space of it.

Branden Cobb:

but video content specifically.

Branden Cobb:

And that's where, I pursued some stuff in the film industry,

Branden Cobb:

but it was also very tough.

Branden Cobb:

And I, I understood the business side of things.

Branden Cobb:

I wasn't just, I'm split minded and not just like, All business or all

Branden Cobb:

creative on the little bit of both.

Branden Cobb:

And with that marketing kind of naturally fell into place.

Branden Cobb:

I was always good with math and numbers, which I think now with

Branden Cobb:

marketing, data and analytics are becoming more and more important.

Branden Cobb:

I took Martin jobs when originally trying to pursue some stuff in the film industry,

Branden Cobb:

just to get by and that built a skill set that then helped in the film industry,

Branden Cobb:

but also now has provided a whole career that is generalizable across industries.

Branden Cobb:

And that's the way I really look at marketing is that some

Branden Cobb:

of the skill sets like yeah there's nuances in each industry.

Branden Cobb:

but.

Branden Cobb:

A lot of the marketing skill sets can cross over industries, or you can

Branden Cobb:

bring a fresh perspective, because a lot of times in a certain industry,

Branden Cobb:

people get stuck in certain ways of, of everybody mimicking, other organizations

Branden Cobb:

or companies in that same industry.

Branden Cobb:

And if you come from an outside perspective, you can bring some of the

Branden Cobb:

marketing principles and cross it over.

Branden Cobb:

So I would just say that, yeah, my, from storytelling, from being creative, from

Branden Cobb:

being, mathematical and business minded still, it just was like a good overall fit

Branden Cobb:

that, that, you know, where I fit in well,

Tim Winders:

Or at what point, and I don't know if you can think of an example

Tim Winders:

or if it was just a process, at what point was there a time where you looked

Tim Winders:

in the mirror or you had a situation, client, whatever, where you went,

Tim Winders:

huh, I'm actually pretty good at this.

Tim Winders:

This is something that I'm pretty good at in the marketing arena.

Tim Winders:

Can you think of an example?

Tim Winders:

That's a little bit of a tough question.

Tim Winders:

Hopefully I didn't get you thinking about that.

Tim Winders:

That's,

Branden Cobb:

there, there's been several times, that this has clicked, I, I was,

Branden Cobb:

at an organization in Columbus, Ohio that had 500, retail locations across the U.

Branden Cobb:

S., and I was in their field marketing, throwing a bunch of events, and, I,

Branden Cobb:

we got, mayors of cities to come out for grand opening ribbon cuttings,

Branden Cobb:

and, and then we got it put on the front page of the local newspapers.

Branden Cobb:

I remember the CEO of that company coming up to me and telling me,

Branden Cobb:

Brandon, you're on, you're on the fast track or something like this.

Branden Cobb:

And that was, and then I was awarded like their corporate employee of the month, and

Branden Cobb:

it was a couple thousand person, company.

Branden Cobb:

So like that, those reaffirmations are like, are there.

Branden Cobb:

And then I would say, being in LA and being able to market, to, to where we

Branden Cobb:

can generate opportunities successfully.

Branden Cobb:

both on the creation, being able to fundraise and create projects, but

Branden Cobb:

then also distribute them and return the investments and everything.

Branden Cobb:

I think that was it.

Branden Cobb:

in the real estate industry, I had, a lot of reaffirmations too.

Branden Cobb:

I think, it's a lot of times the CEO is coming up to me and reaffirming that, that

Branden Cobb:

they believe in me or they're behind me.

Branden Cobb:

the CEO of a real estate company I was with, they, he put me as their keynote

Branden Cobb:

speaker at a, leadership conference.

Branden Cobb:

And, after I spoke, he came up just to close out the conference and he, he told

Branden Cobb:

me, I'm fully behind you and everything.

Branden Cobb:

So I think those are the reaffirmations.

Branden Cobb:

I'll say though, at the same point, There's a lot of times

Branden Cobb:

where there's doubt, too.

Branden Cobb:

because,

Tim Winders:

that's what I was about to ask.

Tim Winders:

I was about to ask, okay, so when have been the times that you

Tim Winders:

went, because redefining success is like our main theme here.

Tim Winders:

When has it been tough and you've gone, oh boy.

Tim Winders:

So that's really what I like to dig at.

Branden Cobb:

and it brings me full circle because the thing is, there's

Branden Cobb:

been other times where, I don't I know.

Branden Cobb:

So I don't know.

Branden Cobb:

It can never be 100% sure.

Branden Cobb:

But I'm confident that what I'm Saying proposing is correct and in the best

Branden Cobb:

interest of the company, the best, but I don't, I cannot convince a

Branden Cobb:

CEO or CFO to, believe in me or get the green light to go do something.

Branden Cobb:

and it brings me to why I'm in the DBA now, it brings me why I went and

Branden Cobb:

did an MBA, which was, I hit a wall at some point, I'm like, I need more

Branden Cobb:

knowledge, more skills to be able to.

Branden Cobb:

This and so for what I'm currently experiencing is that, when you get

Branden Cobb:

asked to put together a marketing campaign, a lot of that mix of channels

Branden Cobb:

and how you're going to do the spend.

Branden Cobb:

But what the whole approach of everything on the marketing campaign, a lot of times

Branden Cobb:

that comes from the marketers intuition.

Branden Cobb:

You can't necessarily, say this is for sure going to.

Branden Cobb:

Create this result.

Branden Cobb:

You are proposing it because you think it's going to achieve the goals.

Branden Cobb:

But, and the only way you can go out and get that done is if you get the trust

Branden Cobb:

and the belief from a CEO or CFO, whoever is writing off on that green light.

Branden Cobb:

And but if I get the green light, I feel like it does tend to work.

Branden Cobb:

But, so now I'm working on how do you present more, really good

Branden Cobb:

projections and data to back up why we should do what suggesting to do.

Branden Cobb:

And, but when you hear that from a CEO or CFO, that, that they just think

Branden Cobb:

what you're saying is may not work.

Branden Cobb:

At all be correct.

Branden Cobb:

It really questions yourself like, am I correct on this or am I not correct?

Branden Cobb:

A lot of times I'll go weeks thinking and thinking about it and I'll come back and

Branden Cobb:

I'm like, I still stand by that statement and it's for their best interest,

Branden Cobb:

but it's, but, I guess that's where it's at is who actually knows better?

Branden Cobb:

I think the real result is, or the real answer is that there's

Branden Cobb:

no one way to do everything.

Branden Cobb:

there's a hundred ways to get to the same goal and you just have to figure out ways

Branden Cobb:

to align and work together and stuff.

Tim Winders:

I think one of the struggles there, because I deal with

Tim Winders:

it, I work as an executive coach and I'm in on some of these conversations

Tim Winders:

where we're discussing marketing.

Tim Winders:

I don't consider myself a marketing expert or anything, but I work with

Tim Winders:

leaderships and leadership teams.

Tim Winders:

And I think a lot of it comes down to, we want to know, and this

Tim Winders:

is So many things in business.

Tim Winders:

This is why your math skill, is beneficial.

Tim Winders:

We want to know if we spend X that we're going to get 4X, 10X,

Tim Winders:

hopefully more ROI return on it.

Tim Winders:

And sometimes this is where I'm going back to that confidence level.

Tim Winders:

Sometimes, but sometimes there's variables.

Tim Winders:

I just sat in early this morning on a meeting.

Tim Winders:

This is a vacation resort area that I'm at, and they were cooking through

Tim Winders:

all COVID and all that kind of stuff.

Tim Winders:

And their numbers are off and they were talking about sales and

Tim Winders:

their sales are way, way down.

Tim Winders:

Sales are way down in a lot of areas right now.

Tim Winders:

It's a weird time.

Tim Winders:

We're in a little while I'm probably gonna ask you about your views on some

Tim Winders:

big picture things, but How do you?

Tim Winders:

I guess this is an roi question.

Tim Winders:

How do you really?

Tim Winders:

Attach roi to marketing.

Tim Winders:

How do you overcome?

Tim Winders:

when someone Question.

Tim Winders:

there's so many ways of going here.

Tim Winders:

Cause it's really an ROI question to me, and like you said, there's

Tim Winders:

quite a credibility that's involved.

Tim Winders:

Can you deliver on this?

Tim Winders:

Is this really going to return us or are we just going to spend money?

Tim Winders:

And a lot of people think about marketing, especially social media, it's man,

Tim Winders:

we're just going to flush it down the toilet, never to see it and all that.

Tim Winders:

So what, when someone brings up ROI, what are some things that

Tim Winders:

come to your mind and just have whatever your thoughts are on that?

Branden Cobb:

I'm working on it now.

Branden Cobb:

That's my whole doctorate project that I'm working on, but, is

Branden Cobb:

attribution and proving that ROI.

Branden Cobb:

But with that being said, I think marketers are very good at a first

Branden Cobb:

touch point attribution and the last touch point attribution.

Branden Cobb:

We're not very good at a multi touch point attribution.

Branden Cobb:

crediting everything to the first ad or the first capture of information,

Branden Cobb:

even though there may be many months later of continuing, to continue to

Branden Cobb:

persuade until a purchase is made.

Branden Cobb:

or giving all the credit to the last touchpoint.

Branden Cobb:

So the actual, point, the actual touch that pushes them over the edge

Branden Cobb:

and makes them buy, but we're not able to properly wait and understand

Branden Cobb:

everything that happens in the middle.

Branden Cobb:

so I think we need to get better with that.

Branden Cobb:

Going back to ai, I think AI can help with some of that.

Branden Cobb:

some of their calculations and algorithms and things like that, but with that

Branden Cobb:

being said, I think, that it is very interesting because I've literally had

Branden Cobb:

campaigns or departments and different things that are Profitable returning,

Branden Cobb:

and I'm still being asked that question of like understanding, though, is okay.

Branden Cobb:

It is profitable and it's profitable by this percentage.

Branden Cobb:

But, but what's causing the profit?

Branden Cobb:

Where can we cut or where can we increase and really try to optimize

Branden Cobb:

and make that as efficient as possible.

Branden Cobb:

And so I've had where All right.

Branden Cobb:

Even if the big picture is working, you still have to explain inside

Branden Cobb:

that black box of what's going on inside the inner workings and why?

Branden Cobb:

And yeah, I think it's something that the marketing industry is not good

Branden Cobb:

with a digital wise where it's much easier to attribute and give credit

Branden Cobb:

and track, when it's not digital, it becomes a lot more difficult.

Branden Cobb:

But yeah, this is what I'm working on.

Branden Cobb:

Literally, I'm going to do a thing where you've got it could be 20

Branden Cobb:

variables or any number of variables.

Branden Cobb:

But to make it easy, let's say you have three variables.

Branden Cobb:

You have a TV ad, a radio ad and a social media ad.

Branden Cobb:

What's the total revenue?

Branden Cobb:

You take out the radio ad?

Branden Cobb:

What's the total revenue?

Branden Cobb:

You put the radio ad back in?

Branden Cobb:

What's the total revenue?

Branden Cobb:

And then if you just look at the radio ad by itself, what's the total revenue.

Branden Cobb:

So basically what that's going to tell you is how does the mix or if you're

Branden Cobb:

cooking with a recipe and a mix of ingredients, what does that, that radio

Branden Cobb:

ad do, that makes it greater as a whole than just that ad itself individually,

Branden Cobb:

which is the integrated concept.

Branden Cobb:

Everybody understands it, but you still can't explain it.

Branden Cobb:

It's something that the mark, this is where the marketing industry is going.

Branden Cobb:

You have, we're going to have to get better because people want to know that.

Tim Winders:

The interesting thing about that.

Tim Winders:

I just had a flashback.

Tim Winders:

I just, I had to go to Atlanta, my old hometown, and I was stuck in traffic,

Tim Winders:

which if you're in Atlanta, there's a good chance you're stuck in traffic.

Tim Winders:

And I was driving South and there was this, there's this big smokestack right

Tim Winders:

in downtown Atlanta that they've got a very visible digital bill billboard there.

Tim Winders:

And I know the company that does it, Corey outdoor advertising, cause I worked there.

Tim Winders:

40 years ago in high school when we were first starting the billboard

Tim Winders:

business, but it is a massive digital billboard that they were

Tim Winders:

advertising Miller beer, I think.

Tim Winders:

And of course you can make the change and all that.

Tim Winders:

And I'm sitting there in traffic looking at it going, First of

Tim Winders:

all, how much does it cost?

Tim Winders:

I know it's a very expensive because it is a very prominent display right around

Tim Winders:

the Grady curve of the connector in downtown Atlanta, but then I'm wondering

Tim Winders:

what is the value to Miller, the beer, and I've seen other advertisements

Tim Winders:

there and like you said, it's very difficult to say, which leads to really

Tim Winders:

what you were just talking about, and I don't know if there's a real answer

Tim Winders:

for this and maybe it's a guess, but.

Tim Winders:

How much of what you do, would you put it in the area of science?

Tim Winders:

I'll we'll call it in the general science.

Tim Winders:

And then how much is it just Touch feel art, is there a percentage breakdown?

Tim Winders:

I know you mentioned you're good at math, your storyteller,

Tim Winders:

all that kind of, and creative.

Tim Winders:

I think a lot of people like to get super creative with marketing, but

Tim Winders:

they need more math and science.

Tim Winders:

And then some people are all about testing this, that I lean more towards

Tim Winders:

testing, I'm not as creative, but what are your thoughts, where do you put it?

Branden Cobb:

so I've always had a saying that you can't do marketing without data,

Branden Cobb:

but data doesn't tell the whole story.

Branden Cobb:

Revenue does.

Branden Cobb:

you, what's the percentage?

Branden Cobb:

I think You can analyze, you can put proof behind possibly

Branden Cobb:

50% of marketing, but maybe not.

Branden Cobb:

I think you'd be really happy if you could prove that this is.

Branden Cobb:

but then there's going to be 50% that is the art side of things.

Branden Cobb:

And I think it's just about trying to move that needle where we can prove

Branden Cobb:

it a little bit more, like even on the art side, justifying why the art needs

Branden Cobb:

to be the way the art is on certain elements, just a little bit more.

Branden Cobb:

if you look at different industries, the stock market, if you could take out

Branden Cobb:

all the variables and you could figure out that, based off these variables

Branden Cobb:

that you can predict 10% of, you can understand 10% of how the stock market's

Branden Cobb:

going to move, but 90% of it, you don't know, if you could make that 20%,

Branden Cobb:

now you're very happy or something.

Branden Cobb:

So it's in marketing, like there may be some industries where we know 90%.

Branden Cobb:

And you just, they're just trying to get to that other, that last 10%.

Branden Cobb:

In statistics, they call it the R kind of like R squared.

Branden Cobb:

it's like telling specifically how much is explained by the different

Branden Cobb:

variables you're considering.

Branden Cobb:

And I think in marketing, we don't have anywhere close to the a hundred

Branden Cobb:

percent picture, but we're able to, And that's the goal, is, yeah, trying to get

Branden Cobb:

better, but art is certainly part of it.

Branden Cobb:

And if you don't mind, I want, I wanted to say something more on, and

Branden Cobb:

this goes back to art, but it's also back to the AI conversation, which

Branden Cobb:

is humans have a natural Ability to touch other humans emotions.

Branden Cobb:

we humans go through depression or anxiety or different things and they

Branden Cobb:

have a certain way of being able to communicate verbally and non verbally

Branden Cobb:

that is able to, hit different on a person, then, and that's the art.

Branden Cobb:

And that's the human side that the AI can't do too.

Tim Winders:

And I think that's also going to be the difficult thing to duplicate.

Tim Winders:

And I think that's in the value that we humans need to be able

Tim Winders:

to bring to that, that formula.

Tim Winders:

Brandon, one of the things that I think you're probably in a unique

Tim Winders:

position to speak to is I don't know, maybe trends, what you're

Tim Winders:

seeing big picture that's going on.

Tim Winders:

Just, I don't want to know, I don't know if it's the economy

Tim Winders:

as a whole or something.

Tim Winders:

I'm noticing some interesting trends, where, you know, who you talk to

Tim Winders:

and who you believe, we're a year or so out of, global pandemic and,

Tim Winders:

a lot of people thought we were going to still really be growing.

Tim Winders:

I think.

Tim Winders:

I'm seeing some leveling off with some industries I'm interacting with and,

Tim Winders:

maybe just whatever you want to share about what your views are about some

Tim Winders:

things that are going on with the economy and the world or anything like that.

Tim Winders:

I'm just going to give you a shot here without a very specific question

Tim Winders:

because I think you see a lot of stuff.

Tim Winders:

So what are you seeing?

Branden Cobb:

I see surprisingly, we've been talking about the recession coming

Branden Cobb:

that hasn't, it's came, but it hasn't came like at the same time, we've had

Branden Cobb:

inflation, you have it, maybe everybody.

Branden Cobb:

Things are harder to afford in different ways or less spending power, but

Branden Cobb:

like the spending hasn't stopped the business opportunities haven't stopped.

Branden Cobb:

so that's a little surprising.

Branden Cobb:

I think also in a good way, possibly I don't know, it's mixed

Branden Cobb:

there, but mix that bad and good.

Branden Cobb:

The less spending powers bad, but, the, I think there is a growing divide

Branden Cobb:

of, there's going to continue to be a growing divide, unfortunately, of, of

Branden Cobb:

wealth, of people who, and skills as well, and that's when we're talking

Branden Cobb:

about all this change from, pre COVID, you were working more in office now.

Branden Cobb:

People working virtually, you've got all these new technologies and everything

Branden Cobb:

else, so it's I think those who adapt to the new world are going to do really

Branden Cobb:

well, and those who don't adapt are, there, I think there's just going to

Branden Cobb:

be a divide there, and I think it's also a divide where maybe the lower

Branden Cobb:

side of things are more well taken care of than in the previous past.

Branden Cobb:

things like clothes and, Material goods are probably going to continue

Branden Cobb:

to become more and more affordable.

Branden Cobb:

I think it's Elon Musk who said that eventually all

Branden Cobb:

people can afford all things.

Branden Cobb:

if you think about it, like when iPhone first came out, not

Branden Cobb:

everybody could afford iPhone.

Branden Cobb:

Now everybody can afford iPhone or maybe back in, I remember donating you.

Branden Cobb:

Clothes or food and different things different people and of course, homeless

Branden Cobb:

problems and everything else, but like Clothes have become more affordable most.

Branden Cobb:

there's all the discount stores like people have a lot of things now so I

Branden Cobb:

think the divide will be like you're well taken care of here, but If you're

Branden Cobb:

doing well, you're doing really well.

Branden Cobb:

and, I also, yeah, I don't know.

Branden Cobb:

it's interesting.

Branden Cobb:

I don't know exactly.

Branden Cobb:

Obviously, I don't think anybody does where things are going.

Branden Cobb:

But, I think it's a both a scary but a exciting time

Branden Cobb:

and, you need to keep trying.

Branden Cobb:

You need to keep learning and you need to keep, understanding that the

Branden Cobb:

capitalism that we've always loved.

Branden Cobb:

For us of being able to have mobility up and down and work hard

Branden Cobb:

and achieve results, hopefully will continue to be there.

Branden Cobb:

But, you need to but understand that if you're not giving a full

Branden Cobb:

effort to readjust and relearn and continue to grow, then don't be

Branden Cobb:

upset if you slide down on the scale.

Branden Cobb:

So you need to keep working hard.

Branden Cobb:

And I hopefully you can see the benefits of that.

Tim Winders:

I think the, all that was great info.

Tim Winders:

I think the thing I really loved the most is that people need to continue

Tim Winders:

growing and being open to new things.

Tim Winders:

And, at the age I'm at, I see so many of my peers.

Tim Winders:

That have stopped for some of them going on 20, 30 years, learning

Tim Winders:

new things and doing new things.

Tim Winders:

And, here, my wife and I are, experimenting with some new

Tim Winders:

business things related to using AI to increase some things.

Tim Winders:

So I think that's great, great advice.

Tim Winders:

And I liked the thought there because I do think things are changing and

Tim Winders:

we're not really going to know.

Tim Winders:

I love to think about what the future might look like.

Tim Winders:

But if we were having this conversation in 2015, we never would have projected what

Tim Winders:

happened over the next five or six years.

Tim Winders:

I don't, I wouldn't have, and I think I know this kind of stuff.

Tim Winders:

it's come on, but, Hey, I see that you work, obviously you probably,

Tim Winders:

I guess in the environment that you do your teaching in, is that mostly

Tim Winders:

young people that are just getting started in the marketing world?

Branden Cobb:

I've partnered with a group called UpGrad.

Branden Cobb:

It's a company out of India, like a Coursera.

Branden Cobb:

So basically they have relationships with universities throughout the world

Branden Cobb:

and they offer degree programs in partnership with those universities.

Branden Cobb:

So I teach a marketing MBA class for Deakin University.

Branden Cobb:

It's a top business school in Australia.

Branden Cobb:

And then, there's a Liverpool business school in UK.

Branden Cobb:

so I teach MBAs for, marketing classes for those two.

Branden Cobb:

The majority of the students in them are somewhat younger.

Branden Cobb:

and the majority of the students are Spread throughout the world, probably

Branden Cobb:

in areas that were more traditionally, had less access to education.

Branden Cobb:

so yeah, and there's, and it's not in the areas of where those universities are.

Branden Cobb:

So I don't know if there's one student in Australia.

Branden Cobb:

Who's doing the program with Deacon, and I don't know if there's one pro

Branden Cobb:

student in UK that's doing the program with, with Liverpool Business School.

Branden Cobb:

yeah, that's, I teach 'em on, I'm on Pacific Time, probably the

Branden Cobb:

worst time since it, when you're doing a worldwide, schedule.

Branden Cobb:

Probably the worst like time zone to be in.

Branden Cobb:

Cause we're at the very tail end of things.

Branden Cobb:

And, but I do it at 5 30 AM on some weekends there.

Branden Cobb:

And it ends up being for the majority of the world, an okay time.

Tim Winders:

and so I don't know how much interaction you have, but I guess a

Tim Winders:

question I have related to that is someone who is, let's say newer to marketing

Tim Winders:

and going into it as a profession.

Tim Winders:

What is something, I don't know, it could be one or two things or

Tim Winders:

just a thought mindset, whatever.

Tim Winders:

What's something that they just.

Tim Winders:

Aren't quite getting that they need to get early on in their marketing career.

Tim Winders:

I know a lot of people that are listening in that probably are consider

Tim Winders:

themselves either in marketing or they need to know more about it.

Tim Winders:

What's something that people really miss when they're going into that field?

Branden Cobb:

I think, obviously I think experience beats almost everything,

Branden Cobb:

but the thing is that a lot of times experience can be too specific to that

Branden Cobb:

job, to where like you just continue to do the repetitive task of that job.

Branden Cobb:

And so I.

Branden Cobb:

Really think you need to be and it doesn't have to be a formal

Branden Cobb:

education program doesn't have to be degrees or anything like that.

Branden Cobb:

But there's so much information online and I listen a lot of LinkedIn learning.

Branden Cobb:

So just continuing to play different videos on different topics in

Branden Cobb:

the background through your day.

Branden Cobb:

or audio books and listen to them on hyperspeed and stuff.

Branden Cobb:

You don't have to capture everything and fully understand everything.

Branden Cobb:

Just try to, through repetition, you're going to start to just remember it like

Branden Cobb:

you remember songs through repetition.

Branden Cobb:

But, so I guess where I'm getting at is just because, and I found this

Branden Cobb:

too, is you could be doing a really good job in your job, but then if you

Branden Cobb:

go to another job, like the skills and the marketing that everything is.

Branden Cobb:

It's different in some cases.

Branden Cobb:

So you need to continue to just look at things in a, I like in a big picture.

Branden Cobb:

and you need it because I said, experience beats almost everything

Branden Cobb:

you need to learn by doing.

Branden Cobb:

So just because you're doing stuff in your job doesn't mean you can't

Branden Cobb:

be experimenting outside your job on little experiments of your own.

Branden Cobb:

And however that may be.

Tim Winders:

that's some good info.

Tim Winders:

So the followup to that, we've got a lot of listeners that are leaders or heads

Tim Winders:

of their organization, business owners, some ministry leaders, things like that.

Tim Winders:

And, and marketing is always a topic that comes up around leadership teams.

Tim Winders:

Sometimes it's positive.

Tim Winders:

Sometimes it's not just like most topics, but what are some things and let me.

Tim Winders:

I guess let me ask it this way.

Tim Winders:

First, what are some things that most leaders of an organization miss

Tim Winders:

when it comes to marketing or they're thinking wrong about it or they

Tim Winders:

have a bad attitude or something?

Tim Winders:

What are some things there?

Tim Winders:

And then I've got a follow up related to that about what you do when you step

Tim Winders:

into an organization, maybe initially.

Tim Winders:

But first, let's go to that big picture.

Tim Winders:

what are people missing or messing up on related to, to marketing?

Branden Cobb:

I think a lot of people think of marketing as just the

Branden Cobb:

promotion of, products or services.

Branden Cobb:

And, there's always been the, i many years, but a long time whether there's

Branden Cobb:

been a concept or a model of that.

Branden Cobb:

There's four Ps in marketing.

Branden Cobb:

now some people have broke it down to seven Ps and different things,

Branden Cobb:

but I teach the four Ps of marketing in those classes, which are.

Branden Cobb:

Prop being involved with the product, both making sure there's a product

Branden Cobb:

market fit, but also making, work, understanding what the consumers needs

Branden Cobb:

are and making sure the product adjust to be the need to consumers needs.

Branden Cobb:

So product price, understanding all the price elasticity of consumers, choosing

Branden Cobb:

the right price, choosing the right, just overall strategy with price, and

Branden Cobb:

then place where you're going to be.

Branden Cobb:

for example, if you want to be a high end product.

Branden Cobb:

Luxury product, then you're not going to go to Walmart, but if you

Branden Cobb:

want to be selling high quantity, then maybe you go to Walmart.

Branden Cobb:

or that goes the same way to Amazon.

Branden Cobb:

Like you got to think of where you're being sold, what that

Branden Cobb:

puts in the mind of consumers.

Branden Cobb:

And so your place, and then finally there's the promotion and that's all

Branden Cobb:

the ads and the, social media and all that, that, that kind of stuff.

Branden Cobb:

So I think a lot of people just look at marketing as promotion and, and.

Branden Cobb:

And they're too short minded with, when marketing starts and ends, a lot of

Branden Cobb:

times, Oh, the products already made the price already chose in the place

Branden Cobb:

already chosen, just go promote it.

Branden Cobb:

And then also the don't do the sale of it because you're just

Branden Cobb:

in this little piece here.

Branden Cobb:

And really, I think marketing, starts at the very beginning and marketing really.

Branden Cobb:

Truly never ends because even after the sale, you're trying to create

Branden Cobb:

loyalty trying to create repurchases.

Branden Cobb:

and so to me marketing Goes over the entire business, cycle or the entire

Branden Cobb:

purchase buyer's journey there from start to finish and even after and so

Branden Cobb:

I think you just need to expand your concept of or not anyone but it's

Branden Cobb:

probably the biggest misconception is that not expanding the concept that

Branden Cobb:

marketing is a much wider thing and really integrated in all aspects of the

Branden Cobb:

business and including internal as well.

Branden Cobb:

So internal mark, and retaining, employees and motivation of

Branden Cobb:

employees and everything else.

Branden Cobb:

So

Tim Winders:

had a thought that triggered that I had a client sometime

Tim Winders:

back that I consider this a mistake.

Tim Winders:

I'll let you be the judge of that, but they knew that they

Tim Winders:

needed to generate more business.

Tim Winders:

They had been primarily probably word of mouth referrals up to that

Tim Winders:

point and had done very well, but they decided that they needed to up

Tim Winders:

their leads and people coming in.

Tim Winders:

And so they're.

Tim Winders:

First engagement was with someone who specialized in social media

Tim Winders:

and very specifically Facebook ads.

Tim Winders:

I, they were very narrow and truthfully, it was not a good match.

Tim Winders:

I actually started working with the leadership team shortly after that.

Tim Winders:

I go, you know, I don't think that's where your audience is.

Tim Winders:

I don't, that's not the place or, where you need to be doing your promotion.

Tim Winders:

And they've backed off.

Tim Winders:

I think LinkedIn is a place, but I think people are very narrow and sometimes

Tim Winders:

their thoughts about marketing and my observations, maybe it's where I.

Tim Winders:

Come in and my seat at the table, but you obviously many times need to, as

Tim Winders:

you step into the organization or have a first interaction or you're brought in as

Tim Winders:

a fractional, C level or something like that need to evaluate those type things.

Tim Winders:

How do you do all that?

Tim Winders:

What's the best first start?

Tim Winders:

This is me getting into What a business owners need to be doing right now,

Tim Winders:

especially if they're maybe very narrow and they've had I hate the term.

Tim Winders:

They got burned.

Tim Winders:

We got burned.

Tim Winders:

Somebody sold us facebook ads, which I'd again That's a whole nother topic.

Tim Winders:

But anyway, what are some thoughts?

Tim Winders:

Does that make any sense?

Tim Winders:

And how do you respond when I bring that up?

Branden Cobb:

I think it makes a lot of sense.

Branden Cobb:

I, how you go in and examine a situation in the current infrastructure and the

Branden Cobb:

current processes and systems, is going to relate to what I'm going to say,

Branden Cobb:

how you do what I think the ideal, arrangement is, in my opinion, you need

Branden Cobb:

to have a very good, marketing generalist.

Branden Cobb:

General manager of marketing basically, of sorts.

Branden Cobb:

And you need to try, to, I like to outsource a lot of things initially.

Branden Cobb:

keep it pretty skeleton, of an outline there until.

Branden Cobb:

A concepts proven and then start to bring it in house.

Branden Cobb:

whether you're working with the cost, whether you're generating,

Branden Cobb:

leads in a certain way, and then a call center is working on it.

Branden Cobb:

We'll start with outsourcing to a call center and letting them work it.

Branden Cobb:

And then if it starts to work, yeah, you are losing profit margin.

Branden Cobb:

Paying the outsourcing, but it's a lower risk.

Branden Cobb:

Then you start as each thing is proven.

Branden Cobb:

You start to bring it in house more and more.

Branden Cobb:

and start to outsource your graphic design outsource.

Branden Cobb:

Your copyright.

Branden Cobb:

But as it start as you start to see the value, then start to bring it in house

Branden Cobb:

where you've hit past the break even point that you're doing it in enough

Branden Cobb:

quantity that it's more efficient and more effective to bring it in house.

Branden Cobb:

But I think that all starts with having that general person and marketing,

Branden Cobb:

that's in house a very general, well rounded, marketer because they're

Branden Cobb:

able to select And deploy the right, the right strategies at the right

Branden Cobb:

time or work with the right people.

Branden Cobb:

And if you have the right person, they probably have connections that

Branden Cobb:

are throughout the, all your needs.

Branden Cobb:

and I guess that kind of goes into how I've been coming into companies.

Branden Cobb:

And is I come in and I figure out what they need right there.

Branden Cobb:

And I'm bringing in the connections, making the connections, whether

Branden Cobb:

they're in house out of the house, whatever they can choose through

Branden Cobb:

time to bring them in house.

Branden Cobb:

Keep them out of house, I think you need to be a lean and, you need to be

Branden Cobb:

quick to understand that, the skill sets of one month may not be the same skill

Branden Cobb:

sets you need of the next month, and your marketing and you need to be able

Branden Cobb:

to adjust when you got that specialist, like you were talking of maybe the social

Branden Cobb:

media person, but they were very specific.

Branden Cobb:

there's not a lot of adjustment that can be made month to month

Branden Cobb:

with that because they're just able to do what they do right there.

Tim Winders:

and they don't, some of them don't even speak the language

Tim Winders:

if it's a little bit of a complex, product or whatever that's being sold.

Tim Winders:

you mentioned something that I want you to give us a little more info on, and

Tim Winders:

I know that, the easy answer would be, you need to get someone like Brandon,

Tim Winders:

because you're the marketing generalist.

Tim Winders:

But I see a lot of leaders, a lot of people running organizations,

Tim Winders:

and it could be companies that are attempting to scale, they're moving

Tim Winders:

from a solopreneur to, or maybe a mom and pop to a little bit larger.

Tim Winders:

They're starting to get a team around them and they're wanting

Tim Winders:

to continue growing and scaling.

Tim Winders:

I believe that a lot of them don't know the questions to ask to know if they're

Tim Winders:

really dealing with the generalist or not.

Tim Winders:

It's like they're, they think that marketing is social media or

Tim Winders:

they think that, and some of them are really, they will tell you.

Tim Winders:

I just don't want to think about the marketing.

Tim Winders:

It's so confusing and I don't like social media and which lets you

Tim Winders:

know, some clues about them, but how can someone know if they're dealing

Tim Winders:

with a generalist or a specialist?

Tim Winders:

And I don't know if there's questions to ask.

Tim Winders:

I don't know if you could think of some things cause I would love for us to

Tim Winders:

have a few questions here that leader of the organization could say, you know

Tim Winders:

what, tell me more about this or what do you know about this so that I know

Tim Winders:

I'm dealing with more of a generalist.

Branden Cobb:

I would as a business leader, not say, oh, I need this per, I

Branden Cobb:

need a social media statement, or I need, I would talk to a marketer and ask them,

Branden Cobb:

or te not ask them, tell them your goals.

Branden Cobb:

What are you trying to achieve?

Branden Cobb:

what do you need to happen?

Branden Cobb:

And it may not be that you're describing like.

Branden Cobb:

I need this and it's specifically not asking that I need this marketing thing

Branden Cobb:

to generate this It's what do you need?

Branden Cobb:

what are the final results?

Branden Cobb:

What are you trying to achieve?

Branden Cobb:

What are the real goals and then you're asking the marketer how

Branden Cobb:

would you what strategies tactics?

Branden Cobb:

different elements would you Employ deploy to in order to achieve this.

Branden Cobb:

How would you get help get us there?

Branden Cobb:

And what resources would you need to get there and see what their answer is?

Branden Cobb:

Because I think that answer will tell you if they're A specialist or a generalist,

Branden Cobb:

and also, it goes, that's the tough thing because it goes back to then

Branden Cobb:

you, how do you know that's a for sure thing that what they're saying is going

Branden Cobb:

to work out and do you put your trust in them or do you, but I think that's

Branden Cobb:

the way I would approach it is really.

Branden Cobb:

you're coming to a marketer because you need marketer, you need marketing help,

Branden Cobb:

not because you're saying, how to, unless you have a deep experience in marketing,

Branden Cobb:

not to say Hey, I need, I'm trying to deploy this tactic or this strategy to

Branden Cobb:

achieve this, just your goal and trying to understand how they may get you there

Branden Cobb:

because you may interview five different people and get five different views.

Branden Cobb:

But that will also, even if you don't hire any of those five, give you a

Branden Cobb:

better, Group of options of how to maybe what specialness you need to go

Branden Cobb:

out and hire to make it happen too.

Branden Cobb:

So

Tim Winders:

so this is going to be me countering the question I just asked.

Tim Winders:

I'm going to ask you, is there a platform, a placement or

Tim Winders:

something now that you really like?

Tim Winders:

I mean, you're not going to force all your clients into it, but it's like, boy, you,

Tim Winders:

you really like what's going on to get the word out about a product and all here.

Tim Winders:

And we know it's not for everybody.

Tim Winders:

This is not a saying this is where you go, but is there.

Tim Winders:

Placement that you're like going, this is a pretty good way to get a message

Tim Winders:

or a product out to the world right now.

Tim Winders:

So that is counter the question I just asked.

Tim Winders:

I want to totally say how ironic it is that I asked that after

Tim Winders:

asking the other question.

Branden Cobb:

at the grandest scale, I think, which is obvious, but just

Branden Cobb:

utilizing all that the internet has to offer because, where I was going

Branden Cobb:

to go with this is that the answer is no, because it is audience specific,

Branden Cobb:

very audience specific, we launched, wheelchair brand and we're looking

Branden Cobb:

at TV ads, in traditional cable, but that's because of that audience of still

Branden Cobb:

older audience still on traditional cable versus you've got, other people

Branden Cobb:

on streaming or you've got, if you're going for a younger generation,

Branden Cobb:

you go to tick tock or something like, it's not going to be the same.

Branden Cobb:

it's just not, but if you, in the grand scheme of things, I would utilize that.

Branden Cobb:

All that the internet has to offer because of its tracking abilities because of its

Branden Cobb:

ROI proving abilities, even though it may not be technically the most efficient

Branden Cobb:

synergy by just doing internet if you're just starting off with something you're

Branden Cobb:

trying to grow, that's the way you can make sure that your dollars are returning.

Branden Cobb:

But no, the answer is no.

Branden Cobb:

I mean, if you're a local, if you're a local business, you

Branden Cobb:

want to really get deep into your local community offline too.

Branden Cobb:

And you want to be, and if you're a nationwide business, it's, it's too,

Branden Cobb:

and I'm sorry to say that it's just, it's too, it would be impossible

Branden Cobb:

to give one answer that meets.

Branden Cobb:

All business, and that

Tim Winders:

I think you just helped me with the question that someone

Tim Winders:

should ask if they're looking for a generalist, because you gave

Tim Winders:

a good generalist answer that.

Tim Winders:

so those that were listening to the question earlier, looking for the

Tim Winders:

questions that might've been one, it's man, what's your favorite?

Tim Winders:

And you really did a good job of not giving me one saying it's

Tim Winders:

very specific to the situation.

Tim Winders:

Hey, Brandon, almost my final question here, looking out.

Tim Winders:

Short term future, longer term, whatever.

Tim Winders:

What are some things that are super exciting for you as far

Tim Winders:

as the marketing world goes?

Tim Winders:

And then what are some things that kind of bug you or are concerning you?

Tim Winders:

And then there's just a few things we'll do to wrap up here, but

Tim Winders:

just so big picture marketing, you really like the thought of blank.

Tim Winders:

And then something that's bothering you a little bit about the industry.

Branden Cobb:

I really like the thought of, making, consumer experiences, more

Branden Cobb:

enjoyable and the focus on the consumer's journey through and how to make eliminate

Branden Cobb:

friction, how to make the experience more smooth and easy and fun and enjoyable.

Branden Cobb:

And, and.

Branden Cobb:

Which creates loyalty, creates referrals, creates reviews, there's a lot of things.

Branden Cobb:

So I really like the concept of experience.

Branden Cobb:

I was with a company that had a chief experience officer

Branden Cobb:

that like, that was, the focus.

Branden Cobb:

So I think, I think experiences is, very good.

Branden Cobb:

And actually even going back when I said, I think Elon said, everybody

Branden Cobb:

will be able to afford everything.

Branden Cobb:

The only thing that would be different at some point would be, experiences or.

Branden Cobb:

you, yeah, you're, the brand, you could say, behind it, but the experience or

Branden Cobb:

the emotions and that kind of thing.

Branden Cobb:

yeah, I think experience is exciting.

Branden Cobb:

something I don't like with marketing is probably the herd mentality of sorts.

Branden Cobb:

where, A lot of companies are feeling because another company does

Branden Cobb:

something that they have to do it to or they're going to get left behind.

Branden Cobb:

and there may be some truth to that.

Branden Cobb:

And that may also be, it may be, in a way, as long as the movements are good

Branden Cobb:

movements, good that everybody quickly But, I don't like, I, I was at a, at a

Branden Cobb:

conference of a lot of like top, fortune 500 companies, CMOs and different things,

Branden Cobb:

just listening into them and stuff.

Branden Cobb:

And it was just very interesting that there was a lot of, it

Branden Cobb:

was just a lot of whether they.

Branden Cobb:

Believe or feel this is the right thing to do or the right direction

Branden Cobb:

for their company They have to follow what others are following and

Branden Cobb:

I just don't think that's The herd mentality in anything in life is good.

Tim Winders:

Yeah, there are a lot of people out there that are not

Tim Winders:

doing a lot of original things.

Tim Winders:

They're just copying other people and they're probably getting the

Tim Winders:

results to match up with that.

Tim Winders:

Maybe they're successful at it.

Tim Winders:

But anyway, great response there.

Tim Winders:

Brandon, I appreciate it.

Tim Winders:

Hey, listen, let's just say that someone wanted to connect with you, get some

Tim Winders:

more info, maybe bring you in as.

Tim Winders:

That marketing person, or just wanted to connect after they listen in on this.

Tim Winders:

Where do you want to send people?

Tim Winders:

you got any resources or anything that, people might can get a hold of?

Tim Winders:

And then I've got a final question I'll ask before we wrap up.

Branden Cobb:

you can find me on linkedin brandon cobb d r a n d e n m c o b t

Branden Cobb:

you can go to my website marketingexec.

Branden Cobb:

us and I would encourage you to reach out on either of those There's an email

Branden Cobb:

on the website, there's a, message me through LinkedIn, please connect.

Branden Cobb:

And then also, just like being here on this podcast, I try to go on a

Branden Cobb:

variety of podcasts, and I try to cover a wide range of topics that

Branden Cobb:

don't make any two the exact same.

Branden Cobb:

And so I would just say, go to YouTube, go to Apple Podcasts or Spotify,

Branden Cobb:

wherever you listen to your podcasts, and maybe just search my name and

Branden Cobb:

try to listen to some other podcasts.

Branden Cobb:

And then if it looks like maybe there's a fit, or you want to, follow

Branden Cobb:

up question on a specific topic.

Branden Cobb:

send me a message.

Branden Cobb:

I'd be happy to chat.

Tim Winders:

Very good.

Tim Winders:

Thanks for that, Brandon.

Tim Winders:

Hey, we're Seek, Go Create.

Tim Winders:

I'm gonna let you choose one of those words that resonates more, means more.

Tim Winders:

and why, which word do you choose?

Branden Cobb:

I would say go.

Branden Cobb:

because, a book when you had gave me the heads up.

Branden Cobb:

You're going to ask this question at the end.

Branden Cobb:

And I, I was thinking right away and I like all the words.

Branden Cobb:

I like all the words, but, go is because, Got it.

Branden Cobb:

A book that came right to mind when you, between those three words is there's

Branden Cobb:

a Steve Harvey book, called Jump, and it's this called, it's basically the

Branden Cobb:

concepts like you just take a jump and you're gonna, catch your parachute on

Branden Cobb:

the way down, or you're gonna figure it out on the way, and, I think that,

Branden Cobb:

trying to have everything correct or right before you fully jump or go,

Branden Cobb:

is gonna prevent you from, A lot of experiencing a lot of things that you

Branden Cobb:

would experience and figure out along.

Branden Cobb:

So I think, just go.

Tim Winders:

Very good.

Tim Winders:

Yeah, I love that word go.

Tim Winders:

I love all three words, obviously, but I love that word go.

Tim Winders:

Thank you, Brandon, man I appreciate you joining us here I think we've

Tim Winders:

given some folks some great value just in the way they need to think about

Tim Winders:

marketing and maybe some action steps But I think definitely some concepts

Tim Winders:

that they need to think about share this episode with folks if you've listened

Tim Winders:

in I know, business owners, leaders of organizations, please share this episode.

Tim Winders:

That's a great way that people get exposed to new podcast and

Tim Winders:

get some great information.

Tim Winders:

We have new episodes here every Monday until next time continue being

About the Podcast

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Seek Go Create
Redefining Success in Leadership, Business & Ministry

About your host

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Tim Winders

Tim Winders is a faith driven executive coach and author with over 40 years of experience in leadership, business, and ministry. Through his personal journey of redefining success, he has gained valuable insights on how to align beliefs with work and lead with purpose. He is committed to helping others do the same, running a coaching business that helps leaders, leadership teams, business owners, and entrepreneurs to align their beliefs with their work and redefine success.

In addition to his coaching business, Tim is also the host of the SeekGoCreate podcast and author of the book Coach: A Story of Success Redefined, which provides guidance for those looking to redefine success and align their beliefs with their work. With his extensive background, unique perspective and strengths in strategic thinking, relationship building, and problem-solving, Tim is well-suited to help clients navigate through difficult times and achieve their goals.