From Street Kid to International Teacher: Dr. John Demartini on the Power of Love & Gratitude

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Dr. John Demartini: Now you can actually love that individual because you're not

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putting them above you or below you.

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They're not on pedestals or pits, they're in your heart.

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And that love, is profoundly impactful and helps transform

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relationships, transform business.

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Hello everyone.

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Welcome to the Seek Go Create podcast.

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This is where we challenge the conventional definitions of

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success and explore stories of in leadership, business, and in ministry.

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And we are going to challenge those conventional definitions today.

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I can guarantee you, I am excited and I have the honor of interviewing Dr.

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John Demartini and he has got such an extensive bio.

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He's a human behavior expert, a polymath, and an internationally published author.

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There's a lot more to what he has, but he has so many things that we're

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going to enjoy discussing related to this topic of redefining success.

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Dr.

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John Demartini, welcome to Seek Go Create.

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Dr. John Demartini: thank you for having me.

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I've been looking forward to it.

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that was a super short bio that I just gave there and

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I know there's a lot more to it.

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The reason is almost got overwhelmed when I was reading through your bio.

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I didn't want to spend half the show with it, but let's pretend we just bump into

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each other, and someone asked you what you do, how do you typically respond?

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Someone who's got such a wide, diverse background is you do.

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Dr. John Demartini: I'm an educator and a researcher and

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I teach and I travel the world.

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That's it.

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I research, write, travel, teach, educate in the field of human behavior and helping

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people achieve whatever it is inside their life that they want to create.

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That's very good.

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And I want to, this is a unique thing.

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The audience typically knows that I'm a nomad traveler coming to them from

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my, quote unquote, studio in the RV.

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You are also in a different way.

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Tell us a little bit about that.

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Dr. John Demartini: my primary residence is a ship.

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So I live on a private, a large private ship, let's put it that way.

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And, sail around the world,

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Interesting.

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Dr. John Demartini: over the world.

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so you're traveling and all that.

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All right.

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I've got to ask a, just a travel question.

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cool spots.

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Some of the places, again, name a place or two that you,

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it really nourishes your soul.

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Are you just like, boy, this is a spot that I wish not everyone

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knew about it, but everyone needs to know about this spot.

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Dr. John Demartini: I've been to a lot of spots.

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I've been to 194 countries.

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I, I, I love, and I'm going back to Antarctica in, Christmas time.

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And so that's an exceptional space.

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If you've never been to Antarctica and you want to go out on a Zodiac.

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and go and interact with the life that's there, that's an experience

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of a lifetime, I really believe.

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that was the place where I did a live performance black tie affair

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to about five million penguins.

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And is that, can we find that recording somewhere?

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Is that somewhere available?

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Dr. John Demartini: I wish I did.

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I got a picture.

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That's about it.

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I don't have a recording of it.

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It was a bit windy and, the cackling from all the penguins is pretty

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loud, but I made a commitment to go and speak to people on that,

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that, that part of the world.

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I got to speak also to a group there, but I just wanted to, for fun, I just

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went out and got them in the background and I was doing a presentation for fun.

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Yeah, the penguins.

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that could have been one of the best or most interesting

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audience, I guess you had.

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there's so many, and we could spend time on the travel, but what I want

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us to dive into is you have such a vast and diverse, I guess experience.

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and I think the first thing I want to do is I want to start with

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something that I don't see very often.

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And that is someone who uses the term polymath.

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to describe themselves.

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Maybe I don't run in those circles.

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Maybe I sometimes use the term, and I know this isn't exactly correct,

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but generalist, someone who has wide ranging, vast knowledge on a lot of

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different topics, as opposed to our world seems to revolve a lot around what

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I call specialists, people that target things and go deep into one thing.

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Talk a little bit about You calling yourself a polymath,

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how did that come to be?

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and why is that important to the conversation that we're having here?

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Dr. John Demartini: When I was a young boy, I had, learning challenges.

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I started going to a speech pathologist when I was a year and a half.

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I was not pronouncing words properly.

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I had dyslexia.

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And by the time I got into first grade, I was told by my teacher,

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I would never be able to read or write or communicate effectively.

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So I ended up leaving school, became a street kid picked up surfing, which

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is not the surf capital of Texas.

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So I, hitchhiked when I was 14 out to California, down to Mexico and 15, I moved

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to Hawaii and I was a big wave rider.

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And, I nearly died and met a gentleman one night at a class.

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In the recovery process that inspired me to believe that I had learning

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challenges and someday be able to read and write and communicate effectively.

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That one night, I was such an inspiring moment.

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I had a vision.

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In fact, I have a picture of this because somebody painted it of me standing in

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front of a million people speaking.

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Which is the complete epitome opposite of what I was being like, cause I

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didn't even read a book to them.

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And then I decided that I was going to somehow overcome my learning problems.

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with the help of my mom, cause I tried to go back to school and I failed

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again, with the help of my mom, I went to a dictionary and I started

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reading a dictionary and memorizing 30 words a day to grow my vocabulary.

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And my mom would test me on those 30 words.

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And I grew my vocabulary in two years, 20, 000 words, which is more

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than the majority of people have.

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And then I, once I learned how to get the words and pronounce them and

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practice, I was able to start to read.

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And it was the most inspiring thing in the world to be able to read and take

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a person's life and summarize it in a book and then stand on their shoulders.

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So I ended up starting to read voluminously, like 20 hours a day.

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Because I didn't know I could, I was told I would never.

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And when I found out I could, it was like an amazing gift.

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I also, at the time I wanted to become a teacher.

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And I want to be intelligent because I never think I was going to be.

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And I want to amass a body of knowledge that was most concise background.

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I wanted to study every discipline known, so I would have a body of

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knowledge that I could rely on.

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So I went to the dictionary and I literally got a list of every known

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different discipline and ology you could study, chemistry and

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mathematics, physics, you name it, astronomy, cosmology, astrophysics.

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And I made a list of it.

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And I.

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I realized that a PhD would read about a hundred books in

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each of these fields, at least.

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And so I made a commitment to read a hundred books in every different

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discipline, which has turned out to be now 31, 000 books, over 300 disciplines,

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because I wanted to understand.

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What was the common laws, the common principles that would stand the

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test of time in each of those areas?

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Cause there is, there are principles that you stand across.

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They may have different terminology and different fields, but it's the same basic

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principle, like the law of the one, the many, the law of similars and differences.

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And so I want to build a body of knowledge that I could share with people that I

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could rely on that had substance to be able to make a contribution, as a teacher.

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And.

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That's how it started.

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And I still to this day, read every single day, seven days a week I'm

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reading and I'm writing and I'm speaking seven days a week pretty well.

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so that was my dream to travel the world.

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Go to every country in the face of the earth, share information that I felt

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could be a value in maximizing human awareness potential and help people

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live extraordinary and inspired lives.

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That was my dream because I felt the night I met the gentleman that

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inspired me that what he did for me, I'd like to do for others.

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So that's been my mission.

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I've been on a mission 51 years now.

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November will be 51 years and I do it every day and I can't think of

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anything else I'd rather be doing.

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So that's why I'm a teacher, researcher, writer and traveler.

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I'm so glad I asked the question that way, because I think

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it gave you, it, first of all, it gave me a lot of clues into some

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directions I would like for us to go.

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And one of the, we've got a number of themes here at Seek Go Create,

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and one of these is just this.

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This aspect of redefining what success means and the question that came to

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me as you were just talking I want to ask this because i'm intrigued by it.

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It sounds as if you were Forced out of the traditional education system At some

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point and is that the right word forced would that be a okay way of saying it,

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Dr. John Demartini: Yeah.

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The teacher, yeah, I ended up dropping out and leaving school.

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And, I'm grateful for that because I wish I could meet the teacher that

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told me I would never read, write or communicate, but she was up in age when I

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was in first grade, never saw her again.

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So I would thank her because she actually created the void that became the values.

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And, yeah, I was, I didn't have to, I didn't get entrenched in the drone

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training that many people get entrenched in and become part of the sheep.

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I, When I was living on the streets, I got to meet some

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amazing people that were different.

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And I'm very grateful for those experiences.

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I even met Howard Hughes when I was 14 years old.

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So these are the type of, I met all kinds of characters, Timothy Leary.

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And a lot of rock and roll leaders, band leaders.

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I met some interesting characters living on the street.

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So it was a different beat, it wasn't the mainstream thinking process.

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And I'm grateful that I have that because I think that opened up a doorway to

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ask new sets of questions that most people never take the time to ask.

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And the thing I guess that fascinates me about that is

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that both my parents were educators.

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So I'm not anti our education system that we have in first

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world or the United States.

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However, it seems as if there's a path that people go down that

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stay within that education system.

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And it's usually towards specialization, it's usually toward a certain

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definition of what success looks like, which is one of the things we

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attempt to bust up a little bit here.

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And it sounds as if.

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You were moved out of it and it led you down this fascinating path.

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Give me the ages again.

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When did you leave the school system or when were you, when did

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you decide to leave or whatever?

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And then when did you meet this gentleman that had such a big impact on your future?

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Dr. John Demartini: When I was 13, I, left home.

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I became a street kid.

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At 14, I, I hitchhiked.

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from Houston, Texas, from Freeport, Houston, because I was at the

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beach all the time, to California.

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And I lived in Huntington beach up and down the Southern California area.

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And then down into Mexico, I snuck into Mexico illegally.

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They didn't have a wall yet and, got in and out of there without

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ever getting any paperwork, but I just wanted to go surfing.

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And, it was, this is in the sixties.

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So this was along here at hippie surfer type days.

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And I panhandled enough money in Huntington beach

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to get a flight to Hawaii.

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It was 86 bucks in those days.

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And then I was over there and I lived under a bridge and then

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in a park bench and then a park bathroom and an abandoned car.

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And then I finally kept social climbing and got into a tent.

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And, so I was, that was all the way until 17 and right almost to 18.

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And I met this teacher, right a week before my 18th birthday.

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And in one night, one hour, one man just absolutely blew the socks off

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me and made me think differently.

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he said that we, what we think about, what we visualize, what we

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affirm, what we feel and what we take actions on, determine our destiny.

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And that, you want to set goals for yourself, your family, your

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community, your city, your state, your nation, your world and beyond

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for 100, 120 years and start living by design instead of living by duty.

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most people are deontologic and living by duty and doing what everybody

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else thinks they should be doing and living by imperatives instead

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of living by indicatives and going after what they really dream about and

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organizing and prioritizing your life.

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That was a major breakthrough for me.

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I, nobody told me that.

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I just, and I decided that I was going to figure out a way of, learning how to read.

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I used to have people read to me.

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So the thing that's interesting, cause, and this is so

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appropriate because human motivation is one of the foundations that I

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read as I did some study on you, were you desiring and craving to get

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out of the situation you were in?

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were you someone who just, was it total happenstance

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that you bumped into this guy?

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Was there a divine guidance that was going on, some spiritual thing?

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I'm.

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I'm sure you put thought into it because it's actually been

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catalytic for your entire career.

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Dr. John Demartini: I was expanding my consciousness through all kinds of

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ah, so now we have some clues.

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You said it was the sixties, right?

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Dr. John Demartini: Yeah.

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I, I was doing the magic mushrooms and I was doing the love service and

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dedication and I was doing all the things that would add color to life.

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And I nearly died.

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I ended up having, let's put it this way.

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I really died.

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I was surfing a very big wave and I nearly died.

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And, I ended up passing out in a parking lot, passed out in a parking lot.

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and was next thing I knew, three years, three and a half days

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later, I found myself in my tent.

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So somehow I remember how I got there, but somebody put me

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in my, they knew where I was.

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And then, a lady found me in the tent and helped me clean up the tent.

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Cause it was, I had a catharsis without knowing it while I was unconscious.

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And, She helped clean it up and took me to a health food store where I

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met this Afro guy that looked like Jimi Hendrix, this albino Afro guy.

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And he looked at me and he saw me with these spasms because I had a lot of

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spasms from material that I'd taken.

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And, he said, you need to take a yoga class, man, and learn

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how to have mind over body.

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So I saw on this little Vigor health food store in Haleiwa,

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Hawaii on the North shore.

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I saw this little flyer and said, Paul C.

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Bragg, special guest speaker at so and so yoga class.

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And I knew the word yoga.

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I could see word yoga.

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And I knew that word.

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And, something said go there.

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So I went to a yoga class, and I wasn't taking yoga, I was not into

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meditation or anything like that at that time, but that night, when he

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spoke, was inspiring, and he took us through this guided imagery meditation

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experience where I saw a vision.

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And, that vision is still with me.

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I, if you would like, I can show it to you.

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Yeah.

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It'd be fascinating during that.

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Yeah.

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For those that are watching video, there might be some people listening

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to audio, but we do have this on video, so that'll be fascinating.

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so you did go through some, was it, did you have a near death experience or

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was it a, you almost died experience?

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It's hard to say.

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Dr. John Demartini: I don't know if I would have died.

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I didn't go into a death.

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I don't know.

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I was just unconscious.

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I have no idea.

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I was in a tent by myself, unconscious for three and a half days.

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Somebody found me cause I heard me came out of, I made noise.

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Apparently she found me, this lady in the jungle.

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The reason why,

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Dr. John Demartini: I can find this.

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you know, while you're looking for that, the

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reason I bring that up is that, my father passed away last December.

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My wife's mother is, her health is not great.

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And my wife recently has gotten on a kick of reading a lot of

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books on near death experience.

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She's really been studying.

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It's something we discussed quite a bit.

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and from us as followers of Christ and Christians, we

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were always fascinated with.

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The what afterlife and eternity and things like that.

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And so that's why I was curious if, but it sounds like

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Dr. John Demartini: I didn't have, I didn't have this

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mystical spiritual experience.

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I

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no walk into the light, but you were close

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Dr. John Demartini: I didn't see, no,

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to

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Dr. John Demartini: I was surfing.

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A very big wave is about 40 foot.

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And I went over the falls and my board was smashed and I was.

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I didn't think I was going to make it.

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I found up, up onto the beach.

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I came into, I hitchhiked into Haleiwa, went into an IGA supermarket and had this

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unbelievable strange thing for buttermilk.

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I never drank buttermilk in my life, but I went and just grabbed it and started

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guzzling it right out of the thing.

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And then I started getting dizzy and I passed out in the

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front of the IGA supermarket there on the Kamehameha highway.

Tim Winders: 00:18:11

somebody's going to think that buttermilk is

Tim Winders: 00:18:13

the secret to all of this.

Tim Winders: 00:18:15

They're going to go, Oh my gosh, it's buttermilk.

Tim Winders: 00:18:17

I just want to make sure that people know, I don't, we don't think it's

Tim Winders: 00:18:19

Dr. John Demartini: this is the vision.

Tim Winders: 00:18:22

This is the vision I saw that night.

Tim Winders: 00:18:25

Fascinating.

Tim Winders: 00:18:26

So you're up on a podium, looks like in some form of an international setting with

Tim Winders: 00:18:34

Dr. John Demartini: it's called, it's a painting by Andrew Tisker.

Tim Winders: 00:18:37

What happened was, I was speaking in Melbourne, Australia, about

Tim Winders: 00:18:42

maybe 1, 600 people, 1, 500 people, something like that.

Tim Winders: 00:18:45

And, I was telling a story about the journey.

Tim Winders: 00:18:47

They asked me about it, and I told them the story about

Tim Winders: 00:18:49

how I got into being speaking.

Tim Winders: 00:18:52

And in the back of the room was this artist, and he came forward

Tim Winders: 00:18:55

and he says, I was inspired and brought to tears by your story.

Tim Winders: 00:18:59

And I said, thank you.

Tim Winders: 00:19:00

And he said, I would like to paint it.

Tim Winders: 00:19:03

I'd like to paint what you said.

Tim Winders: 00:19:06

And he, as a gift, painted that.

Tim Winders: 00:19:10

And the name of the painting is a man on a mission with a vision and a message.

Tim Winders: 00:19:14

And it's got an iconic building from every major city around

Tim Winders: 00:19:17

the world in the background.

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And it's about sharing a message to the world.

Tim Winders: 00:19:22

And he took a picture of me the way I looked at the time he did it.

Tim Winders: 00:19:26

It was not when I was 17, but he put that picture in front of it.

Tim Winders: 00:19:31

But I said that I envisioned myself on this balcony speaking

Tim Winders: 00:19:34

to people as far as I could see.

Tim Winders: 00:19:37

And it was probably some delusion at the time, but that's what I saw.

Tim Winders: 00:19:42

So I shared what I saw and he painted it and it sits in my office.

Tim Winders: 00:19:46

It's a five foot by four foot painting.

Tim Winders: 00:19:47

It's a magnificent painting that he sent and sent as a gift to my office.

Tim Winders: 00:19:52

He's a famous painter in Australia.

Tim Winders: 00:19:54

Wow.

Tim Winders: 00:19:54

Fascinating.

Tim Winders: 00:19:55

And I love when we get glimpses from visions and things like that, but

Tim Winders: 00:20:00

how, give me some timeframes here.

Tim Winders: 00:20:03

So you had that situation, you had that vision, and then you.

Tim Winders: 00:20:09

You began reading.

Tim Winders: 00:20:10

It sounds like you began consuming and gathering information.

Tim Winders: 00:20:14

At what point did you begin seeing that manifest?

Tim Winders: 00:20:18

Like you were in front of other people doing some things.

Tim Winders: 00:20:21

I'm sure you weren't in front of thousands immediately, but.

Tim Winders: 00:20:25

Progression.

Tim Winders: 00:20:26

Dr. John Demartini: When I was 18 years old, I was studying in a library

Tim Winders: 00:20:30

at this Wharton Junior College.

Tim Winders: 00:20:32

That's the only place I could get started back to school.

Tim Winders: 00:20:34

I couldn't go to a university.

Tim Winders: 00:20:35

I had to take a GED, high school equivalency test, to get in.

Tim Winders: 00:20:41

And I failed my first class in school and almost gave up.

Tim Winders: 00:20:46

And I remember crying because I got a 27.

Tim Winders: 00:20:50

Everybody else had 75 or higher and I got a 27 and I really was crying and I

Tim Winders: 00:20:55

was driving home and I said, All I could hear was my first grade teacher, what she

Tim Winders: 00:21:00

said to me, you'll never be able to read or write, never be able to communicate,

Tim Winders: 00:21:04

never amount to anything in life.

Tim Winders: 00:21:06

And I came home and I curl up in a fetal position underneath this Bible stand

Tim Winders: 00:21:13

that my mom had in the living room.

Tim Winders: 00:21:15

And she came home from shopping and she saw me crying and she said,

Tim Winders: 00:21:18

what happened son, what's wrong?

Tim Winders: 00:21:20

I said, I worked, I thought I was going to pass.

Tim Winders: 00:21:24

I got a 27.

Tim Winders: 00:21:26

I didn't even come close.

Tim Winders: 00:21:28

and, she looked at me and she got quiet for a second.

Tim Winders: 00:21:31

Then she put her hand on my shoulder and she said, son, whether you become a

Tim Winders: 00:21:34

great teacher and healer and philosopher and travel the world like you dream,

Tim Winders: 00:21:39

or whether you go back to Hawaii and ride giant waves or you return to the

Tim Winders: 00:21:44

streets and panhandle as a bum, which you've done, I just want to let you

Tim Winders: 00:21:48

know that your father and I are going to love you no matter what, just love you.

Tim Winders: 00:21:52

When she said that, my hand went into a fist.

Tim Winders: 00:21:57

I looked up and I saw that vision again.

Tim Winders: 00:22:01

The night I met Paul Bragg, I saw that vision.

Tim Winders: 00:22:05

And I said to myself, I'm going to amass this thing called

Tim Winders: 00:22:08

reading, studying, and learning.

Tim Winders: 00:22:10

I'm going to amass this thing called teaching and philosophy and healing.

Tim Winders: 00:22:14

And I'm going to do whatever it takes.

Tim Winders: 00:22:15

I'm going to travel whatever distance.

Tim Winders: 00:22:16

I'm going to pay whatever price to get my source of love across this planet.

Tim Winders: 00:22:20

I'm not going to let any human being stop me, not even myself, nothing.

Tim Winders: 00:22:24

It was a no turning back moment.

Tim Winders: 00:22:26

And I hugged my mom.

Tim Winders: 00:22:28

I went into my room.

Tim Winders: 00:22:28

I got a Funkin Wagnalls dictionary.

Tim Winders: 00:22:31

Cause you, if you bought 20 worth of food at Kroger, you got an extra volume

Tim Winders: 00:22:35

of an encyclopedia in a dictionary.

Tim Winders: 00:22:38

And I got this dictionary out and I made a commitment to memorize the dictionary.

Tim Winders: 00:22:42

And I did 30 words a day until that dictionary was in my head.

Tim Winders: 00:22:46

And that allowed me, and I started reading encyclopedia, eight complete

Tim Winders: 00:22:50

sets of encyclopedia, Americana, Britannica, and all those things,

Tim Winders: 00:22:54

popular science, book of knowledge.

Tim Winders: 00:22:57

I read eight of those just to grow my vocabulary.

Tim Winders: 00:23:01

So I would be able to catch up with everybody else.

Tim Winders: 00:23:05

And, then what about, I, when I was, I went to back to school

Tim Winders: 00:23:09

and now I'm starting to pass.

Tim Winders: 00:23:10

I really grew fast from that.

Tim Winders: 00:23:14

And then This lady found me in the library cause she saw me in the library every day.

Tim Winders: 00:23:18

And she came up to me and she says, can you teach me what you're doing?

Tim Winders: 00:23:20

And I was doing yoga at the time.

Tim Winders: 00:23:23

And so my first student, I taught a little yoga too.

Tim Winders: 00:23:28

The second student wanted me to teach a meditation.

Tim Winders: 00:23:31

Then 17 students came out and asked me to teach mathematics.

Tim Winders: 00:23:36

And that grew.

Tim Winders: 00:23:36

Then when I left that school and I went to the University of Houston, I

Tim Winders: 00:23:40

used to do my meditation and yoga out under the trees and people gathered.

Tim Winders: 00:23:44

And I'd have a hundred, 125, 150, 400 people.

Tim Winders: 00:23:48

every day under the trees unless it was raining.

Tim Winders: 00:23:51

And then we went to the cafeteria and they'd come there.

Tim Winders: 00:23:53

And I started having a following and a gathering starting at by age 20.

Tim Winders: 00:23:57

And then when I went to professional school, I had students every

Tim Winders: 00:24:01

single night I was teaching.

Tim Winders: 00:24:02

And I was teaching, I was going around the city and the state, and now

Tim Winders: 00:24:07

I've been to 194 countries speaking.

Tim Winders: 00:24:09

So I just never stopped, and I'm still going.

Tim Winders: 00:24:12

you moved into that role of teacher trainer, someone

Tim Winders: 00:24:16

who shares information very quickly.

Tim Winders: 00:24:19

There's one thing you said that I want to go back before we jump ahead to where

Tim Winders: 00:24:22

we are now and start getting into the Demartini method and things like that.

Tim Winders: 00:24:27

And I read somewhere, I don't know if it was a topic on one of, on your

Tim Winders: 00:24:31

podcast or something on your website, you were talking about the word love.

Tim Winders: 00:24:36

and this is I'll quote to quote Huey Lewis, the power of love.

Tim Winders: 00:24:40

I don't think that's the exact wording you used, but.

Tim Winders: 00:24:44

when you just said your mother told you that her and her father were going to

Tim Winders: 00:24:50

love you regardless, that's what popped in my head, literally the power of love.

Tim Winders: 00:24:56

And then I was taken back to, and I read some of it, I don't think I listened to

Tim Winders: 00:25:00

everything on your site, but you obviously talk about love and what a catalyst it is.

Tim Winders: 00:25:05

And obviously it's foundational to, a lot of world religions and,

Tim Winders: 00:25:09

thoughts of people with a creator and God, and, but this was parental.

Tim Winders: 00:25:14

Sounds like unconditional as we can be as humans.

Tim Winders: 00:25:17

Talk about that.

Tim Winders: 00:25:19

I'll again, Huey Lewis, the power of love, because I think you've recently

Tim Winders: 00:25:23

had that on some things you've done and, and how important it was for

Tim Winders: 00:25:27

you at that stage in that time.

Tim Winders: 00:25:29

Dr. John Demartini: Yeah, I don't think in any of the books that I've published,

Tim Winders: 00:25:34

there's a bosom to have love in it.

Tim Winders: 00:25:35

I think that's just a standard foundation.

Tim Winders: 00:25:38

I don't think of love as...

Tim Winders: 00:25:42

an infatuation where you have an impulse from your amygdala to seek

Tim Winders: 00:25:47

for procreative purposes only, not a lustful kind of infatuation.

Tim Winders: 00:25:53

I think of a love as the embracing of the complementation

Tim Winders: 00:25:58

of opposites that's in people.

Tim Winders: 00:26:00

if I go up to somebody and I say, you're always nice, you're never mean,

Tim Winders: 00:26:04

you're always kind, you're never cruel, you're always positive, never negative,

Tim Winders: 00:26:06

always peaceful, never wrathful.

Tim Winders: 00:26:08

Do you believe that?

Tim Winders: 00:26:09

They'll go, not exactly.

Tim Winders: 00:26:11

And they'll be intuitively led to remember things that

Tim Winders: 00:26:14

weren't that way, the opposite.

Tim Winders: 00:26:16

And I said, you're always mean, you're never nice, you're always

Tim Winders: 00:26:18

cruel, you're never kind, you're always negative, never positive.

Tim Winders: 00:26:20

They go, no, that's not it.

Tim Winders: 00:26:22

And then I say to them, sometimes you're nice, sometimes you're mean, sometimes

Tim Winders: 00:26:26

you're kind, sometimes you're cruel, sometimes you're positive, sometimes

Tim Winders: 00:26:28

negative, sometimes peaceful, ethical.

Tim Winders: 00:26:29

Do you believe that now?

Tim Winders: 00:26:30

And they'll go, yes.

Tim Winders: 00:26:32

So I believe that everybody has the pairs of opposites.

Tim Winders: 00:26:35

Whatever you perceive as a pair of opposites.

Tim Winders: 00:26:37

Wilhelm Wundt in 1895, who was the father of experimental psychology, said that

Tim Winders: 00:26:44

when you have simultaneous contrast, you have maximum potential and you have love.

Tim Winders: 00:26:51

So I'm a believer that love is a synthesis and synchronicity.

Tim Winders: 00:26:55

A simultaneity of all pairs of opposites.

Tim Winders: 00:26:59

So whatever you like about somebody, you're going to also get the other side.

Tim Winders: 00:27:03

If you're ready for, if you're mature in a marriage, you're going to be

Tim Winders: 00:27:06

able to take the and the dislike, the positive and the negative, the

Tim Winders: 00:27:09

kind and the cruel, the two sides.

Tim Winders: 00:27:12

When you're able to love both sides simultaneously,

Tim Winders: 00:27:15

Equally, you now have love.

Tim Winders: 00:27:17

And that means the things you like and dislike equally because you see the

Tim Winders: 00:27:21

things you like support you and keep you juvenile and dependent and impulsive.

Tim Winders: 00:27:27

And the things you dislike makes you precociously more

Tim Winders: 00:27:29

independent and more resourceful.

Tim Winders: 00:27:31

And you need a combination of those to maximally grow and develop.

Tim Winders: 00:27:35

And so those synthesis of those is where I define love as, so I define love as a

Tim Winders: 00:27:40

synthesis, synchronicity of all comparing opposites at all scales of existence

Tim Winders: 00:27:45

from the subatomic to the astronomic.

Tim Winders: 00:27:47

And that's the divine love that we could call it, the universal love, if you want

Tim Winders: 00:27:51

to call it that, because it's omnipresent.

Tim Winders: 00:27:53

It's at all scales.

Tim Winders: 00:27:54

It's in the subatomic particle and antiparticles and it's at the

Tim Winders: 00:27:57

astronomical, black holes and white dwarfs and, it's astronomical levels too.

Tim Winders: 00:28:03

And there's a conservation, a symmetry, an elegant symmetry and mathematical

Tim Winders: 00:28:07

conservation at all these scales.

Tim Winders: 00:28:10

And I'm a real lover of the science.

Tim Winders: 00:28:13

Of love.

Tim Winders: 00:28:14

Cause I really believe there's a science to it.

Tim Winders: 00:28:16

And I do my best to in that with the Demartini Method to ask a series

Tim Winders: 00:28:20

of questions, to make you conscious of what you're unconscious of.

Tim Winders: 00:28:24

So you can be fully conscious and embrace the love that's always present.

Tim Winders: 00:28:28

Cause we sometimes overlook the love that's present by holding onto fantasies

Tim Winders: 00:28:32

about how life's supposed to be and then honoring, not honoring the whole.

Tim Winders: 00:28:36

We're trying to get rid of half of it instead of honoring

Tim Winders: 00:28:38

the whole of what life is.

Tim Winders: 00:28:39

That'd be like being in a relationship with somebody and saying, I want you to

Tim Winders: 00:28:42

get rid of half of yourself and I just want this side, but I want to love you.

Tim Winders: 00:28:45

And I'll love you if you do that.

Tim Winders: 00:28:47

that's not real love.

Tim Winders: 00:28:48

That's a, an infatuation with a fantasy and avoidance of a nightmare, which is

Tim Winders: 00:28:52

an animal amygdala response, instead of a heart and higher brain functioning,

Tim Winders: 00:28:58

reasonable individual, which I think we all have the capacity to express.

Tim Winders: 00:29:02

Yeah, that's a great in depth conversation about a word that

Tim Winders: 00:29:09

I've always said is thrown around a little bit too frivolously in our culture

Tim Winders: 00:29:14

society because people love pizza.

Tim Winders: 00:29:20

They love a football team, they love, and you brought up a word mature early

Tim Winders: 00:29:26

on when you were having that, when you were discussing that just then, and

Tim Winders: 00:29:31

at times, maybe I'll ask it this way, where are we at culturally, because

Tim Winders: 00:29:36

at times I see things and I go, you know, I just don't think we're very

Tim Winders: 00:29:40

mature people to be able to have the conversations like we're, Attempting

Tim Winders: 00:29:46

to have right here, I think people are very immature, their feelings and

Tim Winders: 00:29:50

emotions driven, which I know you address that with some of the things you do.

Tim Winders: 00:29:55

and I guess the way I want to pose the question and then we'll start

Tim Winders: 00:29:58

sliding into some of the methods and some of the, the applications and all

Tim Winders: 00:30:01

that you can provide for us, where are we at as a society and a culture?

Tim Winders: 00:30:09

Because there are times and I want to share this.

Tim Winders: 00:30:11

This is a little bit transparent on my part.

Tim Winders: 00:30:14

I at times can be extremely optimistic about future,

Tim Winders: 00:30:19

spiritually, I have an eternal mindset, different things like that.

Tim Winders: 00:30:22

And then at times I can be extremely disappointed and

Tim Winders: 00:30:30

disheartened by things I see.

Tim Winders: 00:30:32

And I'm an executive coach.

Tim Winders: 00:30:33

I work with leaders and there's some things I work with

Tim Winders: 00:30:35

that are extremely positive.

Tim Winders: 00:30:37

And then some things that are extremely challenging.

Tim Winders: 00:30:40

Just respond, where are we at culturally?

Tim Winders: 00:30:44

Are we doing, yay, great, thumbs up, we're a 10 out of 10, or ooh, we got

Tim Winders: 00:30:48

problems, or somewhere in between.

Tim Winders: 00:30:52

Dr. John Demartini: it fluctuates.

Tim Winders: 00:30:54

And I think that we're temporarily.

Tim Winders: 00:30:57

fling in our amygdala right now, highly polarized.

Tim Winders: 00:31:01

And, if I look at myself, 39 years ago, I did an experiment.

Tim Winders: 00:31:08

I noticed that whatever I was saying to somebody was also for me.

Tim Winders: 00:31:13

I noticed whatever I was saying about somebody was also a reflection of me.

Tim Winders: 00:31:18

And instead of waiting for people to push my buttons, I decided to do a preemptive

Tim Winders: 00:31:21

strike and to look in a dictionary.

Tim Winders: 00:31:24

I got the Oxford English Dictionary, it was the biggest dictionary I could find.

Tim Winders: 00:31:28

And, Went through and underlined every word that described

Tim Winders: 00:31:32

a human behavioral trait.

Tim Winders: 00:31:34

Because that's my real specialty, if you want to call it a specialty.

Tim Winders: 00:31:37

And I found 4, 628 traits.

Tim Winders: 00:31:40

I itemized them out.

Tim Winders: 00:31:42

There was a guy named Gordon Alport that did something similar.

Tim Winders: 00:31:44

He found a thousand, but there's probably some more words since he had done that.

Tim Winders: 00:31:49

And then what I did is I went out to the side of where that word was.

Tim Winders: 00:31:52

And I wrote out, who do I know that expresses that

Tim Winders: 00:31:55

trait to the greatest degree?

Tim Winders: 00:31:58

Just put a little initial there that I knew of.

Tim Winders: 00:32:02

And then I went into my life and I said, all right, John, where and

Tim Winders: 00:32:04

when, Do I perceive myself displaying or demonstrating that particular

Tim Winders: 00:32:09

trait, that action or that inaction, and keep identifying where it was,

Tim Winders: 00:32:15

who is it to, and who perceived me that way until I could own that I

Tim Winders: 00:32:18

had it as much as I saw in these individuals that were the most extreme.

Tim Winders: 00:32:23

And I realized that I had all 4, 628 traits.

Tim Winders: 00:32:26

I was nice and mean and kind and cruel and positive and negative and peaceful

Tim Winders: 00:32:29

and wrathful and considerate and inconsiderate and honest and dishonest.

Tim Winders: 00:32:32

And I had every one of those traits in my own way of expressing it.

Tim Winders: 00:32:37

Not the way everybody else does because they have a unique set

Tim Winders: 00:32:39

of values filtering how they do it, but I'm doing the behavior.

Tim Winders: 00:32:44

And that made me realize that the buttons we have in life that we react

Tim Winders: 00:32:48

to people with seeking or avoiding or admiration or despise are nothing

Tim Winders: 00:32:52

more than the disowned parts of ourselves that they're reminding us of.

Tim Winders: 00:32:55

That we're too proud or too humble to admit that we see in them,

Tim Winders: 00:32:59

but we don't, we're too proud and humble to admit that we have it.

Tim Winders: 00:33:02

So I didn't want to wait to have to go through the learning process and have the

Tim Winders: 00:33:05

wisdom of the ages with the aging process.

Tim Winders: 00:33:07

I want to go dig deeper and find out where I already had those.

Tim Winders: 00:33:11

And that was enormously resourceful because it calmed down a lot of my

Tim Winders: 00:33:17

impulsive subjective bias and judgments on people and putting people on pedestals or

Tim Winders: 00:33:23

pits instead of putting them in my heart.

Tim Winders: 00:33:26

And I just realized they're just human beings and they're all worth

Tim Winders: 00:33:29

putting in my heart, but none of them are worth putting on pedals or fits.

Tim Winders: 00:33:33

I learned that.

Tim Winders: 00:33:34

And I met some really amazing people.

Tim Winders: 00:33:35

I met 9, 000 world celebrities.

Tim Winders: 00:33:38

and I, some of them, you think, Oh, these are amazing.

Tim Winders: 00:33:40

They're just human beings.

Tim Winders: 00:33:42

And there's nothing they've got that we don't have.

Tim Winders: 00:33:44

I teach people how to own the traits of the greats.

Tim Winders: 00:33:47

Take people that you think are heroes and villains and find out

Tim Winders: 00:33:49

where you have all that in you.

Tim Winders: 00:33:51

And the moment you do, instead of judging them, They're only reminding you of

Tim Winders: 00:33:55

the things you haven't loved in you.

Tim Winders: 00:33:56

I think it was in Romans 2.

Tim Winders: 00:33:58

1, it has a statement in there, be beware of judging because what you judge is you.

Tim Winders: 00:34:05

And that's true.

Tim Winders: 00:34:05

I found that to be true.

Tim Winders: 00:34:06

We only resent things in other people that remind us of something we feel

Tim Winders: 00:34:09

ashamed of and we're dissociated from it by being addicted to pride to cover it.

Tim Winders: 00:34:14

And when they were reminding it by these people, they're pushing our

Tim Winders: 00:34:16

buttons and they're trying to teach us how to go back and love that part.

Tim Winders: 00:34:21

And they're our teacher, not our enemy.

Tim Winders: 00:34:23

And the same thing for the admired part.

Tim Winders: 00:34:24

We're just too humble to admit it, but we have that trait too.

Tim Winders: 00:34:27

Nothing's missing in us.

Tim Winders: 00:34:28

I've said at the level of the soul, which is the state of unconditional

Tim Winders: 00:34:31

love, nothing's missing in us.

Tim Winders: 00:34:33

At the level of our senses, things appear to be missing in us.

Tim Winders: 00:34:36

And the things that appear to be missing in us are all the things we're

Tim Winders: 00:34:38

too proud or too humble to admit that we have, that we see in other people.

Tim Winders: 00:34:43

And so reflective awareness is the key to intimacy and true love.

Tim Winders: 00:34:47

We realize that the seer, the seeing and the seen is the same, whatever

Tim Winders: 00:34:50

you perceive in others, you have.

Tim Winders: 00:34:52

Now you can actually love that individual because you're not

Tim Winders: 00:34:55

putting them above you or below you.

Tim Winders: 00:34:56

They're not on pedestals or pits, they're in your heart.

Tim Winders: 00:34:59

And that love, is profoundly impactful and helps transform

Tim Winders: 00:35:04

relationships, transform business.

Tim Winders: 00:35:07

See, if you're too proud, you go into narcissism, you try to get something

Tim Winders: 00:35:10

for nothing, which is non sustainable.

Tim Winders: 00:35:12

And if you minimize yourself and put them on a pedestal and you disown

Tim Winders: 00:35:15

that, you try to sacrifice for others.

Tim Winders: 00:35:18

But if you have sustainable fair exchange by having equanimity within

Tim Winders: 00:35:21

yourself and equity between yourself and others, you now have the love that

Tim Winders: 00:35:25

actually maximizes human potential.

Tim Winders: 00:35:28

And when you're looking down on people, you're trying to change

Tim Winders: 00:35:31

them into you, which is futile.

Tim Winders: 00:35:33

When you're looking up at people, you're trying to change

Tim Winders: 00:35:34

you into them, which is futile.

Tim Winders: 00:35:36

Instead of being you and allowing them to be them, you have futility.

Tim Winders: 00:35:40

And that's when your will is now not matching what has been called in

Tim Winders: 00:35:44

theology is divine will, the way it is.

Tim Winders: 00:35:46

And you're now fighting the universe.

Tim Winders: 00:35:49

But when you actually love and have equanimity, there's no fight.

Tim Winders: 00:35:52

And now you're in the flow, you're in the zone, you're in the, you're

Tim Winders: 00:35:55

in a state of grace on life and you're appreciative of life.

Tim Winders: 00:35:58

And I'm interested in helping people maximize that.

Tim Winders: 00:36:01

where they match and they empower themselves in their body.

Tim Winders: 00:36:06

I could go for hours on how that affects physiology and epigenetics

Tim Winders: 00:36:09

and autonomic regulation.

Tim Winders: 00:36:12

and, it does amazing things in business development.

Tim Winders: 00:36:15

It does amazing things in financial development, cause you can't manage money

Tim Winders: 00:36:18

if you've got emotions all over the place.

Tim Winders: 00:36:20

You can manage it when you're objective and strategic and you care and serve

Tim Winders: 00:36:24

people with sustainable fair exchange.

Tim Winders: 00:36:26

You build businesses and build wealth that way.

Tim Winders: 00:36:28

All areas of life are enhanced through love.

Tim Winders: 00:36:31

So that's why I'm, I can go for weeks, nonstop, on the significance of what love

Tim Winders: 00:36:37

really represents in human consciousness.

Tim Winders: 00:36:40

Something that I really, all of that was extremely powerful, but

Tim Winders: 00:36:47

you brought up judging, and I'll even use a more common word, which is judgment.

Tim Winders: 00:36:51

Let's just call it comparison.

Tim Winders: 00:36:53

You're judging or comparing yourself to others.

Tim Winders: 00:36:56

And, one of the more powerful statements that I think we repeat that Jesus

Tim Winders: 00:37:01

use was judge not lest ye be judged.

Tim Winders: 00:37:04

And we say that we throw it around in church world.

Tim Winders: 00:37:07

It's thrown around all the time, but I don't know that people grasp it.

Tim Winders: 00:37:10

I think with our social media and things like that, it is way too

Tim Winders: 00:37:14

easy to compare ourselves to others.

Tim Winders: 00:37:16

And you brought it up.

Tim Winders: 00:37:17

There's some people.

Tim Winders: 00:37:19

That compare themselves and see themselves as less.

Tim Winders: 00:37:23

Some people compare themselves as, see themselves as more than others.

Tim Winders: 00:37:27

and I love the thought of even, it's another word that we've messed up

Tim Winders: 00:37:31

in our culture, which is equality.

Tim Winders: 00:37:33

we are as equals as creation.

Tim Winders: 00:37:35

And I love that you said all of these, I think, characteristics

Tim Winders: 00:37:39

are really in all of us, the way we're built and formed and created.

Tim Winders: 00:37:45

And so I guess my question related to that is, how do we, first of all, break

Tim Winders: 00:37:53

away from that situation of judging or comparison to get in a mode of focusing

Tim Winders: 00:37:58

on self and see, this is where a lot of people get uncomfortable when we start

Tim Winders: 00:38:02

getting into, religion on us, because you're not supposed to focus on yourself.

Tim Winders: 00:38:06

how do we look at ourselves enough for that?

Tim Winders: 00:38:09

To start applying the methods, you're about to share some things that,

Tim Winders: 00:38:12

that will be helpful for us so that we could then get in the mindset of

Tim Winders: 00:38:16

wanting to learn some of these things.

Tim Winders: 00:38:17

Because some people don't even want to go down the path.

Tim Winders: 00:38:20

I think they wouldn't be here at the 40th minute mark of the podcast

Tim Winders: 00:38:24

if they weren't in that mode.

Tim Winders: 00:38:27

But let's just pretend that people are not even getting over that

Tim Winders: 00:38:30

hump to even want to go further.

Tim Winders: 00:38:33

Farther to really, uncover some of these things.

Tim Winders: 00:38:36

What are some things related to that?

Tim Winders: 00:38:38

And then let's start diving into some things that you want to

Tim Winders: 00:38:41

teach us that we need to know.

Tim Winders: 00:38:44

Dr. John Demartini: anytime we're too proud or too humble to

Tim Winders: 00:38:48

admit that we have what we see in others, we have disowned parts.

Tim Winders: 00:38:55

Now I've taken personally over 150, 000 people through my method And I

Tim Winders: 00:39:00

have 7, 000 facilitators and I've taken thousands of people through.

Tim Winders: 00:39:03

So it's millions now of helping people realize that whatever you see in others

Tim Winders: 00:39:09

is you, which is a biblical statement.

Tim Winders: 00:39:11

And it goes even before biblical writings.

Tim Winders: 00:39:13

it's a very ancient Sumerian and Egyptian and Greek, and

Tim Winders: 00:39:16

it goes all the way through.

Tim Winders: 00:39:17

We can find references to it everywhere.

Tim Winders: 00:39:20

So we ask the question, what specific trait, action or inaction, do I

Tim Winders: 00:39:24

perceive this individual displaying or demonstrating that I admire

Tim Winders: 00:39:27

most or I might despise most, that I've got on a pedestal or a pit?

Tim Winders: 00:39:31

And then once I identify what that trait, action, or interaction, and then ask,

Tim Winders: 00:39:36

okay, go to a moment, me, myself, where and when I display that same benefit.

Tim Winders: 00:39:42

Or that same trait that I admire or despise, the same,

Tim Winders: 00:39:47

where do I do the same action?

Tim Winders: 00:39:48

I do the same, just like in Romans says.

Tim Winders: 00:39:51

then once you go and honestly answer that, and people are too proud to admit

Tim Winders: 00:39:56

they have that or too humble to admit they have that sometimes, cause when

Tim Winders: 00:39:59

they're looking down, they're too proud.

Tim Winders: 00:40:00

If they're looking up, they're too humble.

Tim Winders: 00:40:02

But when they actually go and discover that it brings tears to their eyes

Tim Winders: 00:40:06

because they've been repressing their awareness in the unconscious and storing

Tim Winders: 00:40:10

that imbalance in their subconscious.

Tim Winders: 00:40:13

And it feels empty.

Tim Winders: 00:40:14

Every time you disown a part that you see in others, you feel empty.

Tim Winders: 00:40:18

All judgment leaves you feeling empty.

Tim Winders: 00:40:20

You cannot feel fulfilled with judgment, but love when you embrace

Tim Winders: 00:40:24

both sides simultaneously is fulfilling.

Tim Winders: 00:40:29

The Gnostics in the second century called it pleroma,

Tim Winders: 00:40:31

fullness, and kenoma, emptiness.

Tim Winders: 00:40:35

And the second we identify where we do that to the same degree, quantitatively,

Tim Winders: 00:40:39

qualitatively, and then go in there and find out the trait we think is small.

Tim Winders: 00:40:46

Many of the things we think is terrible a day, a week, a month, a year, or

Tim Winders: 00:40:49

five years later, we go look back and go, thank God that happened.

Tim Winders: 00:40:52

And some of the things we think are terrific, like that new house or

Tim Winders: 00:40:55

whatever, that new car or whatever, Days, weeks, months, years, labor, that

Tim Winders: 00:40:59

freaking house, we find the downsides to.

Tim Winders: 00:41:03

So why have the wisdom of the ages with the aging process?

Tim Winders: 00:41:06

Why not have the wisdom of the ages without it by looking

Tim Winders: 00:41:08

for both sides simultaneously and becoming present with it?

Tim Winders: 00:41:13

Because otherwise it's going to activate an impulse in your amygdala or an instinct

Tim Winders: 00:41:17

in your amygdala to seek or avoid and the external world extrinsically runs you.

Tim Winders: 00:41:22

Instead of you running you, the core of you is love.

Tim Winders: 00:41:27

If you're a Christian, that's what Christ is about, right there,

Tim Winders: 00:41:31

that, not the judgment, that.

Tim Winders: 00:41:35

The reflective awareness, pure reflective awareness is true

Tim Winders: 00:41:38

intimacy and where human will matches divine will, where the paradox of

Tim Winders: 00:41:43

predestination and free will join.

Tim Winders: 00:41:45

Cause now you realize there's nothing to change in me relative to others.

Tim Winders: 00:41:48

There's nothing to change in others relative to me.

Tim Winders: 00:41:50

I have nothing to fix.

Tim Winders: 00:41:52

Nothing's out of order.

Tim Winders: 00:41:54

I'm now aware of the divine magnificence.

Tim Winders: 00:41:56

I'm seeing the order of the universe at that moment.

Tim Winders: 00:41:59

And that place is grace and it brings tears of inspiration.

Tim Winders: 00:42:04

And what's interesting is when we get supported by people, we admire

Tim Winders: 00:42:07

our parasympathetic goes online.

Tim Winders: 00:42:09

When we get challenged with fight or flight, our sympathetic goes online.

Tim Winders: 00:42:12

But when they come into perfect balance, we get an autonomic regulation.

Tim Winders: 00:42:17

We get a heart rate variability that maximizes.

Tim Winders: 00:42:20

We have no fear of losing something, no fear of gaining anything.

Tim Winders: 00:42:23

We're not in philias and phobias.

Tim Winders: 00:42:25

We're in the present.

Tim Winders: 00:42:27

And in that state, there's a synchronicity in the brain between

Tim Winders: 00:42:31

the beta waves and the Delta waves.

Tim Winders: 00:42:34

And there's a gamma synchronicity and there's a whole brain function.

Tim Winders: 00:42:39

The heart opens.

Tim Winders: 00:42:40

And that is real physiology.

Tim Winders: 00:42:42

I can demonstrate that, reproduce that, guarantee that action.

Tim Winders: 00:42:45

And by holding people accountable, by asking quality questions, which

Tim Winders: 00:42:49

is what the Demartini Method's about, to asking quality questions that

Tim Winders: 00:42:53

equilibrate the mind and liberate them from the emotional entanglement of the

Tim Winders: 00:42:57

infatuation, resentments of judgments that they've got people in pedestal pits

Tim Winders: 00:43:02

that are holding them back from doing something extraordinary in their lives.

Tim Winders: 00:43:05

So I believe that's what.

Tim Winders: 00:43:07

From a Christian perspective, and I think that's what Christ

Tim Winders: 00:43:09

was trying to say, is that love, that form of love, is liberating.

Tim Winders: 00:43:14

And that's the one that is being represented.

Tim Winders: 00:43:16

We have all kinds of different throwing around the word love, but that's

Tim Winders: 00:43:19

the love that I'm talking about.

Tim Winders: 00:43:21

that right there is something.

Tim Winders: 00:43:23

And probably the only time we have that is when we're zero to one years old.

Tim Winders: 00:43:28

We can pee, we can poo, we can, bite and chew and throw things that

Tim Winders: 00:43:32

first year until they stand up.

Tim Winders: 00:43:34

Once they stand up, no.

Tim Winders: 00:43:35

Yes.

Tim Winders: 00:43:35

Yes.

Tim Winders: 00:43:35

Now all the moral hypocrisies that we trap ourselves and other

Tim Winders: 00:43:39

people with start to pick up.

Tim Winders: 00:43:41

But right before that, we have an unconditional love, and that child

Tim Winders: 00:43:44

gets that maybe the first year.

Tim Winders: 00:43:46

Most of the time it picks up all kind of judgments after that, and has to work its

Tim Winders: 00:43:49

way, as Kohlberg says, we have to work our way eventually into our midlife crisis

Tim Winders: 00:43:54

before we finally reach the point where we no longer, and we've transcended all

Tim Winders: 00:43:58

the people's judgments that are blocking us from being able to love people.

Tim Winders: 00:44:01

the

Tim Winders: 00:44:02

Yeah, I absolutely agree with that.

Tim Winders: 00:44:04

I'm a grandfather and I've got a three year old and a one year old and there

Tim Winders: 00:44:08

is something that comes over me when I interact with those girls or both girls.

Tim Winders: 00:44:15

and I'm in agreement with you.

Tim Winders: 00:44:17

There is something that, if I'm doing business with you and all

Tim Winders: 00:44:21

that, we may have some, back and forth and all that, but with them.

Tim Winders: 00:44:25

unconditional, there is nothing that they can do wrong.

Tim Winders: 00:44:30

And it's fascinating.

Tim Winders: 00:44:32

What I'd love to do here, there are leaders listening in.

Tim Winders: 00:44:38

There are people that run businesses, there's people that

Tim Winders: 00:44:39

run ministries and people that are associated with those things.

Tim Winders: 00:44:43

And the Demartini method, I know has, there's a lot to it.

Tim Winders: 00:44:48

And so we Probably have 10 minutes ish or so.

Tim Winders: 00:44:53

I would love for us, and I hope this isn't tough.

Tim Winders: 00:44:56

If it's not doable, let me know.

Tim Winders: 00:44:58

I'd love for us to do somewhat of an introduction so that people can get a

Tim Winders: 00:45:04

grasp of what they're talking about.

Tim Winders: 00:45:06

And then we'll finish up with how they can get more info.

Tim Winders: 00:45:09

Cause I know you've got lots of books, trainings, different things like that.

Tim Winders: 00:45:12

So is that possible and doable here?

Tim Winders: 00:45:15

Because what I'd love to do, I think we have.

Tim Winders: 00:45:17

Tilled the soil and given story and all enough so that people that are

Tim Winders: 00:45:22

listening in are going to want to know, all right, I want a little bit

Tim Winders: 00:45:25

more, how can I get some more info?

Tim Winders: 00:45:28

So whichever direction you want to go, but I love, I'd love for us to get a little

Tim Winders: 00:45:32

bit more into the Demartini method so that people know a little bit about what they

Tim Winders: 00:45:37

might could find if they keep going after they listened in on this conversation.

Tim Winders: 00:45:43

Dr. John Demartini: Demartini Method started, it wasn't called that initially.

Tim Winders: 00:45:50

I, when I was 19 years old, 18 going on 19, my mom said, what

Tim Winders: 00:45:56

do you want for your birthday?

Tim Winders: 00:45:58

And for Christmas?

Tim Winders: 00:45:59

Cause I was born on Thanksgiving day.

Tim Winders: 00:46:01

I said, mom, I want the greatest teachings on the face of the earth by

Tim Winders: 00:46:04

the greatest writers who've ever lived around the world, from around the world.

Tim Winders: 00:46:08

She said, you sure you don't want a t shirt?

Tim Winders: 00:46:11

I said, no mom.

Tim Winders: 00:46:13

She contacted her brother, which was my uncle Ralph.

Tim Winders: 00:46:17

And he was a professor at MIT.

Tim Winders: 00:46:19

He was a physicist and chemist.

Tim Winders: 00:46:21

And he sent me Two giant six by six foot wooden crates of textbooks.

Tim Winders: 00:46:28

It was the best gift I probably ever had in my life, other than children, but

Tim Winders: 00:46:36

they were sent on a big flatbed truck.

Tim Winders: 00:46:39

And I went out on a crowbar, they put them on the ground and I'll open it with

Tim Winders: 00:46:42

a crowbar and filled my room with books.

Tim Winders: 00:46:44

One of the books was by Leibniz, the German philosopher,

Tim Winders: 00:46:49

Gottfried Wilhelm Leibniz.

Tim Winders: 00:46:50

The Discourse on Metaphysics.

Tim Winders: 00:46:53

And in that book at the very beginning, he said that there's a perfection in the

Tim Winders: 00:46:56

universe that few people ever get to see.

Tim Winders: 00:47:00

And no human being could improve upon it.

Tim Winders: 00:47:03

And Voltaire satired him with Candide and attacked him for that.

Tim Winders: 00:47:08

But Voltaire did not really understand what he was saying.

Tim Winders: 00:47:12

But Leibniz said that there's a higher order.

Tim Winders: 00:47:16

Bohm called it an implicate order, but there's a higher order there that we just

Tim Winders: 00:47:20

don't, our Wolfram, the mathematician called it computational boundaries.

Tim Winders: 00:47:28

We don't have the capacity to comprehend the hidden order that's

Tim Winders: 00:47:32

in the reality that we have.

Tim Winders: 00:47:34

And we go around and we judge something and have a random perspective,

Tim Winders: 00:47:38

which means missing information, according to Claude Shannon.

Tim Winders: 00:47:42

So I basically started out on a quest to find the hidden order.

Tim Winders: 00:47:51

Now, I'd also got a book from him from 1947, by the principles

Tim Winders: 00:47:55

of quantum mechanics by Paul Dirac, the Nobel prize winner.

Tim Winders: 00:47:59

Not an easy book to read when you first started learning to read, but

Tim Winders: 00:48:02

I got dictionaries out and I started taking every word I didn't understood.

Tim Winders: 00:48:05

I just started, kept reading it and using the dictionary.

Tim Winders: 00:48:08

But in there, he said for every particle, there's an antiparticle.

Tim Winders: 00:48:12

And if you join them together, you make light.

Tim Winders: 00:48:15

if you take light and put it in a bubble chamber, you can separate

Tim Winders: 00:48:17

the particle and antiparticles.

Tim Winders: 00:48:18

And I thought in my naivety, what an amazing metaphor.

Tim Winders: 00:48:22

If I was to take positive and negative emotions and I was to put them

Tim Winders: 00:48:25

together, could I make enlightenment?

Tim Winders: 00:48:27

Could I make love?

Tim Winders: 00:48:29

Cause to me, enlightenment and love are the same, love and light.

Tim Winders: 00:48:33

I think that's what they said in John in the new Testament, Christ was light.

Tim Winders: 00:48:38

There's a message there and it was love.

Tim Winders: 00:48:41

So that started me on a journey at age 18, going on 19, for the method.

Tim Winders: 00:48:49

And the method is been developing since for 50 years now.

Tim Winders: 00:48:55

And it is basically everything I can get my hands on in every field I can

Tim Winders: 00:48:59

get my hands on to try to compose.

Tim Winders: 00:49:02

a series of questions that make us conscious of what we're unconscious

Tim Winders: 00:49:09

of, so we can be fully conscious.

Tim Winders: 00:49:11

Because a fully conscious individual sees both sides simultaneously.

Tim Winders: 00:49:15

And the moment they do, they're graced.

Tim Winders: 00:49:18

And there's a reproducible state.

Tim Winders: 00:49:20

I can take anybody to a state where they're speechless with tears of

Tim Winders: 00:49:23

gratitude, where they see the hidden order and there's nothing except thank you, real

Tim Winders: 00:49:28

gratitude, not thank you superficially, but thank you for seeing both the

Tim Winders: 00:49:33

support, the challenge, the positive, the negative, both sides simultaneously.

Tim Winders: 00:49:37

I see it.

Tim Winders: 00:49:38

I see the way the universe is working for me now.

Tim Winders: 00:49:41

And so the method is a series of very concise questions to make you conscious

Tim Winders: 00:49:46

of information you've been overlooking and unconscious of, that is keeping you

Tim Winders: 00:49:50

in bondage emotionally with judgments and infatuation, resentments, and grief, and

Tim Winders: 00:49:55

all the stuff that baggage that people run their life by, because anything you

Tim Winders: 00:49:58

infatuate with or resent occupies space and time in your mind and runs you.

Tim Winders: 00:50:03

And so all that stuff, We have all of a sudden a clear consciousness where there's

Tim Winders: 00:50:07

nothing there except tears of grace.

Tim Winders: 00:50:09

And we see that perfection.

Tim Winders: 00:50:12

The method is designed to help people see the perfection of their

Tim Winders: 00:50:15

life so they can actually start to live from an authentic place.

Tim Winders: 00:50:20

If you exaggerate yourself, you're not authentic.

Tim Winders: 00:50:22

If you minimize yourself, you're not authentic.

Tim Winders: 00:50:24

It's only when you're being yourself that you're authentic.

Tim Winders: 00:50:26

And when you're authentic, That's when you're having the Holy Communion.

Tim Winders: 00:50:29

That's when you're actually present.

Tim Winders: 00:50:31

That's when I define it as the Christ consciousness.

Tim Winders: 00:50:34

That's when you really have it.

Tim Winders: 00:50:35

We can hypocritically go around and say, yeah, I'm a Christian or whatever.

Tim Winders: 00:50:39

But people, when they ask me if I'm a Christian, I said, only in that moment.

Tim Winders: 00:50:42

The rest of it's my hypocrisy.

Tim Winders: 00:50:44

In that moment, I'm a Christian.

Tim Winders: 00:50:46

The rest of it, I just talk, it's words, it's everything.

Tim Winders: 00:50:48

But in that moment, I am, I'm honoring that state.

Tim Winders: 00:50:52

In that state, that's what the method's for.

Tim Winders: 00:50:55

And that I can show unquestionably, how it empowers every of your life and your

Tim Winders: 00:51:01

mental capacity, how it affects the brain, your business, your finance, your

Tim Winders: 00:51:06

relationship, your social life, your physical health, and your inspiration.

Tim Winders: 00:51:10

All of those are empowered in that state.

Tim Winders: 00:51:13

And so that is my mission, to design methodologies and principles

Tim Winders: 00:51:18

that help people maximize that.

Tim Winders: 00:51:20

and I do that every day.

Tim Winders: 00:51:22

that's the method.

Tim Winders: 00:51:24

And I, there's, I, all the questions and there's lots of questions

Tim Winders: 00:51:27

in it, but they're very precise.

Tim Winders: 00:51:28

And I train people methodically.

Tim Winders: 00:51:30

I'm starting a training tomorrow, in fact, methodically on how to do that.

Tim Winders: 00:51:34

So we have people out there, thousands of them out there, helping

Tim Winders: 00:51:36

people around the world with it.

Tim Winders: 00:51:38

Is it done one on one or is it in group settings?

Tim Winders: 00:51:42

Dr. John Demartini: You can do a one on one or a group setting.

Tim Winders: 00:51:43

I did, I had 750 people in India on Zoom recently, where we were doing the method.

Tim Winders: 00:51:49

And was, imagine 750 people sitting there speechless with

Tim Winders: 00:51:55

tears and snot out of their nose.

Tim Winders: 00:51:57

I don't know how to describe it.

Tim Winders: 00:51:58

You're so grace that there's, you, there's no facade, just you, just

Tim Winders: 00:52:04

grace over something they swore they would never be able to love in life.

Tim Winders: 00:52:09

That's what we were able to do.

Tim Winders: 00:52:10

And that was 750.

Tim Winders: 00:52:11

I'm from India.

Tim Winders: 00:52:12

And we had a translator doing it.

Tim Winders: 00:52:14

So it still worked through translation.

Tim Winders: 00:52:16

and what's fascinating is that it sounds as if this cuts

Tim Winders: 00:52:19

across belief systems, structures, cultures, things like that.

Tim Winders: 00:52:24

One question related to what you were just bringing up that came to mind,

Tim Winders: 00:52:30

this might be a little bit of a negative slant, but do we have Are some of the

Tim Winders: 00:52:37

structures, the organizations that we have in our current society, culture,

Tim Winders: 00:52:43

are they inhibiting people from going to these places we've been talking about?

Tim Winders: 00:52:49

And, whatever structure you want to talk about, government, I think religions,

Tim Winders: 00:52:53

churches, some of the church structures, you would think we would be helping people

Tim Winders: 00:52:57

move along, but I can guarantee you, and I want to say this, With every fiber in

Tim Winders: 00:53:06

me that there are some of my Christian brothers and sisters that are listening

Tim Winders: 00:53:11

in and they're going to be quite offended with some of the language we're using.

Tim Winders: 00:53:17

I'm not because I can see how it lines up with my belief system.

Tim Winders: 00:53:22

But, and there are many church structures and all would say, whoa, yoga.

Tim Winders: 00:53:28

You know what I'm saying.

Tim Winders: 00:53:29

what are

Tim Winders: 00:53:30

Dr. John Demartini: Yoga just means union.

Tim Winders: 00:53:32

Yoga means union and religion.

Tim Winders: 00:53:34

Religion comes from ligation to suture together pairs of opposites.

Tim Winders: 00:53:39

They're the same thing.

Tim Winders: 00:53:40

There's no, there's people, I always say whatever we're not

Tim Winders: 00:53:43

up on, we can get it down on.

Tim Winders: 00:53:45

Whatever we're not knowledgeable about, the more knowledgeable we

Tim Winders: 00:53:49

have the more open we are to life.

Tim Winders: 00:53:51

right.

Tim Winders: 00:53:51

The bigger question is what all is out there that is keeping people, people,

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we know they don't ask questions.

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We talked earlier about maturity.

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We talked about, consciousness and love, and I love that you brought grace into

Tim Winders: 00:54:04

the conversation, but it, there are a lot of things working against that.

Tim Winders: 00:54:12

And government structures and all that.

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what is your biggest, what's your biggest hurdle in interacting with people?

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what are you attempting to overcome?

Tim Winders: 00:54:18

Dr. John Demartini: let me.

Tim Winders: 00:54:20

Let me see if I can put it into a context.

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When you're a young boy or girl, and you're in elementary school,

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you probably have a science class.

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And in the front of the class, in the science class, you'll see an atom,

Tim Winders: 00:54:35

hydrogen, then helium, and then lithium, and then beryllium, and then boron and

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carbon and nitrogen, oxygen, all the way up to iron, and all the way up to uranium.

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And each will get a little larger.

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And you'll, in elementary school, swear that an atom is a little ball, a sphere.

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And so you have little stick pictures with little red balls

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and white balls and blue balls.

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You make little models out of it.

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And you're in your world, you believe that's what an atom is, a little sphere.

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Then you go to high school and then you get the Bohr model and you find out, no,

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it's a little solar system looking thing.

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It's got a proton and a neutron and then it's got electrons going around it.

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And it's like a solar system.

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So it makes orbitals and spheres, And so you think, okay, it's a little bit more

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abstract than the original idea, but I'm ready for that abstraction because

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I had to take that first abstraction.

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And then you go to, from high school to college, and then you

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get introduced, wait a minute now, it's not exactly the Bohr model.

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It's not exactly an orbital.

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It's a probability distribution based on complex mathematics, which is a square

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root of negative one times real numbers.

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And it's basically a Schrodinger equation on the probability of where

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that possible electron might be and where these protons and neutrons which

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are made of mesons and quarks and things are made out of and gluons.

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So now you realize, wait a minute now, I was taught something

Tim Winders: 00:55:59

here and it's not exactly that.

Tim Winders: 00:56:01

I was taught something here.

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It's not exactly that.

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And then you find out, you go towards your PhD and you find out.

Tim Winders: 00:56:07

the probability distribution is based on a point of infinite, infinitesimal

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point called an electron, which has an infinite energy potential

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with photons radiating off it.

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And that has to be renormalized to make it work mathematically.

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So it's a level of abstraction that goes a little further.

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And then you realize that, we really don't know.

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It's this murky field of vibration that's something that we're living

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at the cornerstone of the mystery of.

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But I had to teach them the illusion to the ready for truth.

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And so every level of religious instruction is a different grade in

Tim Winders: 00:56:46

our level of abstraction until we can finally comprehend, if we can comprehend,

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because our computation capacity is, the real divine magnificence.

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So each of them are stumbling blocks.

Tim Winders: 00:56:59

But also stepping stones.

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They're stepping stones, but stumbling blocks.

Tim Winders: 00:57:04

If you've transcended it, you'll see it as Well, that's not exactly true.

Tim Winders: 00:57:08

That's BS.

Tim Winders: 00:57:09

That's an institutional thing that people get attached to.

Tim Winders: 00:57:12

But at the same time, it was a necessary step.

Tim Winders: 00:57:16

As the, in Buddhism, there was an old saying that says, I will teach them the

Tim Winders: 00:57:19

illusion until they're ready for truth.

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Because if you hit them with the truth too much, it's too abstract.

Tim Winders: 00:57:23

And they go to PhD levels, they can't do that from kindergarten.

Tim Winders: 00:57:26

So I have to teach them in layers.

Tim Winders: 00:57:28

And so I think even in the book of Revelation, There was a mentioning

Tim Winders: 00:57:33

of seven churches, and in the book of revolution it says I have this against

Tim Winders: 00:57:36

thee, I have this against thee, you call yourself Christians, but there

Tim Winders: 00:57:39

are these things that you're lukewarm about, and so in the process of doing

Tim Winders: 00:57:44

it, they're gradations of Christianity.

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Or gradations of religious instruction.

Tim Winders: 00:57:51

In William James book, The Variety of Religious Experiences, it talked

Tim Winders: 00:57:54

about those stages and we build layers upon layers, just like our brain.

Tim Winders: 00:57:58

we have religious understanding of the amygdala, which is black

Tim Winders: 00:58:01

and white and punished and reward.

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And we have higher levels where it's just love.

Tim Winders: 00:58:05

And so different people resonate with different stages.

Tim Winders: 00:58:09

So I don't want to say it's actually interfering.

Tim Winders: 00:58:11

I don't want to say that it's helping.

Tim Winders: 00:58:13

It's both.

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It's depending on where you are.

Tim Winders: 00:58:15

If you're below it, it's helping.

Tim Winders: 00:58:16

If you're beyond it, it seems like it's holding you back.

Tim Winders: 00:58:20

It's just a stage of awareness, all teaching people based on

Tim Winders: 00:58:24

people's levels of awareness of that magnificence of our universe.

Tim Winders: 00:58:29

And part of it's the journey.

Tim Winders: 00:58:30

I think I saw some things that you wrote about.

Tim Winders: 00:58:33

this is a journey that we're on.

Tim Winders: 00:58:34

And that journey is hopefully for people about discovery and moving to that place

Tim Winders: 00:58:41

of understanding more about some of the concepts that we've discussed here.

Tim Winders: 00:58:46

I do want to ask.

Tim Winders: 00:58:50

For how people can really connect with you.

Tim Winders: 00:58:52

How can they go a little bit deeper, but I want it.

Tim Winders: 00:58:55

I want to ask it in two ways.

Tim Winders: 00:58:58

Let's just say someone has been a bit intimidated by some of this conversation.

Tim Winders: 00:59:05

There were some names mentioned.

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There were some concepts mentioned that might be a little bit beyond

Tim Winders: 00:59:12

the level that they can comprehend.

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So I want you to tell people where to go.

Tim Winders: 00:59:17

If they want to start at a simple stage.

Tim Winders: 00:59:21

And then the second thing is if someone has been with us, they have

Tim Winders: 00:59:25

known most of what you brought up.

Tim Winders: 00:59:27

It's been, wow.

Tim Winders: 00:59:29

Okay.

Tim Winders: 00:59:29

I want to know how to go a bit deeper.

Tim Winders: 00:59:33

Tell me some resources, books, something we'll try to

Tim Winders: 00:59:35

include all that in the notes.

Tim Winders: 00:59:37

But where can people go if they're in one of those?

Tim Winders: 00:59:40

Two categories or both those categories,

Tim Winders: 00:59:44

Dr. John Demartini: I have classes that are for each of those layers.

Tim Winders: 00:59:48

If I'm going on, if I'm going on major television networks, CNN or

Tim Winders: 00:59:52

something like that, I have one message.

Tim Winders: 00:59:55

Cause you can't go into the deeps of quantum mechanics on there very easily

Tim Winders: 00:59:59

without having to water it down a bit.

Tim Winders: 01:00:02

If I'm speaking to, university on physics or something like

Tim Winders: 01:00:05

that, I'd go to a deeper level.

Tim Winders: 01:00:07

So on my website, all that's there.

Tim Winders: 01:00:10

So people can just You know, go through and if they were to go to the media

Tim Winders: 01:00:14

section, for instance, there are probably 9, 000 radio, television,

Tim Winders: 01:00:18

newspapers, magazines, articles, blogs that they can play with.

Tim Winders: 01:00:22

All there, it's free.

Tim Winders: 01:00:23

It's just right there.

Tim Winders: 01:00:25

They can do it.

Tim Winders: 01:00:26

They can watch YouTubes, hours and hours of YouTube stuff and just find

Tim Winders: 01:00:30

the one that resonates with them.

Tim Winders: 01:00:31

Look at the topics that resonate with them and some that don't, I

Tim Winders: 01:00:34

don't try to, there's no way you're going to please everybody in life.

Tim Winders: 01:00:37

It's not possible.

Tim Winders: 01:00:38

So you, There's a spectrum of awareness out there and a

Tim Winders: 01:00:42

spectrum of values out there.

Tim Winders: 01:00:43

And many people get caught in the idea that my values are

Tim Winders: 01:00:47

right and your values are wrong.

Tim Winders: 01:00:48

And that's quite immature.

Tim Winders: 01:00:51

The whole spectrum of values are necessary.

Tim Winders: 01:00:54

You won't even marry somebody with your seven values.

Tim Winders: 01:00:56

You're going to find somebody you marry that's going to be doing

Tim Winders: 01:00:59

things that are, what's high on your values is low on theirs.

Tim Winders: 01:01:02

What's low on theirs, is high on yours, that kind of stuff.

Tim Winders: 01:01:04

Cause you're going to delegate stuff to them.

Tim Winders: 01:01:05

They're going to delegate stuff to you.

Tim Winders: 01:01:07

And that's how it's going to work.

Tim Winders: 01:01:08

You're never going to find somebody that's just like you, it'd be the twilight zone.

Tim Winders: 01:01:11

So there's a whole spectrum of values.

Tim Winders: 01:01:13

They're not right or wrong.

Tim Winders: 01:01:15

They're just humans.

Tim Winders: 01:01:16

If you can basically look inside yourself with a reflective awareness and find

Tim Winders: 01:01:20

out where you have everything they have in your own way and quit denying that,

Tim Winders: 01:01:25

You'll liberate yourself and love people.

Tim Winders: 01:01:27

And I think that's what the, that's what religion is about to me.

Tim Winders: 01:01:31

That's what it's all about to be able to love people and be grateful

Tim Winders: 01:01:34

for people and your life and this magnificent place we get to live in.

Tim Winders: 01:01:39

All the astronomy that we're doing, we're looking out, we're seeing planets

Tim Winders: 01:01:43

in the Goldilocks zone, we're seeing water on these planets, we're seeing all

Tim Winders: 01:01:46

these things, they're far distance away.

Tim Winders: 01:01:49

But right here on the earth, this is a magnificent place.

Tim Winders: 01:01:51

We got an amazing place to live.

Tim Winders: 01:01:53

And I think it's wise to be grateful.

Tim Winders: 01:01:56

I always say when you're grateful for what you have, you get more to be grateful for.

Tim Winders: 01:01:59

And I don't mean gratitude, if it supports your values.

Tim Winders: 01:02:02

gratitude, regardless of what happens.

Tim Winders: 01:02:05

That's another level of gratitude.

Tim Winders: 01:02:07

I would say that the quality of your life is based on the

Tim Winders: 01:02:09

quality of the questions you ask.

Tim Winders: 01:02:10

If you ask the question, how is, no matter what's happened to

Tim Winders: 01:02:12

me, how is it on my divine path?

Tim Winders: 01:02:14

How is it on my helping me fulfill my mission and be appreciative of it and

Tim Winders: 01:02:20

then use it resourcefully and then grow past the box that we trap ourselves in.

Tim Winders: 01:02:26

That's what the website will give you plenty of stuff to be working on.

Tim Winders: 01:02:30

You could be working on that, looking on that.

Tim Winders: 01:02:33

For a long time, there's plenty there, but just drdemartini.

Tim Winders: 01:02:36

com the website, drdemartini.Com.

Tim Winders: 01:02:39

I think you'll find my name.

Tim Winders: 01:02:40

If you look at my name, you'll find it.

Tim Winders: 01:02:42

I think you could search and find that plus there's a podcast and some

Tim Winders: 01:02:45

other great resources there We'll include

Tim Winders: 01:02:47

Dr. John Demartini: the Demartini show.

Tim Winders: 01:02:49

there's, plus there's lots of books and there's movies.

Tim Winders: 01:02:51

We've done 50 movies.

Tim Winders: 01:02:53

There's all kinds of stuff out there.

Tim Winders: 01:02:54

we'll include those in the notes.

Tim Winders: 01:02:56

I think it'll be a great resource for people we are Seek go create that's our

Tim Winders: 01:03:01

title those three words And i'm gonna ask you to choose one of those other the

Tim Winders: 01:03:06

other two just right now that resonates We're not going to get too, you know deep

Tim Winders: 01:03:09

here, but seek go or create which word do you choose and why it's my final question

Tim Winders: 01:03:15

Dr. John Demartini: I'll take seek because I think that we have innately a yearning

Tim Winders: 01:03:23

be, do, and have something extraordinary.

Tim Winders: 01:03:26

And we are seeking insights.

Tim Winders: 01:03:29

intuitively and through inspiration on how to maximize our contribution

Tim Winders: 01:03:34

of sustainable fair exchange with human beings on the planet.

Tim Winders: 01:03:37

So all you seek for them.

Tim Winders: 01:03:40

Excellent.

Tim Winders: 01:03:41

Dr.

Tim Winders: 01:03:41

John Demartini, thank you so much for this conversation.

Tim Winders: 01:03:45

I have enjoyed it much more than I thought I would, and I was looking forward to it.

Tim Winders: 01:03:50

so that says a lot.

Tim Winders: 01:03:51

I had high expectations and we exceeded that.

Tim Winders: 01:03:55

If you have listened in on this, either via YouTube or One of

Tim Winders: 01:03:58

our channels, podcast channels.

Tim Winders: 01:04:00

I'm going to ask you to share this episode.

Tim Winders: 01:04:02

People need to hear this message.

Tim Winders: 01:04:04

I think they need to access some of these resources training.

Tim Winders: 01:04:06

So please share this.

Tim Winders: 01:04:08

I would greatly appreciate it.

Tim Winders: 01:04:09

And I think we'll just help to get this message out.

Tim Winders: 01:04:12

So thank you for doing that.

Tim Winders: 01:04:14

We have new episodes every Monday until next time continue being

Tim Winders: 01:04:19

all that you were created to be.